Ischia + Caputo Rosso + Long Room Temp Rise

[WestCountry]

Ischia + Caputo Rosso + Long Room Temp Rise

Here are a couple pies I made with Caputo Rosso and Ischia yeast.

I based this dough and mixing on Bill/SFNM’s posts and his utube videos - which were a help to me. Thanks Bill.

The Ingredients:
387g Caputo Rosso 100% (purchased from LaCuisine)
236g Water 62%
1 tsp Kosher Salt 2.5% (I just used 1 tsp this time)
33g Ischia wild yeast (5% total dough weight, 46% water)
(1% bowl residue factor)

I combined ingredients (short autolyse) and mix for around 15 minutes in Kitchen Aid on speed #1, then rest 20 minutes, and finally knead for a minute or two by hand.
Bulk Ferment at room temp 65-70 degrees: 16 hours.
Divide & Proof at room temp ~70 degrees on covered red oak wooden board: 5 hours.

This produced 2 x 322g dough balls for approximately 12-inch pies.

For toppings, I used fresh mozzarella, a little provolone and a little Monterey jack with drained crushed Cento tomatoes for sauce.

PIE #1:
The first pie (first two photos) cooked in a 2Stone oven with bottom stone temp at about 900 degrees F.  The bottom had a lot of char at this heat. Good bubbles and puffy cornicione were present. Crust was a little leathery – I think I may have overcooked it (bake was around 2 minutes?) or perhaps didn’t ferment long enough (?)

PIE #2:
This second pie (second two photos) I cooked after dropping the bottom stone temp (to around 750-800), and turning up the heat to the top stone/ceiling while it was baking.  A little softer on the bottom and not as tough… overall, pretty good.  No sourness or tangy flavor was present in either crust.

I really liked the cheese combo – they did not burn and had good flavor. The Cento’s I like as well and was pleasantly surprised to find they do not use Citric acid as an ingredient. I have some good local (Denver area) sources now for 6in1, Pastene and Cento – all of which I enjoy.

I have also been getting good results with the above recipe using a flour blend of Caputo Pizzeria 80%, KABF 20%.

I’d like to try the San Felice flour, if anyone has a small bag and would like to trade for a 5-pound bag of Caputo Rosso, please PM me.

Thanks to all for the support and for such a great forum!

[Glutenboy]

Wow... 

[dzpiez]

Look's great WestCountry.  Never tried the Caputo Rosso, but I had good luck with Caputo Pizzeria and my 2Stone.

[JConk007]

Awesome West! I need to get going with the starter. NOW
JOhn

[josteh]

Very nice pizza indeed..
My first bag (25kg) of caputo pizzeria has just arrived.. I ordered it from nifeislife.com (excellent customer service!). Cant wait to start experimenting 

[djshwa]

Westcountry
I'm looking to try this technique out. I was wondering if you had any further advancements to improve the dough. It seems like you could use a little more fluff, or rise. Just wanted to see if anybody had any comments to help improve this recipe. All and all great post!

[WestCountry]

djshwa,
I used that recipe a lot for high heat cooking on my 2Stone Pizza Inferno oven. I would get a lot of puff and bubbles and rise (not sure how clear that is in the photos). Sometimes I would go to 5.5% on the Ischia yeast and get about the same results. I think a lot of variables could come into play depending on the temperature/length for fermentation & proof, the condition/type of yeast one is using, and the oven temperature. Feel free to send me a message if you have more questions.

I have not used the Ischia in a while, lately its all been IDY for me with a room temp fermentation/proof.

Thanks,
Chris

[Pete-zza]

I have not used the Ischia in a while

Chris,

Is there a reason for this?

Peter

[WestCountry]

Peter,

I'll start by saying, the Ischia worked WONDERFUL and I have only good things to say about that wild yeast and the results I had been achieving.

I stopped using it because now I am only making pizza about once per week and use of the IDY is a little faster/easier for me (maybe I am getting lazy!) , not that the Ischia was very hard to use - but it did take  more time (and flour) to manage than using IDY.

At some point, I may go back to the Ischia (or begin the Camaldoli I am sitting on), but right now I am going through a cycle of using small amount of IDY with long room temp rise (around 10-12 hours).

Chris

[Pete-zza]

Chris,

I posed the question because I know how difficult it can be to maintain a culture over long periods of time, especially if the use of the culture is only occasional and also if one insists on making many different styles of pizzas that do not call for natural starters/preferments and would be difficult to convert to use of such natural leavening systems. In your case, did you use the same dough formulation as you posted earlier in this thread but for the substitution of IDY for the natural starter/preferment? If so, did the finished pizzas look like the ones you posted, and how did they compare from the standpoint of taste?

Peter

[WestCountry]

Peter,

For my Caputo 00 (Pizzeria, or Rosso) High Heat pizza making, I would use the above recipe with 1/4 tsp IDY in place of the Ischia wild yeast, and let it rise for about 10 hours room temp. Or perhaps something in between 1/8-1/4 tsp, depending on the long room temp rise time and temperature, I go by feel. Lately I have been working from  a 'less yeast is better' opinion.

I notice two differences that stand out between the IDY and the Ischia:
1) The crust has a very subtle and slight tangy-ness to it with the Ischia. But my family and I really have to look for this else it will go unnoticed.
2) I get more burning on the bottom of the crust underneath with the IDY. I am not sure why, but it seems that the Ischia can handle the high temperature (900-1000 degrees F) much better than the IDY. I must be really careful in this regard with the IDY.

As far as appearances go and general texture of the pie - I can get about same results with each yeast type.

My family and I all love a crispier pie (we all love the high gluten flour over the 00 flours), so I bought a 50 lb bag of KASL from Dawn Foods (Denver) and have been enjoying this flour with lower heat kitchen oven (550 degree) pies where I obtain an awesome crispness, and occasional high heat pie (750 degrees) with the IDY and KASL combination.

Chris

[djshwa]

Well your pictures above got me excited about sourdough starters. Even though you now say there isn't much of a difference between Idy and the sourdough with the long room temp rise. I would like to see pics of your long room temp rise with the Idy.
Well I just started my journey into the sourdough world. Thanks guys for getting me excited to make pizzas. Peter I found some good threads on your pies with the long room rise with the sourdough.