NJ Boardwalk Pizza

[Chicago Bob]

Are Trenton pies cooked in a coal oven?
Is Wildflower's pizza the same people of the Boston Wildflower pizza's ?
Thanks.

[norma427]

Are Trenton pies cooked in a coal oven?
Is Wildflower's pizza the same people of the Boston Wildflower pizza's ?
Thanks.

Bob,

If you use the search function, you will see a lot about Trenton pies. There are different threads about them.  I have no idea what Wildflower's pizzas are.

Norma

[Pete-zza]

Are Trenton pies cooked in a coal oven?
Is Wildflower's pizza the same people of the Boston Wildflower pizza's ?

Bob,

I know what you are referring to. See http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,6907.0.html. There is a Wildflour Boston Pizza in California but I don't believe that they are related to the Wildflower's in NJ.

I don't have an answer for you on the coal-fired ovens.

Peter

[Chicago Bob]

Bob,

I know what you are referring to. See http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,6907.0.html. There is a Wildflour Boston Pizza in California but I don't believe that they are related to the Wildflower's in NJ.

I don't have an answer for you on the coal-fired ovens.

Peter

Yes, I was looking at another thread of petef's where he showed 3 different Trenton tomato pies and asked which one people preferred. One of the pies was a Wildflowers Inn - Pennington, NJ pizza. In Raleigh NC. here we have a Boston Wildflower pizza restaurant and their pizza looks very similar....I can't remember exactly but on their menu they give some big long story about the flour they us....the place seems like a chain/franchise deal so probably not the same as the NJ people. Pretty good pizza though....

[PowerWagonPete]

Funny how the talk is about cheese, did Mods break out parts of this thread many moons ago and put them into a NEW thread, "NJ Boardwalk Pizza--What Kind of Cheese?" instead of just having one ""NJ Boardwalk Pizza" thread? I can't wait to see if we'll be forced to have sequels to follow:

"NJ Boardwalk Pizza--What Kind of Dough?" getting put into the dough ingredients forum section(s)
"NJ Boardwalk Pizza--What Kind of Sauce?" getting put into the sauce ingredients forum section(s)
"NJ Boardwalk Pizza--What Kind of Herbs?" getting put into the forum section(s)
"NJ Boardwalk Pizza--What Kind of Oven?" getting put into the pizza ovens forum section(s)

Not to mention Papa Dino's and Trenton pies yet.  

Why is there a California style but not a Pennsylvania style?? Nor Detroit style?

ALL that want this thread and its separate(d) Cheese thread combined please raise your hand!

I tried, Mark...  LOL  

http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,20022.msg196706.html#msg196706  

[Chicago Bob]

We got first dibs.....
http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,20022.msg196762.html#msg196762

[scott123]

Are Trenton pies cooked in a coal oven?

It's possible that you might find a Trenton style place using a coal oven to bake pizza, and, if you look far enough back in time, back more than 60 years, you'll have places that used coal, but, since that time, Trenton style pies are traditionally baked on decks.

[Pete-zza]

Mark,

The way the forum's indexing system is set up, the Pizza Making boards are intended to be solely for discussing how to "make" pizzas, including recipes/formulations and related methods. They are not intended to cover subsidiary aspects like cheese, sauce, other ingredients, sourcing of ingredients (resources), restaurant reviews, etc. There are other boards and child boards for those aspects. If everthing directed to a particular style of pizza were to be put into one board, for example, the Neapolitan board or the NY style board, the board would become so large that it would be very difficult for members to find things by scanning the indexes for that style. They would have little choice but to use the forum's search engines.

As for particular pizza styles that are not now listed on the forum, it is not hits that dictates whether a particular style should have its own board. For example, as best I can tell, the only threads that talk about "making" Old Forge type pizzas are the ones at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,5656.0.html and http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,13048.0.html. Of course, the granddaddy Old Forge pizza thread is the one at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,1082.msg9655.html#msg9655. However, there is not a lot of detail in that thread about "making" Old Forge pizzas. But, even if there were, we would have too few threads to justify a separate category for the Old Forge style pizza under the pizza making boards. The same applies to the Detroit style of pizza you mentioned.

From time to time, as in this thread, I will carve out a subsidiary topic, like cheese, if it looks like the diversion will bog down the thread or deserves its own separate line of inquiry. It is usually a judgment call. It is possible to merge threads but sometimes that can harm the continuity of the merged thread or lead to confusion because the merging process interleaves the posts based on dates.

We occasionally will have members voice concerns about the way the forum is set up and run. This is not the first time the matter of how the forum is indexed or which pizza styles should be featured. My job as a Moderator is to "moderate" based on the instructions handed down by Steve, the owner and Administrator of the forum. If you have a case you would like to plead to him, you are free to contact him if you would like.

Peter

[Chicago Bob]

It's possible that you might find a Trenton style place using a coal oven to bake pizza, and, if you look far enough back in time, back more than 60 years, you'll have places that used coal, but, since that time, Trenton style pies are traditionally baked on decks.

Thanks Scott,
A couple years ago I saw a show on foodnetwork and can't get this one pizza out of my mind...it may have been in New Haven though? Anyway, it was a mom an pop joint and an old coal (I think) oven that they said was used for baking bread back in the day. The guy used a real long wood peel and applied oil out of a clear wine bottle just before putting the pizza in. Also, he put the sauce on the top of the pie using a large spoon.
They said that all their weekend pies were spoken for, having already been ordered earlier in the week. I could see why too..their pizza looked awesome man !  Had a good bit of char on it too and when the lady sliced the pizza it was like hearing a thing of beauty I tell ya. Anyone know the place I am talking about?

[norma427]

This post is because I am trying to go over all what I know about Mack’s pizza and also to see if I might have missed anything to try on my next attempt at a Mack‘s pizza. 

I don’t think these two videos were posted before here on the boardwalk thread of Jessie Pike tossing and twirling the dough at Mack’s and somewhere else.

The first video is of Jesse Pike opening a dough ball, then tossing a twirling the skin and then dressing the pizza at Mack’s.  I was especially watching this video to try and determine how much sauce and cheese is put on a Mack’s pizza.

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QmKTEknOhwc" target="_blank" class="aeva_link bbc_link new_win">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QmKTEknOhwc</a>

The second video is of Jesse Pike doing different stuff which I guess must be throw dough, but I am not sure if it is throw dough or real dough.

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ETa3nYZMsNU&amp;feature=channel&amp;list=UL" target="_blank" class="aeva_link bbc_link new_win">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ETa3nYZMsNU&amp;feature=channel&amp;list=UL</a>

I saw Jesse Pike at Mack’s pizza many times in the last 2 years.  I think I need for him to give me lessons on how to toss and twirl dough.  I don’t know how I missed these videos before either.

Can anyone guess how much sauce and cheese might be applied to the Mack’s pizza by Jesse?  I now see he doesn’t apply the sauce in a perfect spiral fashion like I have been trying to do.  It looks like the sauce is applied something like sauces for Trenton pies are applied (in that the sauce isn‘t spread on the pizza, but just place in-between the cheese).  To me it now looks like there is more sauce and cheese applied than I though before and the sauce does look a little thicker than what I have been recently using.  I also like the music in the first video.  I also don’t think I am applying the sauce and cheese to the edges of the rims enough either. 

This is also a video of Tony tossing the dough at Mack’s pizza.  I also don’t think this video was posted before on this thread either, but I could maybe not recall all the videos posted on this thread.  Tony had a hole in his dough skin though.  Tony looks like he opens the dough ball differently than Jesse.

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W7YG4VFJCIc" target="_blank" class="aeva_link bbc_link new_win">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=W7YG4VFJCIc</a>

This is another video showing how Nate applies the sauce and cheese at Mack’s. This video also shows a fair amount of sauce and cheese applied to Mack’s pizzas.

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pbyeStVlHTo" target="_blank" class="aeva_link bbc_link new_win">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pbyeStVlHTo</a>

and

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uMtO2W9a-YY" target="_blank" class="aeva_link bbc_link new_win">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uMtO2W9a-YY</a>

After watching these videos I really don’t see any flour on the peels either and very little bench flour is used also in the next video, which was posted before.  I also noted how flat the dough balls look in the trays.  I wonder why they don’t look fermented.

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bs4h5Gr_GKc&amp;playnext=1&amp;list=PL01966404FB81034B&amp;feature=results_main" target="_blank" class="aeva_link bbc_link new_win">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Bs4h5Gr_GKc&amp;playnext=1&amp;list=PL01966404FB81034B&amp;feature=results_main</a>

This is a pieman tossing the dough at Manco & Manco that I don’t think was posted before.  He was opening two skins at once, as can be seen when he takes them apart.

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vntU6-G_hiY" target="_blank" class="aeva_link bbc_link new_win">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vntU6-G_hiY</a>

This man also says Mack’s and Manco pizza is the best in the country.

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GZaGm6RT4i8" target="_blank" class="aeva_link bbc_link new_win">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=GZaGm6RT4i8</a>

  This video was posted on YouTube before the named was changed to Manco & Manco.

The one comment on these review is interesting to me.  It was from WildAboutWildwood.  It said the tangy cheese was the key.  I also wonder why from 2005 to 2009 this poster said that the pizza was bland then.

http://www.wildwoodpizzatour.com/macks-pizza/

To post again for anyone that didn’t know this before, this is some of the history of Mack’s pizza.

http://mackspizzaofstoneharbor.com/MacksPizza/HISTORY.html

This post even mentions Adam Kuban and was made in June 2012.  I wonder if Adam has since changed his mind about the cheese blend.

http://chrisbaer.net/mp/2012/06/08/macks-wildwood/

Ten pages reviews of Mack’s pizza from this year and other years.

http://www.tripadvisor.com/Restaurant_Review-g46931-d393819-Reviews-Mack_s_Pizza-Wildwood_New_Jersey.html

This was another review of Mack’s pizza back in 2011 on a blog  This blog is called the Pizza Project.

http://thepizzaproject.blogspot.com/2011/09/tale-of-pie-macks-pizza-wildwood.html

This is also a newer post (August 2012 on wordpress about Mack’s vs. Sam’s pizza) on a blog from Doughboys Pizza 3 Log.  http://doughboys.wordpress.com/2012/07/30/macks-vs-sams-battle-on-the-boards/   They even posted Mack’s is going downhill. Those reviewers are funny though in their post of what they did in Wildwood years ago. 

They also have a post about Manco & Manco pizza.  http://doughboys.wordpress.com/2012/06/22/manco-manco-pizza/  It was posted in June of this year.  This blog says that Manco and Manco piles on two fistfuls of cheese.  I wonder how much cheese that would be.

Does anyone see anything I might have missed?

Norma

[norma427]

This is probably as close to a Mack’s clone as I think I will get.  Finally the cheddar is right.  I posted about the cheddar on the other cheese thread.  My wish has finally been fulfilled. 

<a href="http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hKaVpVj9rCQ" target="_blank" class="aeva_link bbc_link new_win">http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=hKaVpVj9rCQ</a>

 

I mixed a dough for a 14” pizza early last evening.  I wanted to try out the new cheddar before Tuesday on another attempt at a Mack’s clone.  I did use Kyrol flour, the Gangi sauce and the new cheddar on this pizza.  I used 8 oz. of cheddar which probably was a little too much, but I wanted to see how the cheddar tasted when baked on the Mack’s attempt.  I didn’t measure the Gangi sauce, but think I applied about 6 oz. because I did weigh out 8 oz. to begin with, but didn’t use all the Gangi sauce in the plastic squeeze container.

I let the cheese sit at room temperature for 2 hrs. to see if it would clump.  It didn’t clump, or become stuck together. 

I pressed really hard on the dough ball and then opened it.  The dough could be tossed and twirled well.  I decided to bake in my mom’s home oven because I recently found out that her propane gas oven can go over 600 degrees F.  The pizza was baked in about 4 ½ minutes.  I baked on the center rack position of my mom’s oven.  The rim could have been a little browner, but I thought the bottom of the pizza was finished baking.  I am not used to what position to put the pizza stone on in my mom’s oven since this is only the second time I tried to bake any pizzas in it.  The texture of the rim was about the same as a Mack’s pizza, but not exactly.  The taste of the crust was better than a Mack’s pizza.

As soon as I tasted the pizza I knew it sure tasted and smelled like a Mack’s pizza. The cheese did have the tang with the buttery flavor. My mom also said the same thing and she hasn’t tasted a Mack’s pizza for a lot of years.  I also brought two slices home for my daughter and she also said it tasted like a real Mack’s pizza.  My mom also told me I can’t bake any other pies in her oven anymore unless it would be the same one I baked today.   That is how much she liked this attempt.  My mom asked me why I don’t just make this same pizza at market and I said I don’t think I can source the right cheddar and sauce from a distributor near me.  I think my attempt could have used a little less TF. 

My friend from Trenton also received some of the same cheddar today and baked a Mack’s attempt earlier today.  He also said the cheese was finally right.    He had used Walmart tomato paste with the same added ingredients Steve and I used the last time.

I think I could eat this same pizza everyday.  My mom and I even had a little celebration with a few glasses of my cousins tea wine.

Thanks to everyone that has helped me on this thread.  I am thrilled that I could finally make a decent Mack’s clone pizza. 

Norma

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