Author Topic: NJ Boardwalk Pizza  (Read 255383 times)

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Offline norma427

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #850 on: January 13, 2012, 06:50:41 AM »
I recently read this post on Bill Kelly’s blog about how Mack’s pizza began. I also read what has happened that Mack and Mancos is now being called Manco & Manco.  

Even though I thought I had researched Mack’s and Mack & Manco pretty much, I found snippets of things I didn’t know before in this article, and also found the article enjoyable.  

It makes me wonder if I should try to move the crust of Mack’s pizza more towards a Trenton “tomato pie”.  I really don’t know how to do that, but since the Mack family did have a successful business in Trenton, NJ for many years and called their pizzas “tomato pies”, I wonder how successful I was in trying a Mack’s clone up to this date so far.

http://oceancitydays.blogspot.com/2011/12/mack-mancos-to-manco-mancos-pizza.html

Another blogger at the shore also blogs about the changing name of Manco & Manco.  I thought the comments at the bottom of the article were also interesting.

http://oceancity.patch.com/articles/mack-splits-from-manco

On the new facebook page of Manco & Manco Pizza, Colleen posts that they had 5 half-cooked pies sent to Pittsburgh for their family’s Christmas eve dinner.  She also posted that the half baked pies were wrapped well when shipped and were good when baked according to their directions.

https://www.facebook.com/pages/Manco-Manco-Pizza/301839913177043?sk=wall

Norma


Offline Pete-zza

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #851 on: January 13, 2012, 09:27:27 AM »
It makes me wonder if I should try to move the crust of Mack’s pizza more towards a Trenton “tomato pie”.  I really don’t know how to do that, but since the Mack family did have a successful business in Trenton, NJ for many years and called their pizzas “tomato pies”, I wonder how successful I was in trying a Mack’s clone up to this date so far.

Norma,

You might recall that the Trenton connection came up earlier in this thread starting at Reply 333 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,9068.msg100260.html#msg100260, with a reference to the DeLorenzo pizzas, at least those that I tried to reverse engineer and clone in the DeLorenzo thread at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,7841.0.html and that I felt were different than the Mack clones. The Trenton-area Tomato Pie has a long and storied existence with a lineage that extends for decades. I don't know where you would start to examine the Tomato Pie and to connect what you learn to the Mack's pizzas. Unless you are a gluten for punishment, my advice to you is to lie down until the urge to research the Tomato Pie and connect what you learn to the Mack's pizza goes away :-D.

Peter

Offline norma427

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #852 on: January 13, 2012, 12:07:05 PM »
Norma,

You might recall that the Trenton connection came up earlier in this thread starting at Reply 333 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,9068.msg100260.html#msg100260, with a reference to the DeLorenzo pizzas, at least those that I tried to reverse engineer and clone in the DeLorenzo thread at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,7841.0.html and that I felt were different than the Mack clones. The Trenton-area Tomato Pie has a long and storied existence with a lineage that extends for decades. I don't know where you would start to examine the Tomato Pie and to connect what you learn to the Mack's pizzas. Unless you are a gluten for punishment, my advice to you is to lie down until the urge to research the Tomato Pie and connect what you learn to the Mack's pizza goes away :-D.

Peter


Peter,

I do remember the connection was mentioned before about the DeLorenzo thread.  That has stuck in my mind for awhile.

I still think there is some connection to DeLorenzo’s and Mack’s and Manco & Manco.  I don’t know if it is a gut feeling,  just because they were from the Trenton area, if they were both called “tomato pies”, or if this thread just has me stumped.   

In beaunehead’s post, at Reply 150 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,7841.msg58394.html#msg58394 the pictures he posted do look something like Mack’s dough and pizzas, except for the swirl, and more on the crispy side. 

The formulation you used at Reply 117 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,7841.msg45060.html#msg45060  seems to be something like I have tried in the past in this thread, but with a lower TF.  If I would up the TF wouldn’t that produce a little more tender pie?  Maybe I am way off-base, because there are so many pies in the area around NJ or Pa. that are called “tomato pies”.  DeLorenzo’s appears to use a higher oven temperature than Mack’s also, so wouldn’t that make the pies more crispy than Mack’s?

Maybe you are right, that I should just lay down until the urge to research how Tomato Pies and Mack’s pizza are related.  I have gotten myself in trouble before from being curious, and then had to do too many experiments.  :-D

Norma

Offline norma427

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #853 on: January 16, 2012, 07:07:41 PM »
Well, my curiosity got the better of me,  :-D and I mixed a dough ball this morning using Peter’s formulation at Reply 117 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,7841.msg45060.html#msg45060 but upped the TF. 

I used ADM Gigantic bromated flour because I didn’t have any Kyrol on hand.  The dough was mixed a long while in my Kitchen Aid mixer (17 minutes to see what happens to a dough that is mixed that long).  This is how the dough looked right after it was mixed and after it was balled.  When I was at market today, it looked like it was starting to ferment a little and flatten some.

Norma

Offline norma427

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #854 on: January 18, 2012, 11:08:40 AM »
I am glad my curiosity got the better of me and I decided to try Peter’s DeLorenzo formulation.  ;D Although the formulation didn’t lead me to a better Mack’s crust, it will lead me to a new adventure. 

There are a few things I would like to post about this experiment. 

1.  I don’t understand how long mixing can affect a dough and make it tougher (at least this dough).  From the long mix I did, the dough turned out well, and was so soft when opening the dough.  It makes me wonder just how bad a long mix is for some doughs.  The tight dough turned into something altogether different.  I wish I knew more about longer mix times in some doughs and why a longer mix might be better.  ???

2.  I left the dough ball ferment at room temperature for about 6 hrs. at market yesterday.  The dough fermented a lot and then was so soft to open.  The dough ball was so easy to open that I stretched it much more than 18” before I knew it.  Then the dough hung over the 18” pizza peel.  I then wasn’t sure if I could launch the pie off the peel into the oven (with the overlapping skin off the peel), so I decided instead of ruining the pie (with maybe a bad launch from the peel into the oven) to cut off the extra dough with a scissors.  That is why in the pictures the final pizza doesn’t look round and some jagged edges can be seen.  Because of cutting the dough off the TF changed to a much thinner pizza.  I wish I had weighed the pieces of dough that I had cut off to be able to know what TF this pizza really was, but didn’t think about doing that right at that moment.   I just threw it away.

3. This dough skin had a lot of fermentation bubbles and I think if I wouldn’t have pressed so hard on the skin (like Mack’s piemen do) and broke edge bubbles, this pie would have been light and airy in the rim.  That is the next experiment for next week on another thread.

4.  The resulting pizza from all of this reminded me of the pizza I ate at Best Pizza in Brooklyn, NY.  The crust had about the same TF and was just about the same in being crispy.  What a wonderful find from just doing one experiment.  ;D Maybe I will be able to make a Best Pizza style of pizza in my deck oven.  Only one more experiment might be able to tell me if that would work or not.  Steve, Randy, and my other taste testers really thought this was a really different pizza and enjoyed it.  The manager of the flea market usually comes over to sample test pizzas and he wanted to buy the 3 leftover slices, but I said the extra slices weren’t for sale and Steve, Randy and I had second slices.  Even the bottom crust seemed to brown like a Best Pizza.  All cheddar on a pizza is great, if the right kind of cheddar can be found

5.  The Cracker Barrel extra sharp cheddar tastes a lot like the cheese on a real Mack’s pizza.  It isn’t exactly the same, but does have the tang that Mack’s cheese gives, and also is very oily.  On the pictures it can be seen just how much oil the Cracker Barrel extra sharp cheddar gives when baked on the final pizza.

6.  Pinocchio and Geppetto were also so excited about this new pizza and were watching over this experiment They both said hat’s off to Peter’s formulation.  :chef: Pinocchio and Geppetto still want me to try the Cracker Barrel extra sharp cheddar on my other formulation for a Mack’s dough.  Can’t they ever be satisfied.  :-D

7.  I wouldn’t have been able to toss and throw this dough.  It opened way too easily.

Norma

Offline norma427

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #855 on: January 18, 2012, 11:10:23 AM »
Norma

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #856 on: January 18, 2012, 11:12:10 AM »
Norma

Offline norma427

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #857 on: January 18, 2012, 11:14:01 AM »
Norma

Offline norma427

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #858 on: January 18, 2012, 11:15:46 AM »
Norma


Offline norma427

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #859 on: January 18, 2012, 11:17:34 AM »
Norma

Offline norma427

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #860 on: January 18, 2012, 11:19:06 AM »
Norma

Offline norma427

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #861 on: January 18, 2012, 11:20:10 AM »
Norma

Offline norma427

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #862 on: January 18, 2012, 11:23:33 AM »
Norma

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #863 on: January 29, 2012, 07:15:01 PM »
Peter,

For the formulation you used at Reply 307 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,9068.msg99472.html#msg99472 what kind of salt did you use in the expanded dough calculating tool?  I want to try your formulation for a Mack’s clone for Tuesday since I haven’t tried it before.  I want to make sure I also use the kind of salt you used in your formulation. 

Norma

Offline Pete-zza

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #864 on: January 29, 2012, 07:49:36 PM »
Peter,

For the formulation you used at Reply 307 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,9068.msg99472.html#msg99472 what kind of salt did you use in the expanded dough calculating tool?  I want to try your formulation for a Mack’s clone for Tuesday since I haven’t tried it before.  I want to make sure I also use the kind of salt you used in your formulation. 

Norma

Norma,

It was regular table salt, much as I suspect Mack's uses.

Peter

Offline norma427

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #865 on: January 29, 2012, 08:06:08 PM »
Norma,

It was regular table salt, much as I suspect Mack's uses.

Peter

Peter,

Thanks!

Norma

Offline norma427

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #866 on: January 29, 2012, 11:03:01 PM »
Peter's formulation mixed well.  These are two pictures of right after the mix, and after I left the dough ferment for 1 1/2 hrs at room temperature, before placing the dough ball in the refrigerator to cold ferment until Tuesday.

Norma


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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #867 on: February 01, 2012, 08:35:17 AM »
I am glad I tried Peter’s formulation for a clone Mack’s pizza.  I thought his formulation in the deck oven came closest to a Mack’s pizza.  The crumb was about the same as a Mack’s pizza and also tasted very good.  The dough ball was very easy to open.  I really pressed on the dough so there wouldn’t be much of any open spring.

There was a slight mishap in making this Mack’s clone pizza.  :o The Cracker Barrel extra sharp white cheddar cheese was shredded awhile before the pizza was made and it gotten soft sitting at room temperature.  Randy had put the sauce in a plastic squeeze bottle.  I started to put the sauce on the middle and as I was trying to make the swirl pattern to the edges, and somehow the lid flew off.  :-\ Maybe the sauce was a little too thick. It then made a big splatter on the edge of the skin.  I had quickly put the sauce back into the plastic container and somehow some strands of cheese must have gotten stuck in the plastic container.  I was finishing applying the sauce and somehow a piece of cheese got stuck in the plastic cut off lid.  I squeezed really hard and the piece of cheese and sauce went flying out all over and even hit a woman walking in the aisle. The plastic lid stayed on this time.  The sauce hit the woman’s forehead and some got on her T-shirt.  I was embarrassed and got some wet papers towels to help her clean her T-shirt.  :-[ The woman was so upset and said I had pointed the container at her, which I didn’t , because the sauce even hit the side where the cash register sits.  The piece of cheese that was stuck in the lid was also stuck there.  Steve cleaned that mess up.  Thankfully the woman’s husband or boyfriend wasn’t as upset as she was.  Finally her T-shirt was clean.  I then slide the pie into the oven.

I think this Mack’s clone attempt tasted more like a Mack’s pizza than my other Mack’s clone attempts.  The cheese doesn’t taste exactly like Mack’s cheese but has a good tang like Mack‘s, is buttery tasting and oils a lot. 

Steve took a video of me trying to throw the dough, but I am so bad at throwing dough, that the one time I went to catch the dough I used my finger tips and tore the dough.   It can be seen in the second video where the dough was tore. It was my fault that the dough tore.  I quickly pinched it back together and it held nicely when the pie was baked. 

This next video is of Steve using the pizza cutter to slice the Mack’s attempt.

Thanks Peter for setting-forth your dough formulation for a Mack’s clone.  :) Sorry I didn’t try it before.

Norma

Offline norma427

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #868 on: February 01, 2012, 08:38:33 AM »
Norma

Offline norma427

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #869 on: February 01, 2012, 08:39:35 AM »
Norma

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #870 on: February 01, 2012, 08:40:40 AM »
Norma

Offline norma427

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #871 on: February 01, 2012, 08:42:30 AM »
Norma

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #872 on: February 01, 2012, 08:43:56 AM »
Norma

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #873 on: February 01, 2012, 08:44:57 AM »
Norma

Offline norma427

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #874 on: February 01, 2012, 08:46:02 AM »
Norma


 

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