Author Topic: NJ Boardwalk Pizza  (Read 172595 times)

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Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #1620 on: March 08, 2013, 07:10:21 PM »
Sounds like a really cool old building Norma. I like places like that too. My local Mellow Mushroom restaurant is in a converted very old Phillip Morris tobacco warehouse here in Durham NC.

http://www.panoramio.com/photo/27323979
http://mellowmushroom.com/store/durham

http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=542619775761110&set=p.542619775761110&type=1&ref=nf
« Last Edit: March 08, 2013, 09:47:50 PM by Chicago Bob »
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Offline norma427

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #1621 on: March 08, 2013, 07:49:46 PM »
Sounds like a really cool old building Norma. I like places like that too. My local Mellow Mushroom restaurant is in a converted very old Phillip Morris tobacco warehouse here in Durham NC.

http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=542619775761110&set=p.542619775761110&type=1&ref=nf

http://mellowmushroom.com/store/durham

http://www.facebook.com/photo.php?fbid=542619775761110&set=p.542619775761110&type=1&ref=nf


Bob,

Your Mellow Mushroom is in a very neat old building too.  8) That is interesting you like old buildings too.  If you are interested, you can put 108 Yerkes Road, Collegeville, Pa. in Google Maps on the web, and then you can see the little old building that I was in if you zoom in on Google Maps.  It is titled A.  The other buildings and creek can also be seen.   There all are on a dead end street.  I wish I would have taken some pictures of the Occident flour advertising item and also of those old buildings.

Norma
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Offline Pete-zza

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #1622 on: March 08, 2013, 08:26:21 PM »
Norma,

It looks like you had an interesting and educational conversation with Pete Hansen.

Although Catherine may have sent you a non-specific spec sheet, I note that the Nutrition Facts in what she sent you, as noted at Reply 1605 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,9068.msg241739.html#msg241739, are the same as in the specific spec sheet that Pete sent you for the Gangi Supreme Super Heavy Pizza Sauce.

Pete is correct that there is no Standard of Identity for pizza sauce. As you can see from the document at http://www.nfsmi.org/documentlibraryfiles/PDF/20080211094017.pdf, there are standards of identity for canned vegetables including tomatoes, tomato concentrates and catsup, and also for canned tomato juices. But not pizza sauces. Yet, interestingly, Gangi calls the Gangi tomato product you purchased today a "pizza sauce", and that pizza sauce has an NTSS value, which represents a standard of identity. Maybe they can add dried basil and still assign an NTSS value to the combined puree and dried basil.

It is interesting that Stanislaus and Gangi appear to be processing the same type of tomatoes grown in the same general region. However, that does not necessarily mean that they process the tomatoes the same way. For example, take a look at the Nutrition Facts for the Stanislaus Saporito Super Heavy Puree at http://www.stanislausfoodproducts.com/_pdfs/Saporito-Puree.pdf. You will note that for the same serving size (1/4 cup, or about 60 grams), the Stanislaus product has a higher calorie count and more Carbohydrates and Sugars. I believe the higher Carbohydrates number is because of more Sugars in the Stanislaus product. Note also how much more Vitamin A and Vitamin C are in the Stanislaus product per serving size compared with the Gangi product. Vitamin C is susceptible to destruction by heat, so maybe Stanislaus uses a lower temperature processing for its tomatoes. It is perhaps also noteworthy that of the 28 tomato products shown at the Stanislaus website, only two products have lower Vitamin C contributions than the Gangi product for a 1/4-cup serving size (they are the 7/11 Ground Unpeeled Tomatoes and the Full Red Chunky Tomato Sauce). If you end up talking with Stanislaus and you mention the Gangi product, you might hear their side of the story.

All of the above is moot, I suppose, since you have the Gangi Supreme product that you were after. In my case, I am only trying to understand what is going on.

Peter

Offline Pete-zza

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #1623 on: March 08, 2013, 09:11:01 PM »
Norma,

After I posted, I noticed this Stanislaus product that looks like it is quite close to the Gangi product but without any basil: http://www.stanislausfoodproducts.com/_pdfs/Full-Red-Puree.pdf. The label on the can says "Extra Heavy Purée."

Peter

Offline norma427

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #1624 on: March 08, 2013, 10:01:02 PM »
Norma,

It looks like you had an interesting and educational conversation with Pete Hansen.

Although Catherine may have sent you a non-specific spec sheet, I note that the Nutrition Facts in what she sent you, as noted at Reply 1605 at http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,9068.msg241739.html#msg241739, are the same as in the specific spec sheet that Pete sent you for the Gangi Supreme Super Heavy Pizza Sauce.

Pete is correct that there is no Standard of Identity for pizza sauce. As you can see from the document at http://www.nfsmi.org/documentlibraryfiles/PDF/20080211094017.pdf, there are standards of identity for canned vegetables including tomatoes, tomato concentrates and catsup, and also for canned tomato juices. But not pizza sauces. Yet, interestingly, Gangi calls the Gangi tomato product you purchased today a "pizza sauce", and that pizza sauce has an NTSS value, which represents a standard of identity. Maybe they can add dried basil and still assign an NTSS value to the combined puree and dried basil.

It is interesting that Stanislaus and Gangi appear to be processing the same type of tomatoes grown in the same general region. However, that does not necessarily mean that they process the tomatoes the same way. For example, take a look at the Nutrition Facts for the Stanislaus Saporito Super Heavy Puree at http://www.stanislausfoodproducts.com/_pdfs/Saporito-Puree.pdf. You will note that for the same serving size (1/4 cup, or about 60 grams), the Stanislaus product has a higher calorie count and more Carbohydrates and Sugars. I believe the higher Carbohydrates number is because of more Sugars in the Stanislaus product. Note also how much more Vitamin A and Vitamin C are in the Stanislaus product per serving size compared with the Gangi product. Vitamin C is susceptible to destruction by heat, so maybe Stanislaus uses a lower temperature processing for its tomatoes. It is perhaps also noteworthy that of the 28 tomato products shown at the Stanislaus website, only two products have lower Vitamin C contributions than the Gangi product for a 1/4-cup serving size (they are the 7/11 Ground Unpeeled Tomatoes and the Full Red Chunky Tomato Sauce). If you end up talking with Stanislaus and you mention the Gangi product, you might hear their side of the story.

All of the above is moot, I suppose, since you have the Gangi Supreme product that you were after. In my case, I am only trying to understand what is going on.

Peter


Peter,

Yes, I thought I did have an interesting and education conversation with Peter Hansen.  I wish now I would have thought to ask him more about how Gangi processes the pizza products, but at the time I didn’t think of asking about that.  Pete did tell me that different sizes of screens are used for different Gangi Pizza Sauces.  He also told me that the Gangi pizza sauces are a little darker in color than the Stanislaus pizza sauces because dried basil is used instead of fresh basil.  I have also noticed that when I opened the cans of the Gangi Supreme Super Heavy Pizza Sauce.  I also can look at the sample cans Pete sends me to see if that is also true. 

The foodservice distributor told me that they no longer carry the Super Extra Heavy Pizza Sauce with Basil, but did sell a lot of that product a few years ago.  He also told me that that product was called “SUP 43”.  The distributor told me they sell a lot of the same Gangi sauce I purchased today.  I wonder why it is so popular in that area and I can’t find it my area.  I recall talking to Hometown Provisions awhile ago and wondering if they carried the Gangi Surpreme Super Heavy Pizza sauce and the owner told me they sold a lot of that sauce about 8 years ago, but stopped carrying it when pizzerias stopped using it as much.  The food service distributor told me today that since they have started carrying some Stanislaus product more pizzerias are purchasing them because they like the brighter red color.   

Thanks for showing me why Pete was correct in saying there is no Standard of Identity for pizza sauces in referencing the link to what products have a standard of Identity.  I searched a little about that after Pete told me there are no Standard of Identity for pizza sauces and also saw something I didn’t understand about pepperoni and sausage added to a frozen pizza not having a Standard of Identity either.  I also wonder why the Gangi tomato product I purchased today has a Standard of Identity using the NTSS value.  I don’t understand that either.

I can understand that Stanislaus might process their tomatoes in a different way.  I see what you mean that the Stanislaus product has a higher calorie count and more Carbohydrates and Sugars.  I did note how much more Vitamin A and Vitamin C are in the Stanislaus product per serving size.  I wonder why the Vitamin A and Vitamin C are much higher.  Your guess as why they are higher is good.  They probably are using a lower temperature for processing their tomatoes.   

I would like to hear Stanislaus’s and Escalon’s side of the story.  I won’t have time to contact them until later next week.

I do have the Gangi Supreme product right now, but am open to using either Stanislaus or Escalon if one of their products tastes about the same on my boardwalk pizzas.  I also am not wild about driving all that way to pick-up a tomato sauce. 

Norma,

After I posted, I noticed this Stanislaus product that looks like it is quite close to the Gangi product but without any basil: http://www.stanislausfoodproducts.com/_pdfs/Full-Red-Puree.pdf. The label on the can says "Extra Heavy Purée."

Peter


Thank you for mentioning the Stanislaus Full-Red as a possibility.  I think I still have some of that from the Two Bills thread if I recall right. 

Norma
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Offline norma427

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #1625 on: March 11, 2013, 06:28:54 PM »
I called Stanislaus after I returned from market today and talked to a rep and asked what Stanislaus product might be a counterpart to the Gangi Super Heavy Pizza Sauce with Salt and Dried Basil.  The representative said he never heard of Gangi tomato products.  I told the rep that the representative I had talked to about the Gangi tomato products was from Pacific Coast Producers and he told me that the Gangi tomato fields are right next to the Stanislaus fields and they both use the same type of tomatoes to make their tomato products.  The representative told me that Stanislaus contracts out fields and the rep couldn’t tell me where they are.  I then said I guessed that all tomatoes that they use in Stanislaus tomato products are about 2.5% sugar.  The Stanislaus rep said the tomatoes are different percents in sugars and acids, so they then have what is called a blending station that blends different tomatoes to get the right type of tomato product.  The rep asked me how thick the Gangi sauce was and I told him.  First the rep told me that maybe Full Red might be like the Gangi sauce, but I said I have already tasted the Full Red and to me it is sweeter than the Gangi sauce.  I then asked the rep if they have any tomato products with dried basil.  I had told the sales rep that I do use Saporito with fresh basil.  He said there is a Saporito product with dried basil and that would make that tomato product taste different and there would be some little black specks in the Saporito product with dried basil.  The rep is going to send me a sample can of the Saporito Super Heavy Pizza Sauce with Dry Basil, but the Nutrition Facts don’t look anything like the Gangi product.  The rep from Stanislaus mentioned Pizzaiolo Pizza Sauce http://www.stanislausfoodproducts.com/_pdfs/Pizzaiolo-Autentico-Pizza-Sauce.pdf and Tomato Magic http://www.stanislausfoodproducts.com/_pdfs/Tomato-Magic-Ground-Tomatoes.pdf but since I am not good at looking at Nutrition Facts fast, I sure don’t know how they would compare to the Gangi product I purchased.

These are the Nutrition Facts for the Saporito Pizza Sauce with Dry Basil.

http://www.stanislausfoodproducts.com/_pdfs/Saporito-Pizza-Sauce-w-Dry-Basil.pdf

Norma
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Offline norma427

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #1626 on: March 11, 2013, 06:32:30 PM »
I opened the can of Gangi Supreme Super Heavy Pizza Sauce today and I thought it actually tasted good and was redder than I remembered.  It isn’t as sweet as what I normally use though.  I added some oregano and black pepper so it might develop some flavor of the oregano until tomorrow.  I might have to add more oregano tomorrow, but I didn’t want to add to much oregano at first.  A batch of 10 Mack’s clone dough balls were made today to see what my customers think of a “boardwalk style” pizza.

Norma
« Last Edit: March 11, 2013, 06:35:30 PM by norma427 »
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Offline Ev

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #1627 on: March 11, 2013, 06:47:52 PM »
Looks good Norma, except you'll need to thin that out a bit, as I'm sure you know. :)

Offline norma427

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #1628 on: March 11, 2013, 07:12:19 PM »
Looks good Norma, except you'll need to thin that out a bit, as I'm sure you know. :)

Steve,

Yep, am going to thin it out tomorrow like I do to my regular sauce at market.  Thin as we go tomorrow.

The cheese is ready.

Norma
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Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #1629 on: March 11, 2013, 09:47:08 PM »
I opened the can of Gangi Supreme Super Heavy Pizza Sauce today and I thought it actually tasted good and was redder than I remembered.  It isn’t as sweet as what I normally use though.  I added some oregano and black pepper so it might develop some flavor of the oregano until tomorrow.  I might have to add more oregano tomorrow, but I didn’t want to add to much oregano at first.  A batch of 10 Mack’s clone dough balls were made today to see what my customers think of a “boardwalk style” pizza.

Norma
Sounds fab Norma....good luck. Don't forget your squeeze bottle!!   8)
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Offline norma427

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #1630 on: March 11, 2013, 10:03:44 PM »
Sounds fab Norma....good luck. Don't forget your squeeze bottle!!   8)


Bob,

Thanks for the good luck for tomorrow!  ;) I am interested to see if my customers like them or not.  I am not even sure if I have my crust right, but I did mix one extra dough ball at home to test too.  I posted at Reply  1618 http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,9068.msg241956.html#msg241956 that I am using the Maruca’s pitcher Trenton Bill gave me that I posted a photo of in that post.  I saw the one pieman using a similar pitcher the one time I was at Mack’s when Mack's wasn't really busy.  I think  Maruca’s still uses pitchers like the one I posted.  If I make a mess it is my fault, so no squeeze bottles for tomorrow.  :-D

Norma
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Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #1631 on: March 11, 2013, 10:20:36 PM »
That is a cool looking pitcher and the other goodies you have lined up now will be awesome...I do believe you are ready to rock.  8)
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Offline norma427

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #1632 on: March 11, 2013, 10:29:49 PM »
That is a cool looking pitcher and the other goodies you have lined up now will be awesome...I do believe you are ready to rock.  8)

Bob,

I like the old pitcher too.  I did use it one time before on this thread and it worked well.  I don't know if I am ready to rock, but will give it a shot.   :-D

Norma
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Offline norma427

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #1633 on: March 13, 2013, 09:19:37 AM »
At least in my opinion the boardwalk style pizzas went over well yesterday.  By about 4:30 PM the 11 dough balls were all used up to make the boardwalk style pizzas.  I know that isn’t a lot of pizzas, but it was raining heavily in our area yesterday morning until about 2:00 PM in the afternoon, so not near as many customers were at market up until that time.

My friend Dave that usually comes to my stand in the morning to talk me said he had to make me a little boardwalk sign for me.  In about a little over a minute he made me the little sign posted below.  I just made 2  small signs on the computer yesterday morning that said “New” Boardwalk style pizzas.  I had talked to the manager last week at market about that I might start to offer the boardwalk style of pizzas at market.  He said when I do, he will make announcements that I am selling them.  I told the manger that I have to try them out this week before I decide if I want to continue them and would let him know if I really start to offer them regularly, because I can’t predict how many dough balls to make yet until I see what customers think of them.  I thought that was even odd that the manager of market said he would make announcements over the loud speakers, because he wouldn’t even do that when I started making pizzas at market because he said it would be unfair to all the other stand holders. 

The dough balls behaved well throughout the day, but I am not sure if I have the exact right formulation I want to use yet for the dough balls to get the rims to brown right and the bottom of the crust to brown right.  The bottom of the crust did brown better yesterday, but I would like a more even bottom browning.  The skins could be tossed and twirled without any problems, even though I still can’t toss the dough right yet.  The taste of the crust was good though yesterday and when cut the bottom crusts were crispy.  Steve and I were talking about increasing the TF a little more too, but I am not sure how much to increase the TF. 

I didn’t measure out the weights of the cheese I used yesterday because I was just trying to figure out how much cheese should be applied.  I found out if too much cheese was applied that there was too much grease that wanted to pool in some places. 

The pitcher Trenton Bill gave me worked well to apply the Gangi sauce.  I also have to learn how much sauce needs to be applied.  I had too big of a rim without sauce and cheese, but I am still in the process of learning about that.  Steve told me that I should just apply the Gangi sauce like I usually do with a ladle, but I told him then it wouldn’t really look like a boardwalk style of pizza without the spiral of the sauce.

I found it interesting that customers did notice that the pizzas were a boardwalk style.  I had different comments that the pizzas looked and tasted like a Grotto’s pizza.  I didn’t have any customers that have eaten a Mack’s pizza, but customers must have gone by my stand and thought the pizzas looked like Manco and Manco pizzas.   We had just finished selling the last slice of the boardwalk style pizzas and a lady came back and wanted a slice because she had walked by my stand earlier and had thought the slices looked like a Manco and Manco pizza.  I told her we were all out of dough balls, but would have more of that style of pizza to offer next week.  She said she would be back next week.  The one stand holder that ordered a whole boardwalk style of pizza last week for this week did come and purchase slices earlier in the day and also came back for the whole pizza.  She really likes the boardwalk style of pizza because she loves Grotto’s pizzas.  I had to laugh that customers do recognize that the pizzas did look like a boardwalk style of pizza, just because of the way the cheese and sauce are applied.

That Gangi sauce is redder in color than Steve and I had remembered too.  I think the flavor of the Gangi sauce is now very good.  The last picture is of the Gangi sauce on the left and my regular pizza sauce on the right.  It can be seen that the Gangi sauce really isn’t much darker in color than my regular pizza sauce.

I don’t usually get my cell phone out during the day, because I don’t want to get distracted from what I am doing, but a broker from Stanislaus had called me on my cell phone and left me a voice message that Stanislaus doesn’t offer the Saporito with dried basil in my area, but told me to call him back for other Stanislaus products that might be comparable to the Gangi product.  I have to call the broker back today.

I will see how these boardwalk style pizzas go over in the next few weeks, because I can’t make too many different types of dough balls, because then it is too hard to predict how many different doughs balls to make for any given Tuesday.

These photos of the boardwalk style pizzas were the best looking ones from yesterday, but were ones I had time to take photos of.


Norma
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Offline norma427

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #1634 on: March 13, 2013, 09:23:34 AM »
Norma
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Offline norma427

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #1635 on: March 13, 2013, 09:25:38 AM »
Norma
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Offline norma427

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #1636 on: March 13, 2013, 09:28:17 AM »
Norma
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Offline norma427

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #1637 on: March 16, 2013, 08:44:13 AM »
I received the sample can of the Stanislaus Saporito Super Heavy-With Basil Pizza Sauce from Stanislaus yesterday.  The Stanislaus Saporito with dried basil is on the right and the regular Saporito pizza sauce with fresh basil I use is on the left.

Norma
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Offline norma427

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #1638 on: March 18, 2013, 05:58:50 PM »
These were the boardwalk style of dough balls I made today for tomorrow.  I upped the TF a little and decreased the sugar percentage a little.  I still like a higher hydration dough to ball though.  It better stop snowing in our area tonight or tomorrow morning.  This is what it looked like outside a couple of minutes ago.

Norma
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Offline norma427

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Re: NJ Boardwalk Pizza
« Reply #1639 on: March 21, 2013, 08:26:26 AM »
Well, my Mack’s clone dough balls sure gave me problems on Tuesday.  All I did was increase the TF and reduce the sugar percentage a little, but don’t know what happened.  I thought I mixed the same, but maybe I mixed too much dough for my mixer.  I had to start out by letting the mixer bowl down until the water and flour were slightly combined, then I lifted the handle to finish the mixing.  If I would not have lifted the handle first I think there would have been flour flying everywhere.  The dough balls were like bears to open.  They did open into skins, but they didn’t bake right either.  I liked the slightly thicker pizza, because it held better in the heated cabinet and the slices were nice to reheat though.  I did sell all of the pizzas from the dough balls that were made.  Even with all the pressing and pushing I am doing on these dough balls when opening into a skin, there still are bubbles that need to be popped when the pizza is baking in the oven. 

I might have to revisit one of the other Mack’s formulations on this thread and give one of them a try again, because I don’t want to have to be fighting the dough balls every week when opening them into skins.  I even let some of the dough balls temper a little (until the dough ball was warm and kind of soft) in the Hatco Unit to see if that would make them easier to open, but that didn’t help either.  Last week the dough balls were a little hard to open, but surely not as bad as this past Tuesday.

I also found out the Saporito with dried basil almost tasted like the Gangi sauce.  I used that on all of my Detroit style pizzas on Tuesday.  I don’t think I can purchase that near me though.  Stanislaus did send me another sample can of that product though.  I found out this week that half water and half of the Gangi product worked out okay. 

I also tried some dough balls for Greek pizza and although the Greek pizzas were thicker my customers didn’t seem to mind.  The dough skin became nice after tempering. 

Norma
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