NJ Boardwalk Pizza

[norma427]

One more, I had trouble resizing these pictures.

Norma

[norma427]

A few pictures of Mack and Mancos Pizza to compare with Mack's Pizza.

Norma

[norma427]

Norma

[norma427]

When I looked at the Earth Cam for Wildwood this morning it was 73 degrees F.  A perfect day at the shore.  Wish I was there.  .....and eating Mack's pizza. 

http://www.earthcam.com/usa/newjersey/wildwood/   

http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,9068.msg96292.html#msg96292

[Pete-zza]

Norma,

Thanks for finding the recent photos. They give me a better idea as to the target to shoot for. The dark red color of the sauce seems to suggest a tomato paste-based product. I don't think that I have any basic non-paste tomato product with a color as dark as shown in the photos.

I would still like to shoot for an 18" pizza in my home oven. I need to give some thought as to the best way to accomplish that to get the desired results. The last method broke down the cheeses too much because I couldn't properly control the top heat. I might also pick up some mild white cheddar cheese to mix with the extra sharp cheddar since that shouldn't affect the total fat that much. I think I might also try adding some vegetable or olive oil to the sauce.

I have been reheating the leftover slices from my last Mack clone pizza. They have been good but thus far I prefer the freshly baked slices.

Peter

[norma427]

Peter,

I think you are right about the tomato-paste product because that is what Gangi is.  I prefer the Full Red, but since I want to try and make this pie as authentic as I can, I will use the paste Gangi.  The Gangi reminds me of the regular WalMart tomato paste, when I tasted it.  The Gangi has added basil, but I really couldn’t taste the basil in it.  To my palate the sauce has a little bitter or sour taste, although in the final pizza the sauce isn’t sour or bitter.  Maybe Steve will also comment on this. 

Whew..shooting for a  18" pizza.  You are daring trying that in your home overn. At this point, I don’t want to try that.  Maybe if I can get the taste of the cheeses right, then I might also try a 18" pizza. 

I am going to mix the X-Sharp Cheddar I bought yesterday with some of the State Brand, mild white cheddar to see what happens.  I looked though my product catalog from Hometown Provisions, Inc. and they have so many kinds of cheddar.  I am not sure until I talk with them, which ones are white.  They will usually break down a case and just sell you a 5lb. loaf, so if this X-Sharp Cheddar doesn’t work, I might consider buying a 5 lb. loaf or just try the X-Sharp Cheddar. 

When I looked at the pictures I posted above, it looks like the hose that applies the sauce, is bigger than I remember.

Even I don’t ever remember Mack’s pizza tasting the same when it was warmed up.  We usually rented an efficiency at the shore and I had tried reheating in the oven and also the microwave.

Norma

[Pete-zza]

Norma,

I called Mack's this morning and spoke to the gal who answered the phone about their pizzas. I was told that the pizzas come in one size only, 18". Also, there is no mozzarella cheese used, only a white cheddar cheese. When I mentioned that I had heard that their pizzas were on the greasy/oily side, she said that was from the fat in the cheese. There is no oil used in the sauce. When I asked if the cheddar was mild or strong tasting, she said she would describe it as being on the mild side. Of course, that is a subjective characterization. She could not tell me what kind of flour they use.

Peter

[norma427]

Norma,

I called Mack's this morning and spoke to the gal who answered the phone about their pizzas. I was told that the pizzas come in one size only, 18". Also, there is no mozzarella cheese used, only a white cheddar cheese. When I mentioned that I had heard that their pizzas were on the greasy/oily side, she said that was from the fat in the cheese. There is no oil used in the sauce. When I asked if the cheddar was mild or strong tasting, she said she would describe it as being on the mild side. Of course, that is a subjective characterization. She could not tell me what kind of flour they use.

Peter

Peter,

LOL..you are quite the investigator.     I couldn't imagine that she would give that information over the phone.  Since she now said that the oily/greasy is from the cheese, there is no need to try oil in the sauce.

I think we just have to get the cheese right and experiment more.

Thanks for calling,

Norma

[Pete-zza]

Norma,

I have learned that you just can't call someone and expect them to spill their guts. You have to plan your strategy, rehearse it in advance in your mind, and then tailor it to the person you are likely to be speaking with. It will be different if you are talking to an expert, where it helps to have a good command of the jargon, rather than just an ordinary worker for whom a job is just a job. To give you an idea, this morning, when I called Mack's, I said to the gal who answered the phone that I lived in Texas and might at some point want to try their pizza on a future visit north but wanted to know more about their pizzas. After we got the pizza size issue out of the way, which was a softball question for which I believed I already knew the answer (which she confirmed), I mentioned that I had a lactose intolerance to mozzarella cheese. I don't know if she knew what lactose intolerance is but that compelled her to tell me that they didn't use mozzarella cheese, only white cheddar cheese. That opened up a discussion of the type of cheddar cheese (i.e., mild versus sharp). When I "attacked" their pizza as being overly greasy/oily based on what I had heard, that put her on the defensive and prompted her to explain that the fat was from the cheese and was quite normal. When I speculated that it might be oil used in the sauce, she said that they did not use any oil in the sauce. Although I asked about the type of flour, hoping I would get really lucky, I knew from past experience that workers rarely know the answer to that type of question.

BTW, I called Mack's before they would get very busy and either wouldn't answer the phone or cut the conversation short.

Peter

[ERASMO]

Of course I had to go to macks this weekend to continue research.  I did notice the rotoflex oven did not appear to be fitted with stones.  Also they were very busy and the oven was fluctuating between 550 and 575.  They had three guys stretching dough and I saw one guy that was putting two dough balls together, stretching them together and then separating them into two skins.  Other than that no great progress. 

[Pete-zza]

I did notice the rotoflex oven did not appear to be fitted with stones.  Also they were very busy and the oven was fluctuating between 550 and 575.

ERASMO,

It's possible that the higher oven temperature was to be sure that there was sufficient heat retention in the face of the high volume of pizzas. Otherwise, the workers might be trying to bake new pizzas on cool spots in the oven where other (finished) pizzas were vacated.

Peter

[norma427]

Peter,

You sure do have your spiel down pat.  That poor gal must not have even known what lactose intolerance was.  Good one for you.  What would you have said if she knew what lactose intolerance was?  What would your next line have been? 

I guess I will have to practice what I am going to say and make a strategy, if I get to Mack’s.

Good thinking also, on calling earlier.  Mack’s does get busy and with such a nice weekend, I am sure they were busy as ERASMO reported.

Norma

ERASMO,

I would have like to see the guy that stretched two dough balls together.  He sure must have been talented.  Thanks for your continued research. 

Norma

[Pete-zza]

You sure do have your spiel down pat.  That poor gal must not have even known what lactose intolerance was.  Good one for you.  What would you have said if she knew what lactose intolerance was?  What would your next line have been? 

Norma,

It did occur to me that she might not know what lactose intolerance is, since a lot of people do not know, but I was prepared to say that it doesn't apply to all cheeses (which happens to be true). That might have prompted her to tell me what kind of cheese they use. Since we already knew from a variety of sources that they used cheddar cheese, what I was hoping to find out is whether it was blended with mozzarella cheese or used only by itself. As it turns out, scott r was right when he said that his source said only cheddar cheese. We just ruled a few things out, not in. At least we won't waste time playing around with cheese blends and oil in the sauce.

Peter

[Pete-zza]

I saw one guy that was putting two dough balls together, stretching them together and then separating them into two skins.  

ERASMO,

I think I would have paid money to see that. Can you tell us how the skin made from two dough balls was separated into two other skins? I have read about some pizza operators combining two small dough balls to make a larger pizza. I believe that one of the dough balls is pressed, but not kneaded, into the other dough ball. But I have never heard of making one skin and dividing it into two.

Peter

[ERASMO]

What he did was take one dough ball which seemed to be lightly oiled, put it in the bowl of flour and floured on top and bottom.  He then took a second dough ball floured it the same and placed it on top of the first ball on the wooden counter.  He then proceeded to flatten and stretch both skins at the same time.  When they were stretched out he then pulled them apart and finished the final stretching to the 18" mark.

[Glutenboy]

Is this technique used to impact some quality of the skin or just a timesaver?

[RoadPizza]

Is this technique used to impact some quality of the skin or just a timesaver?

I can't see it as anything but a timesaver.

[widespreadpizza]

ERASMO, if I say I can't believe it,  can I at least see it?  That would be sweet.  There is nothing better than hearing about something you've never considered in the realm of pizza,  like stretching two doughs at once or using baking powder in long cold fermented NYC style pizza dough......  -marc

[norma427]

ERASMO, if I say I can't believe it,  can I at least see it?  That would be sweet. 

ERASMO,

I agree with widespreadpizza and Peter.  I also would like to see that if I could.  Which Mack's did you see that?  Was it the Mack's at the end of the boardwalk near Wildwood Crest or the one near the center of the Boardwalk, near Douglas's Fudge?

If the stars are right I think I am going to Wildwood next week or the following week. 

Norma

[norma427]

Peter,

I talked to one of the owners of Hometown Provisions, Inc. this morning about Mack’s pizza and if he every heard of anyone ever using all cheddar for a pizza.  He wasn’t familiar with Mack’s or Mack and Manco's Pizza, but said he knew Papa Gino’s used to used a special blend made for them of mostly cheddar with some swiss ends. He said they now have discontinued this, but he thought they still used some cheddar in their blend. I told him we knew that Mack’s uses all cheddar, but weren’t too sure what kind of cheddar they used.  He then said if you use all cheddar you will have a very greasy pizza.  I said I already knew that. He said they probably wouldn’t be using sharp cheddar.  I asked him what did he think they might be using.  His guess was probably medium cheddar.  I asked him about the brands they carry and he recommended State Brand mild white cheddar.  The State Brand is 2.50 a lb for a 5 lb. loaf. He also thought if using the sharp white cheddar, the cheese would break down too much in the oven. Since the State Brand seems to be a popular brand, hopefully this is what we are looking for to make a pizza like Mack’s.  I ordered a 5 lb. loaf.

Norma