Author Topic: Pizza cooking on the Big Green Egg (Read 53369 times)

SmokinGuitarPlayer · « **Reply #20 on:** December 06, 2009, 03:50:04 PM »

Warren ....yes ..I have yet to have figured all that part out ...duh ..
OK..so
nuclear 750 plus etc. Pure Caputo 00
500 range - hi gluten

any suggestions for "in between .. like 600 650 . ( a mix?)

also ... best temps / uses for KABF dough or KASL ??

Thanks for helping me along the learning curve. I have been focused on the Egg setup / temps and never realized or considered the dough comp.
FB/SGP

UnConundrum · « **Reply #21 on:** December 06, 2009, 04:01:08 PM »

Well, I'd say the Caputo is 800 and above. Between I'd go for either a mix or maybe the bread flour which I think has a lower protein content (I never used the bread flour so I'm unfamiliar with it). You'll have to test a bit.

widespreadpizza · « **Reply #22 on:** December 06, 2009, 05:31:29 PM »

hey there, just wanted to chime in here. I think something that is often overlooked in the flour/heat debate is whether the flour is malted or not. From my experience over the last few years is you can use any protein content at ultra high heat as long as it is not a malted flour. Flour millers have done everything possible to ensure that professional and home bakers alike achieve desired results when they use their products at "standard" temps. This is why everything changes when you go to ultra high heat where pizzamaking began. I remember reading some of the stuff vasarano wrote and he believed that he thought any Italian pizzaolio could make a similar product with American or Italian flour. I wonder if he would change that statement now? I wonder if he wouldn't clarify between malted and unmalted flours. Unmalted flours all have a hard time browing well at conventional oven temps, while performing great at very high temps, and vice versa. I know many others have studied this more than I care to, but I just want to make sure that when we talk about why Caputo, bread, high gluten, organic bread, all purpose or a certain blend works well at a certain temp the other factors are taken into consideration, like what is added to the flour. Does this make sense to anybody or am I in left field? -Marc

SmokinGuitarPlayer · « **Reply #23 on:** December 06, 2009, 06:38:08 PM »

Oh no... not another variable !!

BobS · « **Reply #24 on:** December 07, 2009, 01:59:22 PM »

I am a noobie to the forum, but have been making pizza on my BGE for a couple of years and I know, Fred (he told me about the forum), so I figured this was as good a place as any to get started.

My set-up is as follows.

Lg BGE
Plate Setter with feet down.
I put 1 1/4" copper pipe couplings on top of the plate setter to push the pizza stone higher in the dome.

Last night I fixed my first pie using Caputo flour, that I picked up at Fred's. I cooked it at 650 and it turned out great.

I am looking forward to getting to know my way around the forum and learning from the experts.

Bob

Parttimepizzaiolo · « **Reply #25 on:** December 07, 2009, 05:35:06 PM »

Quote from: BobS on December 07, 2009, 01:59:22 PM

I cooked it at 650 and it turned out great.

Is that your dome temp or your stone temp? I wonder if anybody on the forums has had success with keeping the temps of both the stone and the dome in sync. I usually end up with a 150F - 200F difference right after the first pie is put in. By the time I'm cooking my third pie, it's taking 10 minutes to finish the top instead of the first pie's 3-4 minutes. Not a big deal, but a little frustrating none the less.

I have a large BGE, plate setter feet down, two-inch high stable pie pan, then BGE 14" stone.

In a typical wood fired pizza oven, what is the normal temp difference between the floor and the upper dome? I realize that the top spot of the dome is the hottest and is used many times to put that final char on the pie.

BobS · « **Reply #26 on:** December 07, 2009, 08:06:26 PM »

Quote from: Parttimepizzaiolo on December 07, 2009, 05:35:06 PM

Is that your dome temp or your stone temp? I wonder if anybody on the forums has had success with keeping the temps of both the stone and the dome in sync. I usually end up with a 150F - 200F difference right after the first pie is put in. By the time I'm cooking my third pie, it's taking 10 minutes to finish the top instead of the first pie's 3-4 minutes. Not a big deal, but a little frustrating none the less.

I have a large BGE, plate setter feet down, two-inch high stable pie pan, then BGE 14" stone.

In a typical wood fired pizza oven, what is the normal temp difference between the floor and the upper dome? I realize that the top spot of the dome is the hottest and is used many times to put that final char on the pie.

I was talking about the dome temp. Right now, I do not have a way to measure the temp on the stone, but I guess I am going to have to get a new toy (I hate it when that happens). The hot air can circulate between the plate setter and the pizza stone, so I have not noted that much difference in the cooking time between pizzas (usually two, but up to four).

SmokinGuitarPlayer · « **Reply #27 on:** December 07, 2009, 08:30:41 PM »

Parttimepizzaiolo

Somewhere on this forum I posted a couple of rather long posts regarding using the BGE for pizza ...the high temps ...the "setup"...and the scorching of crusts, running out of fuel fast, burning of gaskets etc. etc. ...anyway ...if you put in a lot of lump you get high temp and the stone will go over 1000 degrees sometimes ...if you put in less lump ...I think in general you get better "balance" between stone and dome because the fire isn't as close to the stone ..etc. ..anyway ... we get the egg really hot, then insert the "setup" , then monitor the temps and when the stone is around 550 to 600 put on a pizza quick!

Note ..we're one of the leading nomex gasket suppliers for the BGE and it DOES fry at 700degrees ...

essef16 · « **Reply #28 on:** December 07, 2009, 09:21:49 PM »

Fred,

Thanks for the reply.

I just tried cranking up the egg last night with my stone and platesetter setup (i also use 1-1/4 in copper pipe elbows) right after I got the fire in the range of 700deg on the std BGE factory thermostat. Normally, I preheat my stone and platesetter in my oven at 550 for an hour and then add it to the egg once it's been pumping out some serious heat. I did not notice any difference, so I'm thinking on leaning towards the new technique of adding the platesetter setup on the egg once it's up to temp, then letting it heat for a while to get the stone temp up. Yes, I definitely need to get an IR thermometer...anyone know of a good brand/price?

Anyway, my dough is a 65% hydration Caputo dough that I make a day ahead, rise for two hours after making it, punch down, refrigerate, then shape into balls in the morning and let rise throughout the day. I wasn't as impressed with the pizza last night, as I have been repeatedly in the past. I differed in my technique by shaping the dough balls the night prior and alllowing to rise in the fridge like that. It seemed they were a lot more moist than normally when I shape them the day of. I haven't made pies in a little while, so that could have been it too. They cooked fairly similar though, but had some subtle differences.

Generally cook time is around the 1.5-2 minute mark, so I feel my stone temp is quite a bit higher than my dome temp once I put the pie on. With regards to scorching the crust...man I had quite the run last summer. That doesn't seem to be a problem anymore.

I'll have to keep trying to tweek this new method of heating. I was able keep the temp of the dome up around 650 for 40 minutes or so, but it did slowly creep down to around 550 for my last two pies. I've been able to get the dome temp up to 700-725 before, though I had to use a hairdryer to aid the aifrlow.

BobS · « **Reply #29 on:** December 07, 2009, 10:01:25 PM »

For what it's worth, I put in my platesetter and pizza stone as soon as I light the egg. I really need to get an IR thermometer. since I have a 1.5" gap between the stone and the platesetter and since the stone does not see the radiant heat of the fire. I would be surprised if it was hotter than the dome temp., but we'll see.

SmokinGuitarPlayer · « **Reply #30 on:** December 07, 2009, 10:19:02 PM »

BOB , you might be surprised. We tested that setup different ways ... it seems the best way to keep the stone so it doesn't go nuclear is to have about 1/2 " of air ... if we raised it higher , in such a way that left air underneath, it got really hot as the air must've curled under it and reheated it ... I do sometimes use a 1 1/2 high aluminum pan, inverted so it's creating a 1.5" air space but not allowing hot air to get underneath the stone. That seams to work pretty good ..that is the setup in my "Pizza on Egg " video. Please let me know how your experiments turn out etc.
FB/SGP

Pizza on Egg video http://www.fredsmusicandbbq.com/category_s/594.htm

UnConundrum · « **Reply #31 on:** December 08, 2009, 08:11:12 AM »

Hey Fred,
I was just thinking there is one setup no one has reported testing yet, and you're probably the best to do it due to your access to the gear

How about a 12" pizza stone in a large egg? Probably a smaller plate setter too (or something rigged up). I don't think we have a problem bringing the stone to temperature. The issue is usually the dome being cooler and the pizza not cooking evenly. I'm thinking the smaller stone would allow better heat circulation. Please remember to reduce your dough weight for the smaller pie

Parttimepizzaiolo · « **Reply #32 on:** December 08, 2009, 04:29:20 PM »

Quote from: UnConundrum on December 08, 2009, 08:11:12 AM

Hey Fred,
I was just thinking there is one setup no one has reported testing yet, and you're probably the best to do it due to your access to the gear How about a 12" pizza stone in a large egg? Probably a smaller plate setter too (or something rigged up). I don't think we have a problem bringing the stone to temperature. The issue is usually the dome being cooler and the pizza not cooking evenly. I'm thinking the smaller stone would allow better heat circulation. Please remember to reduce your dough weight for the smaller pie

Interesting idea. I hope somebody tries it. I wish somebody would invent something to replace the daisy wheel top with something that let's airflow continue but keeps in the heat. That's what we need. I would imagine tons of heat escapes out of that wide-open top while baking.

schellter · « **Reply #33 on:** February 10, 2010, 07:33:53 PM »

Quote from: SmokinGuitarPlayer on November 04, 2009, 05:36:46 PM

. . . at our store, we have been baking pizza every wednesday for months testing various BGE setups for making pizza ... we've also burned through a lot of gaskets !

Are those Nomex gaskets you are burning through?

Larry

schellter · « **Reply #34 on:** February 10, 2010, 07:36:56 PM »

Seems to me that when I get the BGE up to 550* for the 10 minutes it takes to cook a pizza the remaining lump isn't good for anything. Even though some pieces appear to still have fuel in them they will not give much heat if used on a second burn. Are others having the same experience?

SmokinGuitarPlayer · « **Reply #35 on:** February 10, 2010, 07:45:30 PM »

re: Parttime ....

You are completely correct .... one of the problems is the heat goes out the top with the air .... instead of "lapping" back to the top of the pie.

I actually have a design in my head for a device that will still let the airflow but keep the heat in problem is .... if I make it and put it on ...NOBODY will have the guts to open up the egg because if there's MORE heat trapped in there ...there will be a HUGE FLASHBACK WHEN THE AIR HITS IT ...I think anyway ... but maybe I'll make the gadget and test it ... there goes the arm hair again.

SmokinGuitarPlayer · « **Reply #36 on:** February 10, 2010, 07:48:10 PM »

Schellter ...YES we burned though a ton of nomex gaskets. The nomex has a burn temp of 700 degrees and if you have any leak at all ... or keep the egg open ....the nomex will actually "toast" ... and get like crispy bacon. It won't burn ...that is the benefit of the nomex ..it won't catch fire and burn off ... but over 700 degrees and it starts to toast. (by the way , I sent the original gasket for testing and it has a burn temp of 200 degrees) If the BGE is leak free only the edge of the gasket feels any heat but if you open the egg and have huge flaming mass in there ...it will toast the gasket.

SmokinGuitarPlayer · « **Reply #37 on:** February 10, 2010, 07:50:09 PM »

Schellter .... re: the used charcoal..

High heat uses up a LOT of charcoal. When I do a nuclear burn like in the video, I fill the egg way over the regular full mark (the line between the firebox and the fire ring. ... once up to nuclear temps ..you have maybe a half hour then it will start cooling down because you have used up fuel ... We do this with an xL and IT REALLY GOES NUCLEAR because of that large fuel supply but it eats it FAST.

Temp = Air x fuel

SmokinGuitarPlayer · « **Reply #38 on:** February 10, 2010, 07:57:58 PM »

TO ADD one more thought to this string regarding using the Big Green Egg at 700+ temps.

Since I've been to Tony Gemignani's pizza school I've changed my approach. I am now baking pizza at 600 deg or so on the BGE ... at Tony's restaurant he makes 73 pies a day in the wood / brick oven at 900 deg. ... the rest of the day's pies (hundreds more a day) are all made at lower temps in gas and electric ovens and they are fabulous. Yes, the authentic Vera Napoletana pie needs 900 degrees or it's not authentic but a pizza pie baked in a Ceramic Grill will NEVER be TRULY authentic anyway since it's not made in a wood/brick oven. I'd post some pics but the 125k limitation of this forum makes it too much hassle to massage them all ... soon I will have a compilation link for everyone to check things out regarding my experience at Tony's school.
FB/SGP

mkc · « **Reply #39 on:** February 12, 2010, 05:41:44 PM »

Fred,

I'm looking forward to your compilation! I saw the photos on the BGE board you posted after your trip and I'm very interested in the recipes and techniques your now working with.

Michelle