Author Topic: A pretty easy to do cracker style  (Read 7118 times)

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Offline loowaters

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A pretty easy to do cracker style
« on: December 29, 2009, 11:58:29 PM »
I've been tinkering a lot with this type of pizza for a while.  Long, cold ferments.  Long, room temp ferments.  High yeast cold ferments.  After all the tinkering I've found the best results for me to come from same day/emergency type of fermentation.  There's a couple things that are tough to overcome with a cracker thin style pizza and the biggest issue is its short life.  If you're not eating it immediately out of the oven it certainly isn't getting better with each passing moment.  I'll address one simple thing to do to help extend it's "crackery" lifespan that I've been doing for some time. 

First, the recipe.  This is a 14" pizza.

KAAP Flour (100%):    159g
Water (35%):    58g
Milk (18%):    29g
IDY (.66%):    1g
Salt (1.25%):    2g
Oil (8%):    13g
Total (165%):   262g    TF = 0.06     

Everything goes into the KA mixer with dough hook and blended together at mix speed and once incorporated a bit upped to 2 speed for 5 mins. of kneading.  Room temp rise in a bowl with vented lid.  I just used a deep cereal bowl with Seran Wrap that I punctured 4 times.  Punched down after doubling in size about two hours in and then doubling again about one hour later.  Removed from bowl and rolled out as oven is preheating to 450*.  I use quite a bit of bench flour in rolling this out to 14".  I do not use a standard rolling pin, I have a pastry roller with two sides to it.  My wife calls it my Flintstone's car.  This is an easier roller than a full size rolling pin.  The pics shown are of a pie cooked on a black, hard coat, perforated disk.  Obviously, the disk is not shown.  The disk is 15" and I make the pie just a touch smaller for topping melt off.  I leave the formed skin on the disk for about 15 minutes before dressing to give it a chance to get some gassing going again after rolling it out.  I didn't have any of my own sauce ready today but did have a can of Pastorelli's that I used.  Pastorelli's is too thick for my liking and has a little too much heat on the tail end so I thin it out considerably with water and add about a half teaspoon of sugar, and a half teaspoon of grated parm.  I like the results of those slight adjustments.  Top the skin and into the oven on the middle rack.  Important adjustment that I've found to be quite effective:  raise the oven temp to 500* as it goes in and cook it at that temp.  This probably wouldn't have as big an impact with a gas oven or an electric with the element beneath the floor of the oven, however, my element is exposed and helps brown the bottom nicely as the top doesn't cook as quickly. When browned nicely I get it out of the oven and off the disk immediately onto a cooling rack for a couple minutes before moving to cutting board.  I think this is kinda huge.  That piping hot pie still has a fair amount of moisture that gets trapped underneath whether it's on the disk or more likely on a cutting board.  Allowing the bottom to "breathe" helps to extend the crispness pretty dramatically over when I move it straight to the cutting board for cutting. 

I've also done this on a stone preheated for 45 mins. at 550*.  I loved those results, probably more so than the pie I'm posting, but didn't take pics and this will be easier for most.  Same prep fashion but I used sliced mozz rather than shredded to avoid dumping cheese if I had a stubborn skin coming off the peel.  That's a thin skin and it can get stuck easily.

Any questions, just ask.  Give it a try and post results.  Good luck.  BTW, it's half sausage, half pepperoni.

Loo
Using pizza to expand my waistline since 1969!


Offline Mad_Ernie

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Re: A pretty easy to do cracker style
« Reply #1 on: December 30, 2009, 10:55:22 AM »
I love the party/tavern cut of the pizza, too.   ;D

Nice work and thanks for posting!  :)
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Offline loowaters

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Re: A pretty easy to do cracker style
« Reply #2 on: December 30, 2009, 01:10:21 PM »
I love the party/tavern cut of the pizza, too.   ;D

Mad Ern, it's the only way to go with a thin pie IMHO.  Unfortunately, my wife disagrees and most pies get a pie slice on one half and party cut on the other.  Not this one, she was working late.  Compromise I guess.

Loo
Using pizza to expand my waistline since 1969!

Offline pythonic

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Re: A pretty easy to do cracker style
« Reply #3 on: February 07, 2012, 09:39:58 PM »
I've been messing around with this recipe a little and like it alot.  I have a question though regarding baking.  I've tried this directly on my 550 stone and on my $10 walmart cutter pan with holes and have had decent success.  Bake time on the stone was 5 mins and cutter pan was about 10 mins.  I obviously got a crunchier crust on my stone but im wondering why a cutter pan would be a choice of selection when the crust almost seems underbaked?  Is it used more for par bakes?
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Offline JConk007

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Re: A pretty easy to do cracker style
« Reply #4 on: February 07, 2012, 11:30:14 PM »
Do you dock the skin and par bake? Prior to topping? The cutter pan on the stone is the set up I like on this crust. The hole pans do not allow even cooking in my opinion. The exposed or dough that is exposed to direct heat or not cooked by the pan is different from the full pan crust. Many use the perforated pizza trays with success and they are widely available just not my cup of tea.   I have a few threads there under cracker style, crust " jconk does cracker" and "polly wanted a cracker"it's one of my favorite pizzas.
John
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Offline pythonic

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Re: A pretty easy to do cracker style
« Reply #5 on: February 08, 2012, 10:08:12 AM »
Hi john,

I dont have a docker and have never tried a par bake pizza yet.  Can u par bake without docking it?
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buceriasdon

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Re: A pretty easy to do cracker style
« Reply #6 on: February 08, 2012, 12:13:07 PM »
Use a fork to dock with.
Don

Offline Mad_Ernie

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Re: A pretty easy to do cracker style
« Reply #7 on: February 08, 2012, 05:16:02 PM »
You can use a fork but be very careful.  The idea is to create tiny divets to suppress bubbling, not poke holes through the dough.  You might want to try something like a plastic salad or stirring fork that does not have very pointy prongs.

-ME
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buceriasdon

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Re: A pretty easy to do cracker style
« Reply #8 on: February 08, 2012, 05:26:03 PM »
Yes, If you go to reply 11 you'll see what I use for a dough docker. It works.
Don
http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,12662.0.html

Oh, btw, I'm trying this recipe tonight on a screen in my Hamilton Beach counter top toaster oven.
« Last Edit: February 08, 2012, 05:30:41 PM by buceriasdon »

Offline crispycrusty

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Re: A pretty easy to do cracker style
« Reply #9 on: February 17, 2012, 01:45:44 AM »
loowaters, that pie is making my mouth water. Great stuff. Quick question though (and others feel free to chime in). I notice that with your addition of milk, the hydration level seems to be much higher than other cracker style formulations that I've seen posted on this forum. This leads me to wonder what affect the hydration actually has on producing a classic cracker style crust?  I was under the impression that a low hydration is what makes a cracker crust "crackery." If this is the case, how does the texture of your crust compare to other crusts with a lower hydration?


Online Chicago Bob

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Re: A pretty easy to do cracker style
« Reply #10 on: February 19, 2012, 02:08:36 PM »
I've been messing around with this recipe a little and like it alot.  I have a question though regarding baking.  I've tried this directly on my 550 stone and on my $10 walmart cutter pan with holes and have had decent success.  Bake time on the stone was 5 mins and cutter pan was about 10 mins.  I obviously got a crunchier crust on my stone but im wondering why a cutter pan would be a choice of selection when the crust almost seems underbaked?  Is it used more for par bakes?
Back in the '70s, all of the mom&pop pizza joints I worked at in the Chicago area cooked on non-perforated dark colored pans in a deck oven.Using a dough that is very similar to Loos here (thanks Loo) the pizza would bake up seemingly a bit undercooked.A thin "gum" layer was preferred and the "thin greasy square slices" could be folded over easily to eat fast(if you were really hungry!)

As JConk has suggested,docking and par-baking this dough will turn the above described Chicago thin/bar pizza into a cracker style. Both of these styles turn out extremely well using Loos dough that he has presented here. Look back at that pic of the whole pie.....that cheese browning is perfection man especially with those random half dollar size darker areas...thats not burnt cheese folks, it's flavor'ins and texture! Momma Mia...almost makes me want to cry I tell ya.... :o   The dough has to "work'" right for that type of superior coloration to be going on.

I wonder if loowaters would be kind enough to share with us the type/brand of cheese that was used on that great looking pie?

Keep after it pythonic....you are doing great!

Bob
« Last Edit: February 20, 2012, 11:21:58 AM by Chicago Bob »
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buceriasdon

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Re: A pretty easy to do cracker style
« Reply #11 on: February 19, 2012, 02:27:31 PM »
Bob, Thanks for posting to this thread as I completely forgot to follow up my take on loowaters recipe. :-[ I am in total agreement with you. The recipe worked quite well for me and I know it would work well for others. Sadly I have no photos but as soon as things calm down some, I promise to take pics next time I try it. I'm in the process of opening up a little pizza joint and need to focus on that.
Don

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Re: A pretty easy to do cracker style
« Reply #12 on: February 20, 2012, 11:46:41 AM »
Bob, Thanks for posting to this thread as I completely forgot to follow up my take on loowaters recipe. :-[ I am in total agreement with you. The recipe worked quite well for me and I know it would work well for others. Sadly I have no photos but as soon as things calm down some, I promise to take pics next time I try it. I'm in the process of opening up a little pizza joint and need to focus on that.
Don
Don,

You are quite welcome sir, my pleasure. I am also going to post a pic or two of this great dough in action...going to make it again in a day or two.

Good luck with the new venture Don! I have seen and admired a lot of your work and all I can say is "Momma Mia,those folks living down there near you are in for a real treat! "  ;D

Bob
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Re: A pretty easy to do cracker style
« Reply #13 on: December 22, 2012, 03:28:14 PM »
This is a thing of beauty...loowaters rocks folks!!
"Care Free Highway...let me slip away on you"

Offline PizzaFred

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Re: A pretty easy to do cracker style
« Reply #14 on: August 15, 2013, 12:58:37 PM »
Wow! Looks delicious! An emergency recipe? Pizza is on tonight's menu!

Looking at the pictures, I have to wonder why this thread hasn't gotten more attention. Is there a better thin / cracker style recipe that's getting all the attention that I'm unaware of?

I know this tread is old and that it's unlikely I'll get an answer soon, but I have a few questions. It's the first time I'm using a pizza crust recipe that doesn't contain sugar. Is the yeast feeding from the milk? Does the milk fat content matters? I'm using ADY, will it change anything? What kind of oil are you using? I'll use vegetable oil.

This will be the first time I use baker's percentage as I read a tutorial on this topic on Wild Yeast blog last evening. I used to ignore recipes without volume. Time to use that scale I got last Christmas and never get to use.

Wish me luck! I'll try to post pictures of the result!

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Re: A pretty easy to do cracker style
« Reply #15 on: August 15, 2013, 01:13:01 PM »
Fred,
Use any milk you like; ADY will be fine(maybe even better ;)), as long as you have flour the yeast will feed on that, please use corn oil. Good luck!
Don't forget some pics friend....maybe we'll get this old thread going again, I'm way over do for a good cracker.
Also, search function "premio sausage"  :drool:



edit: Yeast feeds on sugar or converts the starch in the flour to sugar for food. Without the capability to convert starch to sugar for food, yeast would not thrive in sugar free breads such as French bread. Salt impedes the growth of yeast so you can slow down the rise with salt. Conversely, you speed up yeast growth with sugar. An extra half teaspoon of salt will significantly slow the rise of the dough.
« Last Edit: August 15, 2013, 01:16:17 PM by Chicago Bob »
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Offline PizzaFred

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Re: A pretty easy to do cracker style
« Reply #16 on: August 15, 2013, 01:41:08 PM »
Chicago Bob,
Now that is a quick reply and I can't thank you enough for it. Gives me a bit more confidence trying this out. I'm also making some additions to my notebook with your input. Really appreciate it!

I normally activate dry yeast by mixing it with water and sugar, how can I activate it since there is no sugar in this recipe?

Even tough I'm vegetarian, these sausages look pretty nice! Will have to show them off the the girl to night. Speaking of her, she just started a photography course so I will ask here if she'd like to try her new skills out! ;)

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Re: A pretty easy to do cracker style
« Reply #17 on: August 15, 2013, 02:47:00 PM »
Chicago Bob,
Now that is a quick reply and I can't thank you enough for it. Gives me a bit more confidence trying this out. I'm also making some additions to my notebook with your input. Really appreciate it!

I normally activate dry yeast by mixing it with water and sugar, how can I activate it since there is no sugar in this recipe?

Even tough I'm vegetarian, these sausages look pretty nice! Will have to show them off the the girl to night. Speaking of her, she just started a photography course so I will ask here if she'd like to try her new skills out! ;)
Fred,
You can activate the ADY without sugar in a portion of your formula water. Most folks add such a little amount of sugar(literally just a pinch) that it won't affect the recipe. And some people don't even bother with the activation step(after all, there is water in the dough recipe ;)). But if your yeast is suspect, maybe old perhaps, then it is recommended to "proof" it so you know you are good to go in that respect.  Have fun!  :chef:
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Offline Tampa

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Re: A pretty easy to do cracker style
« Reply #18 on: August 15, 2013, 02:59:59 PM »
This is a thing of beauty...loowaters rocks folks!!

That's a big pie Lou.  I don't believe I'd be able to eat all of that.
Dave

Offline PizzaFred

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Re: A pretty easy to do cracker style
« Reply #19 on: August 15, 2013, 03:08:01 PM »
Bob,

You're my hero today for being so helpful! Since I'm confident about my yeast, I'll proceed with the dough making process right now without activating it as you suggested.

I really owe you pics now and I hope that this old forgotten thread can get some traction from others too!

Thanks again!