"Detroit Style" - Buddy's or Shield's

[gschwim]

Anyone here from Detroit?  Anyone familiar with Buddy's Pizza or Shield's Pizza?  It's similar to Sicilian, but not identical.  Any idea of what the recipe would be, at least for the dough?

[Lydia]

Hay there again Gene

I think I might have Sheild's, but I haven't given it a try.  I'm not at my PC right now, but I'll check and post it, if I have the correct SHeild's pizza recipe.

Here it is I found it in my email folder. It's from Fox morning news in Detriot.

FOX 2 News Morning Recipes
SHIELDS PIZZA, MAKING PIZZA AT HOME
CALL 248-356-2720 FOR MORE INFORMATION
ASK FOR PEPT ANDONI
SHIELD'S HOME RECIPE FOR PIZZA DOUGH
Preheat oven to 440°
3 cups white flour
1 teaspoon salt
1-½ teaspoon sugar
1 tablespoon instant dried yeast
1-½ tablespoon whole-wheat flour
2 tablespoons vegetable oil
1-1/4 cups water
In a large mixing bowl combine water, salt, sugar and vegetable oil. Add white flour, whole-wheat flour and instant dried yeast - knead for five minutes until doughy. Turn dough out of the bowl and separate into two halves. Form in circles and let stand for five minutes. Roll dough to 14 inch round pizza crust and let stand for five minutes. Apply toppings. Cook in preheated oven on middle rack for 15 minutes.
SHIELD'S TWO ORIGINAL LOCATIONS ARE 1476 WEST MAPPLE IN TROY, 248/637-3131 AND 25101 TELEGRAPH IN SOUTHFIELD, 248/356-2720. OTHER LOCATIONS INCLUDE DEARBORN, COMMERCE TWP. AND SHELBY TWP.

[gschwim]

Lydia,

So do you live in the Detroit area?

I'm a little confused in that I remember Shield's pizza as being served in rectangular pans, but I'm going to give the recipe a try.

Thanks.

Gene

[Locke]

10 minutes of total rise time  Another case of the "home" recipes bearing no resemblance to their commercial product at all?

[Pete-zza]

I will be very interested in Gene's results.

Peter

[rickmos]

I was born and raised in CLAWSON. Where are you from?

[Lydia]

Gene

I've only been in Detriot in the airport during a flight change-over. So, I'm not even familar with Sheild's beyond this recipe and checking out their home page for a picture reference. Which as you mentioned is indeed square.

Another case of the "home" recipes bearing no resemblance to their commercial product at all?

Locke.. I completely agree that this recipe is lacking.
I posted it because these "recipes" can sometimes help to serve as a baseline if they produce a similar product. Which they "should" and hopefully it will.

This recipe really caught my attention because it actually calls for IDY.

[gschwim]

I'm from Detroit, of course.  Isn't everyone?   

I'll have to disagree slightly about the rising time.  Yes, the rising time may be shorter than what site members prefer, but the idea, in this case, is not to make the best "objective" dough, but to duplicate Shield's pizza dough.  Perhaps, they really do use a short rise time; on the Food Channel, I watched Jaime Oliver do a live show where he ordered a pizza from Domino's, then proceeded to make his own pizze from scratch and have it finished before the Domino's pizza arrived.  Audience members sampled Jaime's pizza and no one complained about the taste.

No doubt, if Shield's uses a fast rise time, a longer rise time would make it even better.  But then, no one has ever accused us Detroiters of having overly sophisticated palates...   

[steverino]

I'm personally a big fan of Loui's pizza.  It's on Dequindre, just north of nine mile.  I believe there is some intermingling history between Shield's, Buddy's and Loui's.  Like the pizzamakers worked together at some point, or their families, or something, and at some point there were separations.  All different pizzas, but very much "Detroit Style" in the similarity of the crusts.  I've been trying to replicate the Loui's crust for years.  I'm close, it's good, but not quite there.

[gschwim]

I just made a pretty good attempt.  Unfortunately, I forgot which dough recipe I used, but I think it was the foccacia dough recipe from Reinhart's American Pie.  I do remember the dough being very soft and not "fragile" (i.e., not much gluten).  I squirted some olive oil on the bottom of an dark, 8x8 square cake pan and used a brush to coat the entire pan.  I put two layers of sliced mozzarella on the bottom, then pepperoni, another layer of cheese, a mixture of browned sweet and hot Italian sausage (too much; I'll use less next time), two more layers of slied mozzarella and four big dabs of 6-in-1 straight out of the can.  I baked it at 450 degrees for about 15 minutes.

It's been 30 years since I left Detroit, so I don't know how close it was to Shield's or Buddy's, but whatever it was, it was surprisingly good.  The dough was a bit "puffy," with a thin bottom/outside and the of the dough being crunchy, and the rest -- well, the best way I can describe it is, "melt in your mouth."

When I run out of my current batch of dough, I'll try to duplicate my results and if I'm successful, I'll post the exact recipe so that others can try it and let me know what they think.

[VICIII]

I'm personally a big fan of Loui's pizza.  It's on Dequindre, just north of nine mile.  I believe there is some intermingling history between Shield's, Buddy's and Loui's.  Like the pizzamakers worked together at some point, or their families, or something, and at some point there were separations.  All different pizzas, but very much "Detroit Style" in the similarity of the crusts.  I've been trying to replicate the Loui's crust for years.  I'm close, it's good, but not quite there.

I am a huge fan of Buddys and shields...
what recipe do you have?  Do Tell
I still have a home in Sylvan Lake MI
I crave a buddys daily.  I miss that pizza and antipasta salads.

[putnam]

Wait. How is it even possible for commercial pizza to undergo only 10 minutes rise? I can't imagine it.

"Hurry, this dough was mixed 30 minutes ago. Use it quick!"

Imagine the labor involved. You'd have to be mixing individual dough portions. For what?

[Pete-zza]

Putnam,

The Shields dough recipe is one intended to be used in the home, not in a commercial operation. No commercial operation would ever make dough in ten minutes, even emergency doughs. I estimate that one tablespoon of IDY is about 2.4% by weight of flour. That is better than double what is commonly used to make an emergency dough with IDY. So, it is possible that the dough can be made and used fairly promptly. Using warm water will help make the dough even faster than using cooler water.

Peter

[putnam]

Totally. So we agree the home recipe is not a reasonable approximation of the original.

It's not about what "site members prefer."

As faint as it is, one can taste lactic acid in Shields' dough.

[VICIII]

Totally. So we agree the home recipe is not a reasonable approximation of the original.

It's not about what "site members prefer."

As faint as it is, one can taste lactic acid in Shields' dough.

And what seems like sherry in there sauce.  A very sweet sauce.  I am not a fan of shields sauce...  Great dough/ crust and toppings but sauce is too sweet.

[steve in FL]

Hi all.. I also originated from the Detroit area, east suburbs, grew up in Macomb County. I have had Shields and/or Buddy's once or twice, but since they weren't nearby, we rarely went out for them. We used to hit them up before a night on the town, whipping it up in Detroit, People-Mover, dancing, greek saganaki, the whole nine-yards.. (that was before the casinos came to town - I miss everything.. lol.. ) anyhow, Gene mentioned that when he attempted his clone, he layered cheese, toppings, then covered with sauce - is that how Sheilds/Buddy's also did it? That sounds Chicagoan, but I didn't remember if they did theirs that way?

I have been a fan of Buscemi's Sicilian pizza throughout high school, up until I relocated to Tampa Bay (14 years ago). I recently went back for a family visit, and had to stop in and get some Buscemis.. sadly, their pizza was totally re-branded and resembles nothing like it used to be in the late 70's.. sigh.. Buscemi's Pizza and Subs was not a restaurant, actually it was a 'party store' (as they were called in MI) that sold pizza by the slice and Italian subs.. which also took a dive, I've found..

Anyhow, I have been somewhat successful in cloning the Buscemi technique, using various dough recipes.. seems the trick of the texture is all in the technique - you allow the dough to rise a bit in a heavily oiled pan, then bake at 450 for 4 minutes. Sauce, toppings, cheese, then an additional 'drizzle' of sauce, and baked again until cheese is melted.

I was planning on making one later tonite, using the dough recipe Lydia posted above from Shields, but am hoping someone might notice my note and confirm if the restaurants do the topping technique in the order that Gene mentioned?

- steve

[Mendocino]

Hey Steve

I too thought Buscemi's was the best 'deep dish" style pizza as a ute.  They had indeed changed their ways sometime in the early 90's, though the shop on Hall road and Van dyke in Utica is still fairly good compared to the others.  Had you manged to duplicate their sweet/oregano sauce?

I have now lived in Northhern Cal, and I can stste there is hardly any good pie to be found, "any style", round here.  With the help of my buddy Bola Bola, I am back into making it myself.

Jake

[BDoggPizza]

Here's the Detroit Style Recipe I use and its comes out just about perfect for me.  We have a local joint here in Iowa that makes Detroit style and I think mine is better.  Try this and see what you think....this is for a 13 inch pan.

Detroit Style Pizza

Dough Recipe               
Flour    9 oz               
Water    5.68 oz just under ¾ cup                   
IDY    1/3 tsp                
Salt    1 tsp               
Oil    ½ tsp                
Sugar    1 1/3 tsp

Toppings
70% Shredded Mozzarella cheese
30% Mild white cheddar cheese
Pizza sauce
meat & veggies

Add the yeast to the flour in a bowl and stir.  Put the water into the bowl of the stand mixer, add the salt and sugar. Stir for about a minute to dissolve the salt & sugar in the water. Using the stir speed of the mixer, gradually add the flour mixture to the water mixture. Once the flour has been taken up by the water and has formed a rough dough ball, add the oil and knead that in, at the stir speed until it has been fully incorporated into the dough. Once the dough has incorporated the oil, continue kneading the dough, at 1 or 2 speed, until the dough takes on a smooth texture and consistency and is elastic, about 5 minutes. It should be a bit tacky--not wet or dry.  It may be necessary to add a bit more flour or a bit more water to achieve the desired finished condition. Once the dough looks right, remove it from the mixer bowl and knead it by hand for about 30 seconds to a minute. If the dough feels a little bit sticky at this point, the final hand kneading will usually cause the stickiness to disappear, so don't be tempted to overcome it by adding more flour. Refrigerate for 24 hrs or up to 48 hrs in an oiled container.

Remove the dough from the refrigerator and allow to rest for one hour. Shape and stretch it out to 13 inches and fit into the pan coated with 1 or 2 tablespoons of olive oil. Push the dough out to the edge of the pan, without forming a rim. Cover the panned dough and proof for an additional 2 hours.

After the dough has proofed and just about doubled in volume, dollop some sauce on top, add the cheese being sure to push the cheese out to the edge, top it. Bake on a pizza stone that has been placed on the lowest oven rack position and preheated for about an hour at 500 degrees F. Bake for about 10-11 minutes.

[Mendocino]

I was home last weekend, and the Hall road Buscemi's is now just as bad as the rest.

Bdogg, at vsome point I will try your recipe.

JT

[Pete-zza]

BDoggPizza,

I took the liberty of converting your dough recipe to a baker's percent format, using the expanded dough calculating tool at http://www.pizzamaking.com/expanded_calculator.html. I got the following:

Flour (100%): Water (63.1111%): IDY (0.3951%): Salt (2.1875%): Olive Oil (0.88183%): Sugar (2.08333%): Total (168.65886%):

255.15 g  |  9 oz | 0.56 lbs 161.03 g  |  5.68 oz | 0.35 lbs 1.01 g | 0.04 oz | 0 lbs | 0.33 tsp | 0.11 tbsp 5.58 g | 0.2 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1 tsp | 0.33 tbsp 2.25 g | 0.08 oz | 0 lbs | 0.5 tsp | 0.17 tbsp 5.32 g | 0.19 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.33 tsp | 0.44 tbsp 430.33 g | 15.18 oz | 0.95 lbs | TF = N/A

I also calculated a thickness factor based on your round 13" pan (deep-dish PSTK) of 0.1143592 [15.179155/(3.14159 x 6.5 x 6.5) = 0.1143592]. That thickness factor can be used with the expanded dough calculating tool, along with the above baker's percents and the "round" option of the tool, to allow one to determine the quantities of ingredients needed for other pan sizes. For example, for a 14" size, which is one of my favorite sizes, I get the following:

Flour (100%): Water (63.1111%): IDY (0.39351%): Salt (2.1875%): Olive Oil (0.88183%): Sugar (2.08333%): Total (168.65727%):

295.91 g  |  10.44 oz | 0.65 lbs 186.75 g  |  6.59 oz | 0.41 lbs 1.16 g | 0.04 oz | 0 lbs | 0.39 tsp | 0.13 tbsp 6.47 g | 0.23 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.16 tsp | 0.39 tbsp 2.61 g | 0.09 oz | 0.01 lbs | 0.58 tsp | 0.19 tbsp 6.16 g | 0.22 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.55 tsp | 0.52 tbsp 499.08 g | 17.6 oz | 1.1 lbs | TF = 0.114359

Note: Pan size = 14"

In my case, I would also use a bowl residue compensation of 1.5% to compensate for minor dough losses during preparation of the dough. That yields the following:

Flour (100%): Water (63.1111%): IDY (0.39351%): Salt (2.1875%): Olive Oil (0.88183%): Sugar (2.08333%): Total (168.65727%):

300.35 g  |  10.59 oz | 0.66 lbs 189.56 g  |  6.69 oz | 0.42 lbs 1.18 g | 0.04 oz | 0 lbs | 0.39 tsp | 0.13 tbsp 6.57 g | 0.23 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.18 tsp | 0.39 tbsp 2.65 g | 0.09 oz | 0.01 lbs | 0.59 tsp | 0.2 tbsp 6.26 g | 0.22 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.57 tsp | 0.52 tbsp 506.57 g | 17.87 oz | 1.12 lbs | TF = 0.1160744

Note: Nominal thickness factor = 0.1143592; pan size = 14"; bowl residue compensation = 1.5%

Of course, using a different pan size and different dough quantity will usually require adjustment of knead times, rise times, bake times, etc.

Peter