BobGraff's Attempt at Aimless Ryan's Tommy's Pizza Clone

[bobgraff]

That looks great Ted.  Nice work!

[bobgraff]

12/13/2022 Dough

410 g Mondako bread flour
175 g water (42.6%)
31 g soybean oil
4 g sugar
6 g IDY
6 g salt

Dough Prep
9 hour RT ferment, loosely mixed dough refrigerated in zip lock bag for
3 days. Dough warmed at RT for 5 hours.

Sauce
1 + 1/2 cups Stanislaus Tomato Magic ground tomatoes (strained)
3/16 tsp garlic powder
7/32 tsp black pepper
1/8 tsp oregano
1/8 tsp olive oil
1 tbsp Romano cheese



Cheese
1 cup Tillamook Mozzarella
1/4 cup Red Apple Smoked Provolone


The Bake
7 min par bake (parchment on steel @ 475) + 7.5 minutes @ 475, fully dressed (screened on steel)

Results
Made dough this week with the intention of exploring the effects of extended room temperature fermentation.  The dough was left out on the counter (covered) for 9 hours, then placed in a ziplock in the fridge for several more days.  The dough had a more prominent fermented smell when I rolled it out, but I did not notice any change in flavor or texture.  Will plan to further increase the RT rest for the next iteration.

I found that my local grocer where I buy my Ezzo pepperoni recently began selling a sliced version of their sausage.  Their sausage has a more mild flavor than their pep, but they do pair well together. 

[tedcholl]

You still got the pizza touch! Looks delish.  Just bought some of the tomatoes, I'm going to try your sauce recipe again.
Ted

[bobgraff]

12/20/2022 Dough

410 g Mondako bread flour
175 g water (42.6%)
31 g soybean oil
4 g sugar
6 g IDY
6 g salt

Dough Prep
18 hour RT ferment, loosely mixed dough refrigerated in zip lock bag for
2 days. Dough warmed at RT for 3 hours.

Sauce
1 + 1/2 cups Stanislaus Tomato Magic ground tomatoes (strained)
3/16 tsp garlic powder
7/32 tsp black pepper
1/8 tsp oregano
1 tbsp Romano cheese


Cheese
1 cup Walmart Whole milk Mozzarella
1/4 cup Red Apple Smoked Provolone


The Bake
7 min par bake (parchment on steel @ 475) + 8.5 minutes @ 475, fully dressed (screened on steel)

Results
Extended room temperature fermentation experiment continued.  Left the mixed dough on the kitchen counter for 18 hours, before moving it to the fridge.  The finished crust wasn't tough per se, but definitely chewier and less crispy.  The crust did not seem brown as much, even given the extra minute in the oven. 

The Walmart cheese melted nice, but was somewhat bland.  I have used it in the past and recall being more impressed with it.

I was more generous with the sauce on my previous pizzas and thought the garlic and pepper was a bit too strong.  The sauce applied here was limited to exactly a 1/2 cup and seemed to be there right amount. 

[bobgraff]

2/5/2023 Dough

410 g Mondako bread flour
175 g water (42.6%)
28 g soybean oil
4 g sugar
6 g IDY
6 g salt

Dough Prep
4 hour RT ferment, loosely mixed dough refrigerated in zip lock bag for
7 days. Dough warmed at RT for 4 hours.

Sauce
1 + 1/2 cups Stanislaus Tomato Magic ground tomatoes (strained)
3/16 tsp garlic powder
7/32 tsp black pepper
1/8 tsp oregano
1 tbsp Romano cheese


Cheese
1 cup Tillamook Mozzarella
1/8 cup Ambrosi Smoked Scamorza (smoked mozzarella)


The Bake
7 min par bake (parchment on steel @ 475) + 7.5 minutes @ 475, fully dressed (screened on steel)

Results
I had originally intended to make pizza 36 hours after making the dough, however the first dough ball fought my rolling pin to the point that I aborted the effort and ordered pizza.  The same dough ball easily rolled out six days later, however the pizza made from it was notably more tough than the pizza made from its sibling dough balls.

First time using Scamorza.  I only used a small amount as I had read that Scamorza can be extremely salty, however this brand seemed more smokey than anything.  I could not taste it on the finished pizzas, so I will definitely use more the next time.  This particular brand probably isn't the best example, but I wasn't willing to shell out $15 per cheese ball for the good stuff.

[bobgraff]

3/28/2023 Dough

410 g Mondako bread flour
175 g water (42.6%)
28 g soybean oil
4 g sugar
6 g IDY
6 g salt

Dough Prep
4 hour RT ferment, loosely mixed dough refrigerated in zip lock bag for
6 days. Dough warmed at RT for 6 hours.
Pizza skin stored in fridge for 16 hours.  Rolled out a 2nd time to account for shrinkage.

Sauce
1 + 1/2 cups Stanislaus Tomato Magic ground tomatoes (strained)
3/16 tsp garlic powder
7/32 tsp black pepper
1/8 tsp oregano
1 tbsp Romano cheese


Cheese
3/4 cup Tillamook Mozzarella
3/4 cup Red Apple Smoked Provolone


The Bake
8 minutes @ 475, fully dressed (screened on steel)

Results
I was so excited to bake this one.  Storing the rolled out pizza skin in my refrigerator for 16 hours to "cure" the dough produced a dense and heavy feeling to the pizza skin that I had observed inTommy's take & bake pizzas.  After impatiently waiting 60+ minutes for my pizza steel to pre-heat, I topped the pizza as usual and opened the oven .... F*** .... I pre-heated the wrong oven.  After another 60+ minutes, the correct oven was ready - in went the pizza.

Probably the worst pizza I've made in years. 

The crust was hard, dense, and under-baked.  Was my crust curing experiment a failure?  Not at all - just needs more experimenting.  I think my fatal mistake was rolling out the dough a second time.  Guessing I need to increase the amount of dough I use per pizza to allow me to roll out a larger skin to account for shrinking.

[bobgraff]

3/28/2023 Dough

410 g Mondako bread flour
175 g water (42.6%)
28 g soybean oil
4 g sugar
6 g IDY
6 g salt

Dough Prep
4 hour RT ferment, loosely mixed dough refrigerated in zip lock bag for
6 days. Dough warmed at RT for 6 hours.
Pizza skin stored in fridge for 16 hours.  Rolled out a 2nd time to account for shrinkage.

Sauce
1 + 1/2 cups Stanislaus Tomato Magic ground tomatoes (strained)
3/16 tsp garlic powder
7/32 tsp black pepper
1/8 tsp oregano
1 tbsp Romano cheese


Cheese
3/4 cup Tillamook Mozzarella
3/4 cup Red Apple Smoked Provolone


The Bake
8 minutes @ 475, fully dressed (screened on steel)

Results
I was so excited to bake this one.  Storing the rolled out pizza skin in my refrigerator for 16 hours to "cure" the dough produced a dense and heavy feeling to the pizza skin that I had observed inTommy's take & bake pizzas.  After impatiently waiting 60+ minutes for my pizza steel to pre-heat, I topped the pizza as usual and opened the oven .... F*** .... I pre-heated the wrong oven.  After another 60+ minutes, the correct oven was ready - in went the pizza.

Probably the worst pizza I've made in years. 

The crust was hard, dense, and under-baked.  Was my crust curing experiment a failure?  Not at all - just needs more experimenting.  I think my fatal mistake was rolling out the dough a second time.  Guessing I need to increase the amount of dough I use per pizza to allow me to roll out a larger skin to account for shrinking.

[bobgraff]

3/28/2023 Dough

410 g Mondako bread flour
175 g water (42.6%)
28 g soybean oil
4 g sugar
6 g IDY
6 g salt

Dough Prep
4 hour RT ferment, loosely mixed dough refrigerated in zip lock bag for
6 days. Dough balls frozen for 7 days, then defrosted at RT for 6 hours.
Rolled out pizza skin sat uncovered for 15 minutes.


Sauce
1 + 1/2 cups Stanislaus Tomato Magic ground tomatoes (strained)
3/16 tsp garlic powder
7/32 tsp black pepper
1/8 tsp oregano
1 tbsp Romano cheese


Cheese
1/4 cup Tillamook Mozzarella
1 cup Red Apple Smoked Provolone


The Bake
7 min par bake (parchment on steel @ 475) + 8.5 minutes @ 475, fully dressed (screened on steel)

Results
Struggling to get find time to roll out pizza skins ahead of time to allow for "dough curing".  Per discussion here, I'd like to try curing for 2 hours per side. 

This pizza came out super crispy (wife thought too much so), but I attribute that to dough age.

[bobgraff]

4/10/2023 Dough

451 g All Trumps flour
192 g water (42.6%)
31 g soybean oil
4.4 g sugar
6.6 g IDY
6.6 g salt

Dough Prep
4 hour RT ferment, loosely mixed dough refrigerated in zip lock bag for
6 days. Dough balls frozen for 7 days, then defrosted at RT for 8 hours.
The second rolled out pizza skin was cured in the fridge uncovered for 3 hours.


Sauce
1 + 1/2 cups Stanislaus Tomato Magic ground tomatoes (strained)
3/16 tsp garlic powder
7/32 tsp black pepper
1/8 tsp oregano
1 tbsp Romano cheese


Cheese
3/4 cup Tillamook Mozzarella
3/4 cup Red Apple Smoked Provolone


The Bake
8 min par bake (parchment on steel @ 475) + 7.5 minutes @ 475, fully dressed (screened on steel)

Results
Finally ran out of Mondako bread flour, so I took a chance on a 25 lbs bag of All Trumps high-gluten flour.  These pizzas turned out pretty tough.  Note that I did increase the the ingredient amounts across the board by 10% in expectation that the pizza skins would shrink due to the higher gluten flour.  Based on my previous experience with this flour, I'd hazard a guess that the flour is mostly to blame.  While I know All Trumps flour makes great hand stretched pizzas, it does not seem to work well under a rolling pin.

Cured vs Uncured
The skin for pizza #2 (olive and peppers) was rolled out and placed in the fridge for 3 hours, uncovered.  The uncovered side would become the bottom of the pizza crust.  Both pizzas were par baked and baked at the same time and temps.  Comparing the two, the "cured" pizza crust had a harder crunch to it, similar to that of a slightly wet taco shell (not good).  Kenji's recipe that uses curing is 50% water and 10% oil, so perhaps the hydration level needs to be adjusted upwards.

Decided to be daring and try an anchovy pizza (on half of pizza #2).  I like anchovies on salads and in some pasta dishes, but don't love them on pizza.  I opted to use white anchovies thinking they would be milder.  They were ok (kinda like a salty canned tuna), but won't be doing it again.  My cat was happy that I didn't come close to finishing the tin, so at least he's enjoying them.

[bobgraff]

5/1/2023 Dough

410 g Kryol flour
205 g water (50%)
41 g soybean oil
4 g sugar
6 g IDY
6 g salt

Dough Prep
2 hour RT ferment, loosely mixed dough refrigerated in zip lock bag for
6 days. Dough warmed at RT for 4 hours.

Sauce
1 + 1/2 cups Stanislaus Tomato Magic ground tomatoes (strained)
3/16 tsp garlic powder
7/32 tsp black pepper
1/8 tsp oregano
1 tbsp Romano cheese


Cheese
3/4 cup Tillamook Mozzarella
3/4 cup "Red Apple Cheese" smoked Provolone

The Bake
8 min par bake (parchment on steel @ 475) + 7 minutes @ 475, fully dressed (screened on steel)

Results
Another attempt at dough curing, this time with a higher hydration dough (50%, up from 43%).  The dough was extremely easy to roll out.  As with my recent pizzas, the first pizza was rolled out and par-baked without being cured.  The second pizza was rolled out earlier in the day and sat in my refrigerator uncovered for several hours.  I had hoped that the added hydration would help with the toughness I had observed with the previous cured pizza crusts, but it did not.  The first pizza however was extremely light and crispy and may warrant raising the hydration of my regular recipe. 

I think I am done with dough curing.  While it's been fun experimenting, I just can't seem to produce a better pizza using it vs my standard recipe. 

Bonus video:  My son graciously shot a video of my roll out procedure using a pie bag.

https://youtu.be/eegI0jRo7_A

[tedcholl]

Well, it was worth the try!   Like the video as well, very helpful to see exactly how you do  it.

Ted

[pizzapartee]

I've never heard of this style of pizza but wow, it looks really interesting! I can't begin to fathom what a pizza with this kind of layered, flaky texture would eat like. I might have to try this.

Any tips for a beginner? Your experiments are exhaustive but not sure where to start.

5/1/2023 Dough

410 g Kryol flour
205 g water (50%)
41 g soybean oil
4 g sugar
6 g IDY
6 g salt

Dough Prep
2 hour RT ferment, loosely mixed dough refrigerated in zip lock bag for
6 days. Dough warmed at RT for 4 hours.

Sauce
1 + 1/2 cups Stanislaus Tomato Magic ground tomatoes (strained)
3/16 tsp garlic powder
7/32 tsp black pepper
1/8 tsp oregano
1 tbsp Romano cheese


Cheese
3/4 cup Tillamook Mozzarella
3/4 cup "Red Apple Cheese" smoked Provolone

The Bake
8 min par bake (parchment on steel @ 475) + 7 minutes @ 475, fully dressed (screened on steel)

Results
Another attempt at dough curing, this time with a higher hydration dough (50%, up from 43%).  The dough was extremely easy to roll out.  As with my recent pizzas, the first pizza was rolled out and par-baked without being cured.  The second pizza was rolled out earlier in the day and sat in my refrigerator uncovered for several hours.  I had hoped that the added hydration would help with the toughness I had observed with the previous cured pizza crusts, but it did not.  The first pizza however was extremely light and crispy and may warrant raising the hydration of my regular recipe. 

I think I am done with dough curing.  While it's been fun experimenting, I just can't seem to produce a better pizza using it vs my standard recipe. 

Bonus video:  My son graciously shot a video of my roll out procedure using a pie bag.

https://youtu.be/eegI0jRo7_A

[bobgraff]

Any tips for a beginner? Your experiments are exhaustive but not sure where to start.

Here are some basic tips I've picked up along the way...

• Weigh the ingredients for consistent results.
• Dough flavor is greatly enhanced by allowing the dough to slowly ferment in the refrigerator for several days (3-5).
• Bake on a pizza stone or pizza steel that has been pre-heated for an hour.
• Par-bake the pizza skin on parchment paper for ease
• Do the second bake on a pizza screen or direct on the oven rack.  Baking direct on the pizza stone/steel a second time will result in a burnt bottom crust.

The dough isn't terribly sticky, so it's easy to work with.  I'd recommend using 48% water and a bit less oil as it will be easier to roll out.  Let me know if you have specific questions I can answer.

[bobgraff]

6/11/2024 Dough

410 g Kryol flour
198 g water (50%)
30 g Crisco shortening
4 g sugar
6 g IDY
6 g salt

Dough Prep
3 hour RT ferment, loosely mixed dough refrigerated in zip lock bag for
3 days. Dough warmed at RT for 4 hours.

Sauce
1 + 1/2 cups Stanislaus Tomato Magic ground tomatoes (strained)
3/16 tsp garlic powder
7/32 tsp black pepper
1/8 tsp oregano
1 tbsp Romano cheese


Cheese
3/4 cup Tillamook Mozzarella
3/4 cup "Red Apple Cheese" smoked Provolone

The Bake
7 min par bake (parchment on steel @ 475) + 6 minutes @ 475, fully dressed (screened on steel)

Results
Pizzas for a potluck lunch at work.  I used (melted) Crisco as I was out of the vegetable oil I prefer to use.  Crisco makes crispier dough, but perhaps its flavor isn't quite as good IMO.  The onions and mushrooms were precooked in a 250 oven for a few minutes to soften and take some bite out of the onion.  Worked well.  Received lots of compliments, which is always nice to hear! 

[tedcholl]

Beautiful and delicious looking pizza.  You still got it BobGraff!! 

[Mad_Ernie]

Those are pies of beauty, Bob.

Another great job. Well done!

-ME

[tedcholl]

6/11/2024 Dough

410 g Kryol flour
198 g water (50%)
30 g Crisco shortening
4 g sugar
6 g IDY
6 g salt

Dough Prep
3 hour RT ferment, loosely mixed dough refrigerated in zip lock bag for
3 days. Dough warmed at RT for 4 hours.

Sauce
1 + 1/2 cups Stanislaus Tomato Magic ground tomatoes (strained)
3/16 tsp garlic powder
7/32 tsp black pepper
1/8 tsp oregano
1 tbsp Romano cheese


Cheese
3/4 cup Tillamook Mozzarella
3/4 cup "Red Apple Cheese" smoked Provolone

The Bake
7 min par bake (parchment on steel @ 475) + 6 minutes @ 475, fully dressed (screened on steel)

Results
Pizzas for a potluck lunch at work.  I used (melted) Crisco as I was out of the vegetable oil I prefer to use.  Crisco makes crispier dough, but perhaps its flavor isn't quite as good IMO.  The onions and mushrooms were precooked in a 250 oven for a few minutes to soften and take some bite out of the onion.  Worked well.  Received lots of compliments, which is always nice to hear! 

Bought some Kyrol flour and really like it!  Thanks for the info!  Also, I did respond to your message Bobgraff.  Thanks!