par baked vs straight baked?

[Trout]

Andrew, do you top and bake the pizza while its still frozen, or do you leave it out until its more or less thawed?

[Andrew t]

Andrew, do you top and bake the pizza while its still frozen, or do you leave it out until its more or less thawed?

For my pop up I let them defrost. I have baked from frozen for day off snacks, works fine. Longer bake and toppings can over cook if heat is too high. I've also made take and bake pies for friends with still frozen dough that all came out well.

I'm sure the whole thing would work just fine to make a bake from frozen pizza. The Modernist cusine folks have a good process they cover on the latest podcast. Someday, as my operation grows I'll figure out a market to sell it to. It would be a great option for a retail store in the fridge or freezer case.

Good luck.

Andrew

[Pizzabobs143]

Howdy,

I've done some side-by-side tests on doing the par bake vs straight bake with as identical of dough as can be. There hasn't been a hugely noticeable difference in results between the two. Currently being in a Detroit style spot with some amount of volume we've opted to par bake. This allows orders to come out a bit faster along with allowing us to have a greater amount of pizza's on hand than our pans would normally allow and takes away some of the working out logistics of proofing during service.

D3bsie.

Hey Debsie,

Can you share a bit of the par bake process? Do you let it rise in the pans first then par bake? Or you can go from refrigerated dough direct into pan and bake?

Trying to figure out the easiest process for high volume having hundreds of pans doesn't sound like a solution.

[nikolausp]

yes, I leave it in the pan, covered, and slightly vented (some steam but not a bath) to cool. I think the covering and preserving the moisture keeps the crumb moister, less light, without being gummy or under cooked. When I do Sicilian I pull it and cool on a rack.

Jack- finely grated in now my go to. I can't get white cheddar affordable in bulk. The yellow cheddar works fine and doesn't over brown but I prefer the cleaner flavor of jack. Now that I sell them at my pop ups I've taken to calling the Sactown Square Pan Pizza. I feel like that way if guests know Detroit they ask about it, if not I can just sell it as a great pan pizza with caramelized cheese crust.

last point- freezing after par-bake is a John Arena method that really improves the lightness. Not 100% needed but it is does eat lighter and really makes the production for my pop up much simpler.

Just curious, how long do you think is optimal to freeze these after the par bake?

[Andrew t]

nikolausp-
I've frozen a short as overnight and up to 2 weeks. No noticable difference. Just thatw completly before baking.

Andrew

[Scwop291]

Hey Andrew,

Do you leave it out to thaw while it's still vacuum sealed?

Do you partially freeze it covered so the pressure from the machine doesn't flatten it out too much?

Also when topping after it thaws do you concentrate cheese around the edges the same even though there is some there from the par bake?

I'm kinda struggling with the middle of my DSP 10x14 crust still being a wee bit wet.. the browning underneath and up top are text book.

I was thinking about putting it on a steel, do you think that will jump start the rise of the crust?

Cheers,

Derek

[stamina888]

In my opinion, it depends on whether the dough cooks faster than the toppings or not.  And this depends on your dough formulation, crust thickness, and oven temperature.

A thicker crust may need to cook longer than a thinner one.

A dough with less oil may take more time to brown than a dough with less oil.

Your mileage may vary, and much of it is up to preference.

[PelletPizzaJoe]

I have read some of the discussion on par baking vs direct.   I've never tried the par baked, I'm against it on principle alone... that being the principle that I'm lazy.

I don't really see the need, and the thought of pulling a half done pizza out of the oven to finish putting the toppings on, just seems like a lot of work.

Then there seems to be what I think could be a valid argument made, that the melding of flavors into the top portion of the dough during a direct bake, is part of what makes a Detroit Pizza special.

Having said all that, I'm far from an expert.  I just know that the few times I've made Detroit Style pizza, I had no problem making a pretty darn good pizza doing it direct bake, so taking an extra step to par bake, seems unnecessary

[HansB]

I agree. No shops in the Detroit area par-bake DS. Shops like Blue Pan in Denver par-bake to make production easier/faster. That's about the only reason I can see to par-bake.

[Bobby Lawn]

Both have their advantages (pepperoni on the bottom layer flavouring the dough for direct bakes.....speed for customers on the par-baked...)

I'm going with par-bake at my pop ups so that I can tend to the dough during the day - then have an employee finish the pies later that night. Easier to train someone to do toppings than dough management. (IMHO)

With my still evolving knowledge of ferments - this allows me to bake the dough when it's peaking rather than missing the opportunity later and having over proofed dough/too cold from the fridge, etc...

[Jose L. Piedra]

par-baking any square pie yields a much crunchier and distinctly toasted-tasting product

[Ischia]

I par-bake my Detroit dough but I spray it liberally with water and bake until the dough just starts to look dry which is only about 5 min at 500º. I like to use higher hydration dough for Detroit so I par-bake to keep the dough from collapsing under all the cheese that I insist on. The water keeps the top of the crust from getting too dry and also seems to help prevent shrinking.

[Bobby Lawn]

I par-bake my Detroit dough but I spray it liberally with water

hmmm, I like this water idea. When say 'liberally' - how much are you talking?

Are you using a spray bottle to mist it? Wetting your hands and touching it?

[HansB]

hmmm, I like this water idea. When say 'liberally' - how much are you talking?

Are you using a spray bottle to mist it? Wetting your hands and touching it?

You could try a bit of very thinned out tomato sauce pre-bake like they do for Sicilians if you want to go the par-bake route.

[Bobby Lawn]

You could try a bit of very thinned out tomato sauce pre-bake like they do for Sicilians if you want to go the par-bake route.

Never thought of doing that for a Detroit. Will try that this week and see how it goes.