Benefit to a darker stone?

[nanometric]

Hello

I've baked on a cordierite pizza stone for many years (Old Stone Oven, 14" x 16" x 0.5", plus raised lugs on the bottom—purpose/intent of those unknown). It looks more or less the same as when I bought it, except for a few dark stains from spills, and freckling from DSP oil-spatter. Given the known properties of dark baking surfaces, often beneficial for pizza, I wonder: is there any benefit to a darker cordierite stone? If so, how to make it darker without introducing undesirable side-effects? It would be especially interesting to hear from those who have successfully undertaken such a task, and done enough baking with darkened / undarkened stones to have made meaningful comparisons.

Sample of typical web info (for laughs) :

https://giordanos.com/how-to-clean-a-pizza-stone/

You should not oil your pizza stone because the stone's porous surface does not season as a cast-iron skillet does. In fact, seasoning a pizza stone does not offer any benefits.

A darkened pizza stone means more seasoning and better non-stick power. Be proud of your stains!

To season a new pizza stone naturally and without caking it with oil or grease, bake a loaf of buttery bread or some cookies on your stone to begin the seasoning process.

[02ebz06]

I've never done anything to my stones other than brush loose stuff off.

[mosabrina]

pizzas don't stick to a pizza stone unless the stone is too hot. Not sure the dark surface even makes a meaningful difference.

The new scorpio pizza oven does come with a dark stone but I wonder if it is just to hide stains

In my outdoor oven the stone can be removed and rotated/flipped over. It looks 100% clean. In a nonremovable stone oven like roccbox or one like Koda 16 where it can't be rotated, I imagine the front takes longer to get clean.

[Timpanogos Slim]

pizzas don't stick to a pizza stone unless the stone is too hot. Not sure the dark surface even makes a meaningful difference.

The new scorpio pizza oven does come with a dark stone but I wonder if it is just to hide stains

In my outdoor oven the stone can be removed and rotated/flipped over. It looks 100% clean. In a nonremovable stone oven like roccbox or one like Koda 16 where it can't be rotated, I imagine the front takes longer to get clean.

I've never had a pizza stick to a stone except as a result of a tear or as the result of liquid soaking through the dough. I've gone as high as the low 900's F and the bad thing that happened was my malted flour based dough burned.

A black stone will absorb infrared more readily but it's a mistake to imagine that heat is just infrared light. It's not. Heat is a form of energy, and materials emit infared light as a result of being heated. Different materials have different coefficients of infrared emission so the reading from an IR thermometer is always an approximation unless you know the coefficient of the material you are measuring and what coefficient the ir thermometer was programmed with. Bright metal in particular typically has a poor coefficient of emissivity and this is something i have to tell people trying to troubleshoot 3d printers with some regularity. That the reason their $7 IR gun reads brushed aluminum temperature lower than the thermistor embedded in the metal is because of the technology, not the temperature.

A black pizza stone will probably have a higher coefficient of emissivity than natural cordierite, but I'm not sure by how much, or even if that is actually the case. If you really needed to know the exact temperature, you'd need to embed a pt1000 RTD within the stone or something. And even then, you'd want to calibrate it with known temperatures such as the boiling point of water at your elevation, etc.

I doubt that there's a considerable upside to a clean pizza stone. Conversely, the people who recommend "seasoning" a pizza stone should shut up because there's almost certainly no upside to that either.

If you bake on a layer of cheese and sauce, apply more heat until it carbonizes and brush off the crusty bits.

Otherwise, the stains are just evidence of your efforts.

[HansB]

pizzas don't stick to a pizza stone unless the stone is too hot.

What's too hot? At close to 1,000° F I've not had pizza stick to a stone. Dough may stick if you try to move it too soon after placing it on the stone at any temp.

[TXCraig1]

Given the known properties of dark baking surfaces, often beneficial for pizza, I wonder: is there any benefit to a darker cordierite stone?

Darker is better, however the difference in emissivity between a lightly and heavily used/darkened stone is going to be pretty trivial. I don't I do anything to intentionally darker the stone.

[mosabrina]

What's too hot? At close to 1,000° F I've not had pizza stick to a stone. Dough may stick if you try to move it too soon after placing it on the stone at any temp.

with cordierite I notice above 850-900 on the stone (I think in an oven like roccbox it's hard to get an accurate temp reading due to the angle) I notice the pizza feels sort of "suctioned" to the stone for lack of a better word.

With other stones I imagine it's different just talking about cordierite

You definitely have to be more agressive to get it off the stone and the bottom is too charred at that point. I feel like much hotter and the pizzas would genuinely stick.

[Timpanogos Slim]

with cordierite I notice above 850-900 on the stone (I think in an oven like roccbox it's hard to get an accurate temp reading due to the angle) I notice the pizza feels sort of "suctioned" to the stone for lack of a better word.

With other stones I imagine it's different just talking about cordierite

You definitely have to be more agressive to get it off the stone and the bottom is too charred at that point. I feel like much hotter and the pizzas would genuinely stick.

Haven't noticed that on the cordierite in my green mountain grills pizza oven, which i have been heating to around 850 regularly lately.

[TXCraig1]

What's too hot? At close to 1,000° F I've not had pizza stick to a stone. Dough may stick if you try to move it too soon after placing it on the stone at any temp.

I notice a sticking at 950-1000F on Saputo that I don't notice on Sorrento.

[mosabrina]

Haven't noticed that on the cordierite in my green mountain grills pizza oven, which i have been heating to around 850 regularly lately.

That's my point. In these low dome pizza ovens you can't get an accurate temp reading. The IR gun has a minimum size you area needs to be based on the distance and also the angle makes it already inaccurate. 850 on cordierite is like 60 sec Neapolitan temps with a dark bottom.

[Timpanogos Slim]

That's my point. In these low dome pizza ovens you can't get an accurate temp reading. The IR gun has a minimum size you area needs to be based on the distance and also the angle makes it already inaccurate. 850 on cordierite is like 60 sec Neapolitan temps with a dark bottom.

I couldn't say with any accuracy how long these are taking because I don't have someone standing next to me with a stopwatch and I'm too busy with the baking process itself. I had to switch to a dough with no added sugar or oil because the bottom was burning to a bitter black.

One of the flaws of the GMG pizza attachment, the version i have anyway, is that it has a bit of an underbite. The front of the stone is not fully covered by the lid. So i can actually get a pretty reasonable angle with the IR gun.

The lid comes off, though, and i guess i could preheat it for 45 minutes, put on some welding gloves and remove the lid, and see what the IR gun says at a straight 90 degrees.

[mosabrina]

The welding gloves I have are thin and you definitely can't remove a hot stone.

When my stone gets too hot i end up with large portions of black crust and then large portions of non charred crust. IT's the black portions which seem to "suction" to the stone in a way and burn a bit more.

[Timpanogos Slim]

The welding gloves I have are thin and you definitely can't remove a hot stone.

When my stone gets too hot i end up with large portions of black crust and then large portions of non charred crust. IT's the black portions which seem to "suction" to the stone in a way and burn a bit more.

Yeah won't touch the stone. But the SS lid, maybe i can quickly lift off and place on a non-flammable surface.

[foreplease]

What's too hot? At close to 1,000° F I've not had pizza stick to a stone. Dough may stick if you try to move it too soon after placing it on the stone at any temp.

True for so many foods and cooking surfaces. Anne Burrell's mantra is always uppermost on my mind: "Brown food tastes good!"

[TXCraig1]

Brown is the color of flavor.

[nanometric]

Darker is better, however the difference in emissivity between a lightly and heavily used/darkened stone is going to be pretty trivial. I don't I do anything to intentionally darker the stone.

Copy that. I'm thinking: might heat up / recover slightly faster. Prolly no appreciable benefit - musta been in super-nerd mode when I posed that question. That, and the contradictory info about "seasoning" a stone was amusing...