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Offline parallei

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Re: Finding eager Employees
« Reply #40 on: April 21, 2017, 01:02:28 PM »

I can think of a million reasons. Maybe because he is passionate about pizza and fascinated by the intricacies of dough. Maybe because he wants to practise each day to become really good at something, a quality which is so rare, to transcend mere technique, to master a craft. Maybe because he loves the rush of service, the heat and noise of the kitchen, standing directly in front of the guests, and receiving, instantaneously, their honest feedback as they have their first bite. Maybe he enjoys coming home from work, sitting in the sofa with a cold beer, feeling tired and knowing full well that he has put in a hard day's work. The pay aint great, but it's OK for his current life situation, and besides, he knows that hard work and dedication always pay off in the long run. Maybe he has plans in his head, he will work hard and learn as much as possible, for one day it will be his name on the door.

Add a cute wife and a few kids and that doesn't sound like a bad life to me.

That all sounds quite lovely, and I certainly believe that all work is, or can be, noble.  However, the reality is that on a minimum or near minimum wage, the cute wife/husband, couple of kids and housing are out or reach.  At least in this country.

Offline waltertore

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Re: Finding eager Employees
« Reply #41 on: April 21, 2017, 03:15:59 PM »
That all sounds quite lovely, and I certainly believe that all work is, or can be, noble.  However, the reality is that on a minimum or near minimum wage, the cute wife/husband, couple of kids and housing are out or reach.  At least in this country.

The restaurant industry has historically been staffed, other than head chef and owners, by people on the fringe of survival.  It has only recently become a "hip" profession with all the cable TV cooking shows.  Family run places were pretty big in years gone by but now it is mostly hiring outsiders.  Thus it has become more important to screen employees and pay them a decent wage.  Walter
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Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Finding eager Employees
« Reply #42 on: April 21, 2017, 04:19:56 PM »
The restaurant industry has historically been staffed, other than head chef and owners, by people on the fringe of survival. 

It took me the better part of 10 years after graduating college and getting a "real" job to make more money than I did as a waiter/bartender during college.
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Offline waltertore

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Re: Finding eager Employees
« Reply #43 on: April 21, 2017, 04:59:26 PM »
It took me the better part of 10 years after graduating college and getting a "real" job to make more money than I did as a waiter/bartender during college.

I am talking kitchen help-forgot to specify that.  It was a rough crew that manned that area in the 60's early 70's.  I learned a lot of bad habits working in kitchens :)  Today there are more college educated people in the kitchen than I ever remember growing up but the big operations still rely on the old school, smokers, rough and tumbles, for help and a big part is they still pay terrible.  Artisan shops tend to pay more, are hip for young people to work in, and usually are geared towards the hip clientele.  My wife made over $300/night in tips at a nice NJ Italian place in the early 80's.  Walter
« Last Edit: April 21, 2017, 05:04:43 PM by waltertore »
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Offline parallei

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Re: Finding eager Employees
« Reply #44 on: April 21, 2017, 05:36:15 PM »
I am talking kitchen help-forgot to specify that. ...... My wife made over $300/night in tips at a nice NJ Italian place in the early 80's.  Walter

From what I understand, there is a trend these days to share the tips with the kitchen help.  That can only be good.

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Offline waltertore

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Re: Finding eager Employees
« Reply #45 on: April 21, 2017, 06:04:26 PM »
From what I understand, there is a trend these days to share the tips with the kitchen help.  That can only be good.

We pool all tips for the week and then disperse them on the paychecks.  Each employ gets equal amounts of the total based on the number of hours they worked.  Our payroll company set up an easy program for us and it prints to their checks.  They average $16-19/hr total pay (including tips) per week.  I think that is pretty darn good pay for people with disabilities as most are making minimum wage at best (many work in piece meal sheltered workshops and can earn pennies an hour :'( )  Walter
SMILING WITH HOPE PIZZA MISSION STATEMENT
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Offline parallei

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Re: Finding eager Employees
« Reply #46 on: April 21, 2017, 06:29:32 PM »
We pool all tips for the week and then disperse them on the paychecks.  Each employ gets equal amounts of the total based on the number of hours they worked.  Our payroll company set up an easy program for us and it prints to their checks.  They average $16-19/hr total pay (including tips) per week.  I think that is pretty darn good pay for people with disabilities as most are making minimum wage at best (many work in piece meal sheltered workshops and can earn pennies an hour :'( )  Walter

That is wonderful, Walter!

I remember that the first "real" job (post paper route) I had as a high school student was washing dishes for $1.80/hour. I bagged it to shelve books at the public library for $1.67/hour because they treated me like a human!

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Finding eager Employees
« Reply #47 on: April 21, 2017, 07:13:47 PM »
I always tipped the kitchen and hostess. It paid back in droves.
"We make great pizza, with sourdough when we can, baker's yeast when we must, but always great pizza."  
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Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Finding eager Employees
« Reply #48 on: April 21, 2017, 07:16:14 PM »
We pool all tips for the week and then disperse them on the paychecks.  Each employ gets equal amounts of the total based on the number of hours they worked. 

Yours is a special situation, so perhaps it is the right thing for your pizzeria. While I agree with the idea of sharing a portion of the tips with non-tipped employees, I think the idea of an even split across tipped employees is fundamentally and morally wrong if not ethically wrong as well.  As a general rule, I wouldn't patronize a restaurant if I knew they did that.
« Last Edit: April 21, 2017, 07:30:47 PM by TXCraig1 »
"We make great pizza, with sourdough when we can, baker's yeast when we must, but always great pizza."  
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Offline waltertore

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Re: Finding eager Employees
« Reply #49 on: April 21, 2017, 09:39:11 PM »
Yours is a special situation, so perhaps it is the right thing for your pizzeria. While I agree with the idea of sharing a portion of the tips with non-tipped employees, I think the idea of an even split across tipped employees is fundamentally and morally wrong if not ethically wrong as well.  As a general rule, I wouldn't patronize a restaurant if I knew they did that.
  We don't have wait people.   Customers order at the counter and our special needs employees bring it to the tables.  Customers self serve on utensils and canned drinks.  We feel all work so all should share in the tips.  Our non disabled employees help top/cut/do prep work.  Walter
SMILING WITH HOPE PIZZA MISSION STATEMENT
TO CREATE HOPE AND MEANING IN THE LIVES OF PEOPLE WITH DISABILITIES
http://www.smilingwithhopepizza.com/

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Offline timgiuffi

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Re: Finding eager Employees
« Reply #50 on: April 21, 2017, 09:43:53 PM »
Yours is a special situation, so perhaps it is the right thing for your pizzeria. While I agree with the idea of sharing a portion of the tips with non-tipped employees, I think the idea of an even split across tipped employees is fundamentally and morally wrong if not ethically wrong as well.  As a general rule, I wouldn't patronize a restaurant if I knew they did that.

Why is that? The last restaurant I worked in the waitstaff pooled their tips and I think things worked better because of that.
Tim

Offline HBolte

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Re: Finding eager Employees
« Reply #51 on: April 21, 2017, 10:08:44 PM »
Walters situation is unique.

I would not want to work at a shop that pooled tips. It seems that it would discourage the conscientious hard workers because they would get less tips and encourage lesser performing workers that get equal pay for sub par work. But I have never worked in a restaurant so maybe you can fill me in Tim as to why it works.
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Offline parallei

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Re: Finding eager Employees
« Reply #52 on: April 21, 2017, 10:13:37 PM »
Walters situation is unique.

I would not want to work at a shop that pooled tips. It seems that it would discourage the conscientious hard workers because they would get less tips and encourage lesser performing workers that get equal pay for sub par work. But I have never worked in a restaurant so maybe you can fill me in Tim as to why it works.

It doesn't seem right that back of the house staff (what Walter called kitchen help), who may very well be conscientious hard workers, should not share in the whole tip thing.  But that's just me.
« Last Edit: April 21, 2017, 10:19:47 PM by parallei »

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Finding eager Employees
« Reply #53 on: April 21, 2017, 11:05:45 PM »
Why is that? The last restaurant I worked in the waitstaff pooled their tips and I think things worked better because of that.

It doesn't seem right that back of the house staff (what Walter called kitchen help), who may very well be conscientious hard workers, should not share in the whole tip thing.  But that's just me.

Tipping out to the back of the house is not the same thing as pooling tips. I support the former but not the latter. All service is not the same not should it receive the same compensation. When I was waiting tables, I busted my ass to give exceptional service while other I worked with did the bare minimum. Why should they share in my above average tips? 90% of the servers I encounter today SUCK. Why should they share in the very large tips I give to the 10% that stand out?

As far as I'm concerned, unless it is made crystal clear to the customer that tips are pooled, pooling tips (in a traditional waitperson environment) is nothing more than a dishonest way to subsidize employee pay on the backs of generous customers. Minimum wage is only $2.13/hour for tipped employees so long as they make $7.25 w/ tips...
"We make great pizza, with sourdough when we can, baker's yeast when we must, but always great pizza."  
Craig's Neapolitan Garage

Offline timgiuffi

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Re: Finding eager Employees
« Reply #54 on: April 21, 2017, 11:31:19 PM »
Walters situation is unique.

I would not want to work at a shop that pooled tips. It seems that it would discourage the conscientious hard workers because they would get less tips and encourage lesser performing workers that get equal pay for sub par work. But I have never worked in a restaurant so maybe you can fill me in Tim as to why it works.

It created a real sense of camaraderie in the staff. You cared about everything that happened because it was your money. If someone was weeded you helped them if you could and you expected the same in return. I actually think it made the less performing workers step up because they realized their coworkers wouldn't stand for it. I worked at this place for 8 years and in that time we hired maybe 3 people that didn't work out. The rest worked hard. Even if they sucked you could see they wanted to improve. The restaurant has since closed and morphed into a pizza place and two of the young girls that started waitressing there in 2008 are still employed.

It doesn't seem right that back of the house staff (what Walter called kitchen help), who may very well be conscientious hard workers, should not share in the whole tip thing.  But that's just me.

It's tough. The kitchen staff were well paid at our place. The waitstaff made $2.83/hr. On a slow Monday the cooks and dishwashers made more than the front of the house but it's not like the waitress could ask for some of their wage.
Tim

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Offline timgiuffi

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Re: Finding eager Employees
« Reply #55 on: April 21, 2017, 11:56:44 PM »
Tipping out to the back of the house is not the same thing as pooling tips. I support the former but not the latter. All service is not the same not should it receive the same compensation. When I was waiting tables, I busted my ass to give exceptional service while other I worked with did the bare minimum. Why should they share in my above average tips? 90% of the servers I encounter today SUCK. Why should they share in the very large tips I give to the 10% that stand out?

As far as I'm concerned, unless it is made crystal clear to the customer that tips are pooled, pooling tips (in a traditional waitperson environment) is nothing more than a dishonest way to subsidize employee pay on the backs of generous customers. Minimum wage is only $2.13/hour for tipped employees so long as they make $7.25 w/ tips...

Your tip isn't really that important, the rest of the night matters too. It was her only good one that night and she got stiffed twice. The crappy server did 10 more covers, got medicore tips and made more money.
« Last Edit: April 21, 2017, 11:59:48 PM by timgiuffi »
Tim

Offline HBolte

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Re: Finding eager Employees
« Reply #56 on: April 22, 2017, 08:32:28 AM »
Tipping out to the back of the house is not the same thing as pooling tips. I support the former but not the latter. All service is not the same not should it receive the same compensation. When I was waiting tables, I busted my ass to give exceptional service while other I worked with did the bare minimum. Why should they share in my above average tips? 90% of the servers I encounter today SUCK. Why should they share in the very large tips I give to the 10% that stand out?

As far as I'm concerned, unless it is made crystal clear to the customer that tips are pooled, pooling tips (in a traditional waitperson environment) is nothing more than a dishonest way to subsidize employee pay on the backs of generous customers. Minimum wage is only $2.13/hour for tipped employees so long as they make $7.25 w/ tips...

Your tip isn't really that important, the rest of the night matters too. It was her only good one that night and she got stiffed twice. The crappy server did 10 more covers, got medicore tips and made more money.

It created a real sense of camaraderie in the staff. You cared about everything that happened because it was your money. If someone was weeded you helped them if you could and you expected the same in return. I actually think it made the less performing workers step up because they realized their coworkers wouldn't stand for it. I worked at this place for 8 years and in that time we hired maybe 3 people that didn't work out. The rest worked hard. Even if they sucked you could see they wanted to improve. The restaurant has since closed and morphed into a pizza place and two of the young girls that started waitressing there in 2008 are still employed.

It's tough. The kitchen staff were well paid at our place. The waitstaff made $2.83/hr. On a slow Monday the cooks and dishwashers made more than the front of the house but it's not like the waitress could ask for some of their wage.

All good points.
Hans

Offline parallei

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Re: Finding eager Employees
« Reply #57 on: April 22, 2017, 08:59:29 AM »
Your tip isn't really that important, the rest of the night matters too. It was her only good one that night and she got stiffed twice. The crappy server did 10 more covers, got medicore tips and made more money.


It's tough. The kitchen staff were well paid at our place. The waitstaff made $2.83/hr. On a slow Monday the cooks and dishwashers made more than the front of the house but it's not like the waitress could ask for some of their wage.

Both good points.  It does seem tough, and the whole setup seems nonsensical to me.

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Finding eager Employees
« Reply #58 on: April 22, 2017, 09:22:20 AM »
Your tip isn't really that important, the rest of the night matters too. It was her only good one that night and she got stiffed twice. The crappy server did 10 more covers, got medicore tips and made more money.

This is a red herring.

Anyone can have a bad night, but if you consistently give great service, you will on average get better tips and make more money than someone who consistently gives mediocre service.
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Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Finding eager Employees
« Reply #59 on: April 22, 2017, 09:28:39 AM »
It created a real sense of camaraderie in the staff. You cared about everything that happened because it was your money. If someone was weeded you helped them if you could and you expected the same in return. I actually think it made the less performing workers step up because they realized their coworkers wouldn't stand for it.

A good waiter will help another waiter in the weeds without expecting to get paid for it. If s/he won't s/he is not a good waiter and management isn't doing their job.

Less performing waiters who are capable of more but just not doing their job for whatever reason can be motivated in ways that don't involve taking money from high performers who are doing their job.
"We make great pizza, with sourdough when we can, baker's yeast when we must, but always great pizza."  
Craig's Neapolitan Garage

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