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Offline PizzaPassion

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Yeast
« on: July 03, 2022, 08:52:09 PM »
Does one brand provide better flavor than another. Red Star seems to be one of the favorites. I just bought a jar of Fleishmans and think the dough is pretty tasteless even after a 48 hour cold ferment. I'm going back to Red Star.

Offline wotavidone

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Re: Yeast
« Reply #1 on: July 04, 2022, 05:14:17 AM »
Being here in Oz, land of kangaroos, emus, goannas, taipans, and drop bears, I have never tried either of the yeasts mentioned.
But today, I took 1o g of frozen fresh yeast out of the freezer and mixed it with 90 degree water.
The smell. The aroma. For the maybe the second time in my life, I dipped a finger tip and tasted the water/yeast emulsion.
Do different yeasts taste different? f..k yeah.
« Last Edit: July 04, 2022, 05:15:49 AM by wotavidone »
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Offline QwertyJuan

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Re: Yeast
« Reply #2 on: July 04, 2022, 10:38:34 PM »
I always use LeSaffre IDY. I think Red Star is the same strain of yeast.

Offline snoissea

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Re: Yeast
« Reply #3 on: July 05, 2022, 10:22:30 AM »
I'm a huge fan of SAF Instant yeast. The performance is unmatched. I get much better rises out of all of my doughs than I did with Red Star or Fleischmann’s. As to flavor, I think the flavor of SAF is good.
« Last Edit: July 05, 2022, 10:24:28 AM by snoissea »

Offline QwertyJuan

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Re: Yeast
« Reply #4 on: July 05, 2022, 10:14:02 PM »
I'm a huge fan of SAF Instant yeast. The performance is unmatched. I get much better rises out of all of my doughs than I did with Red Star or Fleischmann’s. As to flavor, I think the flavor of SAF is good.

I have it in my mind that it was Tom's preferred as well.

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Offline Pizza-Face

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Re: Yeast
« Reply #5 on: July 07, 2022, 03:59:46 PM »
Being here in Oz, land of kangaroos, emus, goannas, taipans, and drop bears, I have never tried either of the yeasts mentioned.
But today, I took 1o g of frozen fresh yeast out of the freezer and mixed it with 90 degree water.
The smell. The aroma. For the maybe the second time in my life, I dipped a finger tip and tasted the water/yeast emulsion.
Do different yeasts taste different? f..k yeah.

You mean fresh DRIED yeast right? Fresh natural yeast can't handle freezing, it'll explode the cells. Even dried yeast should not be frozen for the same reason. Refrigeration for most yeast is fine.

Offline texmex

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Re: Yeast
« Reply #6 on: July 07, 2022, 04:05:37 PM »
You mean fresh DRIED yeast right? Fresh natural yeast can't handle freezing, it'll explode the cells. Even dried yeast should not be frozen for the same reason. Refrigeration for most yeast is fine.


My dried yeast has been frozen for 11 years (or more) and still works great.
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Offline wotavidone

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Re: Yeast
« Reply #7 on: July 07, 2022, 07:24:40 PM »
You mean fresh DRIED yeast right? Fresh natural yeast can't handle freezing, it'll explode the cells. Even dried yeast should not be frozen for the same reason. Refrigeration for most yeast is fine.
Wrong. Fresh yeast, as in came in a block of wet smelly paste.
Have you ever actually tried it?
I froze some. After 8 days I used 9 grams, approximate equivalent of 1 tsp of IDY, to make some very satisfactory pizza.
How long it will last is an ongoing investigation, that I'm happy to undertake and report the findings thereof, but a week is fine.
https://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=72616.30
« Last Edit: July 07, 2022, 07:28:11 PM by wotavidone »
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Offline wiz_d_kidd

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Re: Yeast
« Reply #8 on: July 08, 2022, 10:06:24 AM »
I'm a huge fan of SAF Instant yeast. The performance is unmatched. I get much better rises out of all of my doughs than I did with Red Star or Fleischmann’s. As to flavor, I think the flavor of SAF is good.

Ditto. And the results are consistent.

Offline Pizza-Face

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Re: Yeast
« Reply #9 on: July 08, 2022, 11:41:57 AM »
Wrong. Fresh yeast, as in came in a block of wet smelly paste.
Have you ever actually tried it?
I froze some. After 8 days I used 9 grams, approximate equivalent of 1 tsp of IDY, to make some very satisfactory pizza.
How long it will last is an ongoing investigation, that I'm happy to undertake and report the findings thereof, but a week is fine.
https://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=72616.30

I was speaking of the LONG TERM freezing. Why freeze for a short term? Short term probably will only kill an outer layer of cells, so should be ok, but why not just refrigerate for a week and have it perform at full capacity? If you get a weak batch it may not.

What I'm saying is yeast in any form may, or may not be at it's full potential when frozen.
why risk it?

My problem is I am a homebrewer, and am avid of yeast propagation to the point of being overly protective of these little cells!

AS far as IDY I don't freeze that either, as it stays fine in the fridge, so why risk having a bad batch not withstand freezing? It would suck having half a pound perform like crap suddenly in say, six months time or more because the process at the yeast factory had a bad day. Why risk that bother? My IDY is still performing like new after approx. 6mo. in the fridge on a purchased 1LB pack. IMO freezing IDY is overkill and risky.

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Offline wiz_d_kidd

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Re: Yeast
« Reply #10 on: July 08, 2022, 01:03:11 PM »
I was speaking of the LONG TERM freezing. Why freeze for a short term? Short term probably will only kill an outer layer of cells, so should be ok, but why not just refrigerate for a week and have it perform at full capacity? If you get a weak batch it may not.

What I'm saying is yeast in any form may, or may not be at it's full potential when frozen.
why risk it?

My problem is I am a homebrewer, and am avid of yeast propagation to the point of being overly protective of these little cells!

AS far as IDY I don't freeze that either, as it stays fine in the fridge, so why risk having a bad batch not withstand freezing? It would suck having half a pound perform like crap suddenly in say, six months time or more because the process at the yeast factory had a bad day. Why risk that bother? My IDY is still performing like new after approx. 6mo. in the fridge on a purchased 1LB pack. IMO freezing IDY is overkill and risky.

I bought a 1lb container of SAF IDY in Aug 2018. The marked expiration was Apr 2020. I keep it in a glass jar with a tight lid in the freezer (0 deg F), and it is still as good now as the day I bought it.  I've read (on this site) where others have had similar experience with freezing IDY.

Offline Pizza-Face

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Re: Yeast
« Reply #11 on: July 08, 2022, 01:21:38 PM »
I bought a 1lb container of SAF IDY in Aug 2018. The marked expiration was Apr 2020. I keep it in a glass jar with a tight lid in the freezer (0 deg F), and it is still as good now as the day I bought it.  I've read (on this site) where others have had similar experience with freezing IDY.

Yes, but there are posts in the dough clinic forum, and others, with the subject of " dough not rising enough" or similiar. Of course there are other factors involved, but to such a small change to the storage of the yeast the percentage of "yeast factor" is minimalized.

The risks outweigh the benefits, Why risk it when it's as simple as just make room in the fridge for the yeast as opposed to making room in the freezer?

Risk. It's just the probability of *NOT* having another packet of yeast somewhere, or dashing down to the store to buy a pack... blah. blah. Small price to pay to increase the outcome of a proper dough for your pizza. Just my 2 cents FWIW. It's not really that big a deal.

Offline Pizza_Not_War

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Re: Yeast
« Reply #12 on: July 08, 2022, 02:00:59 PM »
I've been freezing yeast for 20 years and never had an issue. Theory vs reality.

Offline texmex

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Re: Yeast
« Reply #13 on: July 08, 2022, 02:34:15 PM »
Several years ago I purchased about 10 sachet packets of ADY on clearance @ 25 cents a pack. They all had the same lot number,  and had 1 month until expiration.
I had stored them all in freezer, but took out a 3 pack at a time and kept that in my fridge until it was time for a new 3 pack from freezer as I baked.
I did not bake anything for several years, and when I tried to use 2 of the remaining fridge packets, they were dead at the blooming stage. My frozen ADY was viable, although not as robust, it was not dead.

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Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Yeast
« Reply #14 on: July 08, 2022, 03:17:09 PM »
Companies sell more yeast if people throw it away after the expiration date...
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Offline Pizza-Face

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Re: Yeast
« Reply #15 on: July 08, 2022, 03:43:39 PM »
Here's one about freezing the fresh yeast:

https://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=14709.msg146826;topicseen#msg146826

As far as dried IDY, I just stated as an opinion, humbly, as a precaution to avoid an unforeseen mishap in the future of the life of the frozen dried yeast.

As I said earlier, it's not really a big deal.

I will say no more on this subject.

Offline wotavidone

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Re: Yeast
« Reply #16 on: July 08, 2022, 08:15:34 PM »
I was speaking of the LONG TERM freezing. Why freeze for a short term? Short term probably will only kill an outer layer of cells, so should be ok, but why not just refrigerate for a week and have it perform at full capacity? If you get a weak batch it may not.

What I'm saying is yeast in any form may, or may not be at it's full potential when frozen.
why risk it?

My problem is I am a homebrewer, and am avid of yeast propagation to the point of being overly protective of these little cells!

AS far as IDY I don't freeze that either, as it stays fine in the fridge, so why risk having a bad batch not withstand freezing? It would suck having half a pound perform like crap suddenly in say, six months time or more because the process at the yeast factory had a bad day. Why risk that bother? My IDY is still performing like new after approx. 6mo. in the fridge on a purchased 1LB pack. IMO freezing IDY is overkill and risky.
I did not freeze for short term. Remembering that I had to travel 230km (each way) to buy it, I bought a block of fresh yeast that was the smallest they had and contained enough yeast for about 30 batches of dough. More than a year's supply if I make pizza once a fortnight.
It was very close to the expiration date, and I have little to lose by seeing if I could freeze it.

I do also have some IDY in there. That came about due to my finding that the potency was declining on fairly old yeast kept solely in the fridge.
When I bought a fresh package of IDY, and contemplate discarding about half the last package due to it no longer seeming to work, I again figured I has nothing to lose by trying it.
Cells rupture due to frozen water expanding. I figure IDY doesn't have enough water for that to be an issue.

But it doesn't really matter. We are not talking millions of dollars here.
It's just a nod to my frugal upbringing whereby if you can preserve what you have, you don't have to outlay for more.
To me the risk is zero.

In the case of the fresh yeast, the outlay was 40c. Or $90.40 if you add in the fuel cost to go get it. ::)
And when its all said and done, I have IDY in the fridge, and brewers yeast in my homebrew setup, as back up.

There is no risk, I shall continue to make pizza, about once er fortnight during winter at least, and when the fire regs let me during summer, and I'll let the forum know how that goes.
« Last Edit: July 08, 2022, 08:23:22 PM by wotavidone »
Mick

Offline wotavidone

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Re: Yeast
« Reply #17 on: July 08, 2022, 08:26:02 PM »
I've been freezing yeast for 20 years and never had an issue. Theory vs reality.
What sort?
Mick

Offline Pizza_Not_War

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Re: Yeast
« Reply #18 on: July 08, 2022, 08:32:45 PM »

Offline PizzaPassion

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Re: Yeast
« Reply #19 on: July 09, 2022, 06:22:58 AM »
Friday night's pizza made with Red Star yeast rose far superior to last weeks pizza made with Fleischmann's yeast. Although truthfully the taste difference was not discernible.
As for the issue of freezing yeast much of what I have learned about the entire pizza making craft I learned from Tony Gemignani's Pizza Bible. Before Pizza Bible I was making hockey pucks with sauce and cheese. Pizza Bible has been a game changer for me. In any event Tony recommends active dry yeast(Red Star) for most of his recipes and fresh yeast for his Neapolitan-style pizzas. He recommends avoiding quick rise yeast and will not freeze yeast claiming as it expands it will kill the yeast. And lastly when activating yeast Tony says water should never be hotter than 85 F. This was a surprise to me as I had always read 105-115F.

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