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Author Topic: Real Beddia Formula  (Read 957 times)

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Online 30grantw

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Real Beddia Formula
« on: January 23, 2018, 10:03:10 PM »
I'm sure many of you have looked at the Pizza Camp book by now. I have not tried that dough recipe but have heard that its a decent recipe. Has anyone tried to reengineer the real thing? I have read on here that Joe told them the Salt content was 2.8%, sugar at 2%, and Oil at 2.6%. The book says 71% hydration but I somewhat doubt that. Ive heard he does a 36 hour ferment, and some say he does a 72 hour cf. I was thinking of starting with this formula

100% KA BF
65% Water
2.6% oil
2.8% Salt
2% Sugar
0.20 IDY

what do you guys think?
Grant Williams

Offline Minolta Rokkor

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Re: Real Beddia Formula
« Reply #1 on: January 23, 2018, 10:14:01 PM »
Seeing how their pizzas have an ameba like look to them, it should be higher hydration, but 71% water sounds extreme. Work your way up 1% at a time. I think .20% IDY you can hit 3 or 4 days of cold fermenting, I would reball the dough 12 hours before bake to regain the dough strength.
« Last Edit: January 23, 2018, 10:16:26 PM by Minolta Rokkor »

Online 30grantw

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Re: Real Beddia Formula
« Reply #2 on: January 23, 2018, 10:16:59 PM »
Every time in a video its always noted how wet the dough is. I just think 71% there is no way. 2.6 is high for oil too. I do not know what hydration to start at.
Grant Williams

Offline mitchjg

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Re: Real Beddia Formula
« Reply #3 on: January 23, 2018, 10:19:25 PM »
I think that, at least usually, the recipes for the home bakers are easier to execute on.  If you believe that is the case here, then there is no way he would reccomend 71% in the book while actually using something lower and easier - such as  65%.

So, it would lead you to reasoning out that 71% (or even higher) is the real thing.
Mitch

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Online 30grantw

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Re: Real Beddia Formula
« Reply #4 on: January 23, 2018, 10:23:23 PM »
Good point. I was just thinking since he has a brick lined 600 degree oven he may use less water but who knows. The oil, sugar, and salt amounts sound about right but it is hard to know how long he actually ferments the dough
Grant Williams

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Offline Minolta Rokkor

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Re: Real Beddia Formula
« Reply #5 on: January 23, 2018, 10:31:09 PM »
Every time in a video its always noted how wet the dough is. I just think 71% there is no way. 2.6 is high for oil too. I do not what hydration to start at.
There's a speed setting for the video, looking at it at .25, I'll be frank, that's not 71% water, he's probably has 60% - 62% water.



My pies are at 60% water with similar oil, sugar, and salt levels, and the crumb comes out quite airy, puffy and open.
Besides the water, and yeast (.20% won't cut it for 36 hours),  everything else seems normal.

Online 30grantw

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Re: Real Beddia Formula
« Reply #6 on: January 23, 2018, 10:34:33 PM »
He said on the pizza show that his dough is pretty wet. 71% just troubles me though. The book says 36 hour ferment while Norma said he told her he does 72 hour. Hard to figure it out as the dough atlas in the video does not look 71% but I still think it has to be high hydration with hour crispy and bubbly the dough gets. He gets excellent browning
Grant Williams

Offline Minolta Rokkor

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Re: Real Beddia Formula
« Reply #7 on: January 23, 2018, 11:52:04 PM »
Well, a lot of operators lie about their formulas to obscure it. What more is their to it.

Online 30grantw

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Re: Real Beddia Formula
« Reply #8 on: January 24, 2018, 12:07:45 AM »
Good point. I guess I will only know by experimenting with all different types of hydration. Thanks for the help
Grant Williams

Offline HarryHaller73

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Re: Real Beddia Formula
« Reply #9 on: January 26, 2018, 11:18:15 AM »
Contrary to what I thought previously, >70% hydration probably works, since he opens cold dough from the CF without a temper to RT and uses a ton of bench flour.  Cold dough will seem more rigid and less extensible.  The pizza crumb structure has larger holes as well, typical of a higher hydration.

From what I read, he bakes 600 deg F for 10 minutes.  Without a cold dough and higher hydration, the pie would be burnt toast.  He does get good browning tho with that amount of time.

« Last Edit: January 26, 2018, 11:24:24 AM by HarryHaller73 »

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Online 30grantw

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Re: Real Beddia Formula
« Reply #10 on: January 26, 2018, 03:36:48 PM »

that makes sense. In the book it says to let the dough balls sit at room temp for 4 hours before baking but i bet that's not actually what he does. Cold dough and high hydration makes sense for 600 for 10 minutes although some people say the bake time is more like 6 minutes. Lots of contrasting information but i am certain its a higher hydration dough. I make 65% water and 2.6% oil today, still not enough water to match his but I put my own personal tastes on it.
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Offline HarryHaller73

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Re: Real Beddia Formula
« Reply #11 on: January 26, 2018, 07:19:17 PM »
that makes sense. In the book it says to let the dough balls sit at room temp for 4 hours before baking but i bet that's not actually what he does. Cold dough and high hydration makes sense for 600 for 10 minutes although some people say the bake time is more like 6 minutes. Lots of contrasting information but i am certain its a higher hydration dough. I make 65% water and 2.6% oil today, still not enough water to match his but I put my own personal tastes on it.

I'm sure there are nuances that would be altered in his book for the target audience.  Most people who buy the book don't have a Montague deck oven at home.

Offline Essen1

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Re: Real Beddia Formula
« Reply #12 on: January 26, 2018, 09:00:45 PM »
This thread might also be of interest.

https://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=41028.0
Mike

“All styles of pizza are valid. I make the best I’m capable of; you should make the best you’re capable of. I don’t want to make somebody else’s pizza.” ~ Chris Bianco

Offline Gianni5

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Re: Real Beddia Formula
« Reply #13 on: January 27, 2018, 01:46:08 PM »
I don't see how you get a 10 minute bake at 600 degrees in a commercial brick lined deck oven. I have a marsal mb oven and at 600 degrees you're gonna be right around 6 minutes. 10 minutes and you'd have charcoal

Offline hotsawce

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Re: Real Beddia Formula
« Reply #14 on: January 28, 2018, 11:07:39 AM »
I tend to agree with you. Not to mention, he has a Montague - of all the brick lined deck ovens, they are some of the most powerful.

Only way we’ll know is if someone goes and times a pie for us 😏

I’ve gotten a very similar looking pizza with a 4:30 to 5 minute bake time. Deep brown crust, crunch, spiderwebs in the crumb. Even the melt of the mozzarellas.

I don't see how you get a 10 minute bake at 600 degrees in a commercial brick lined deck oven. I have a marsal mb oven and at 600 degrees you're gonna be right around 6 minutes. 10 minutes and you'd have charcoal

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Offline hotsawce

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Re: Real Beddia Formula
« Reply #15 on: January 28, 2018, 11:23:11 AM »
This was my riff on a Beddia pie. No where close to 10 minutes. Pretty well fermented dough (his overnight bulk looks very active so I’m guessing that’s why they look somewhat similar.)

If I recalll, this was around 65% hydration. No sugar or oil. I have to dig to find exactly how long I baked it for but definitely not ten minutes. If I remember correctly it was 4:30 to 5 minutes. Extremely crispy, bordering on crunch. No tip sag at all. 1lb ball at 16”

Offline mitchjg

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Re: Real Beddia Formula
« Reply #16 on: January 28, 2018, 12:01:40 PM »
My bake, using the recipe in his book, took 10 minutes.  But, it was at 525.

As I mentioned, his book recipe is for the general public/home bakers/home ovens.  So, sure, the recipe in the book may be different than what he does.  My take continues to be that he is actually using a hydration over 70%.  No reason for him to suggest a dough to a home baker that is more difficult to manage than his professional approach.  But, he certainly may be using a hotter oven for a shorter period in his establishment - he can and the typical home baker cannot.
Mitch

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Offline hotsawce

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Re: Real Beddia Formula
« Reply #17 on: January 28, 2018, 01:04:29 PM »
You can’t just assume a universal hydration. For example, he uses central milking which takes to higher hydration very well. King Arthur Bread Flour doesn’t behave the same.


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Re: Real Beddia Formula
« Reply #18 on: January 28, 2018, 01:18:47 PM »
hotsawce,

Based on the picture of your pie, I bet you could have shaved more time off the bake (maybe a full minute) and still had a decent pie.  Going 10 minutes at 600F seems beyond the limits, I agree, but then again Mitch has recently posted a pizza that survived 6 minutes under the broiler -  something I would have thought impossible, so who knows?


Rolls

Edit:   I didn't realize Mitch had reposted a photo of the same pizza I mention above.  That's a 10 minute bake - the last 6 using the broiler.  In my oven, no pizza would survive this, even if kept on the bottom rack during the broil. 
« Last Edit: January 28, 2018, 01:25:18 PM by Rolls »

Offline mitchjg

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Re: Real Beddia Formula
« Reply #19 on: January 28, 2018, 04:22:25 PM »
You can’t just assume a universal hydration. For example, he uses central milking which takes to higher hydration very well. King Arthur Bread Flour doesn’t behave the same.

Thanks for mentioning that - great point about flour differences, etc.

Interesting that you mentioned Central Milling taking higher hydration well.  I had the opposite experience.  I bought my first batch of CM flour in 2015, several different flours.  I kept finding that my doughs were getting way too floppy even though I was using my typical recipes.

I ended up in a helpful email exchange with Nicky Giusto.  He confirmed the issue for me and explained that the heavy rains in the North that year had affected the quality of the wheat.  He advised me to reduce my hydration by as much as 5% (across the board, all the flours I had purchased) to help correct for this.

So, I guess it depends on the weather that year, too.....

Mitch

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