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  • #361 by mkoss on 29 Apr 2017
  • finally got around to making the pizza. Have to say well worth time spent learning. Just need to brown on bottom better by moving rack in oven to bottom next time. Hopefully this will awaken this topic again. It's had a long dry spell.
  • #362 by mkoss on 13 Aug 2017
  • Stopped at pizza L'oven and Ciccoli's and Genoa Foods to get some items. I didn't have the VP Pizza for a long time so I went to Ciccoli's to try their version. I will share more information on the differences later.
  • #363 by PizzaBinge on 14 Aug 2017
  • Stopped at pizza L'oven and Ciccoli's and Genoa Foods to get some items. I didn't have the VP Pizza for a long time so I went to Ciccoli's to try their version. I will share more information on the differences later.

    Funny, I just had both Pizza Perfect and Ceccoli's today. Love Ceccoli's!
  • #364 by quietdesperation on 27 Aug 2017
  • I happened upon this thread, looked up the location of vp, and realized it was just a 20-minute detour off our path to my son's school in the midwest. We arrived around 7:30 and ordered 6 slices of plain, a pork sandwich, a victory pig burger, and smoked wings. we didn't care for the sandwich, it didn't taste smoked but the relish was interesting. The wings were rubbed, smoked then fried, really good stuff! My son woofed down the burger before I could try it, he said it was very good.

    The pizza is good but IMO, it's a little of an acquired taste. The crust is fabulous, the sauce is bright and tart. But the onions in the sauce and cheese take a little getting used to. if VP was a five-minute detour, we'd definitely be back but not sure for 20 minutes.

    I may try to borrow the crust and sauce,  change the mix of cheddar and mozz to favor mozz and add some toppings.

    sb, thanks for your great posts!
  • #365 by mkoss on 06 Nov 2017
  • I happened upon this thread, looked up the location of vp, and realized it was just a 20-minute detour off our path to my son's school in the midwest. We arrived around 7:30 and ordered 6 slices of plain, a pork sandwich, a victory pig burger, and smoked wings. we didn't care for the sandwich, it didn't taste smoked but the relish was interesting. The wings were rubbed, smoked then fried, really good stuff! My son woofed down the burger before I could try it, he said it was very good.

    The pizza is good but IMO, it's a little of an acquired taste. The crust is fabulous, the sauce is bright and tart. But the onions in the sauce and cheese take a little getting used to. if VP was a five-minute detour, we'd definitely be back but not sure for 20 minutes.

    I may try to borrow the crust and sauce,  change the mix of cheddar and mozz to favor mozz and add some toppings.

    sb, thanks for your great posts!
    Next time through try Pizza Loven,its a variation of the VP pizza. Same dough but don't put onions in sauce but seasoning and use wisconsin mild cheddar wereas VP uses I believe provolone. I think both pizzas are fabulous. 
  • #366 by Joe_C on 16 Nov 2017
  • Local newspaper article on the 75th anniversary of Victory Pig.  Interesting and rare photos of the kitchen prep area. 
    http://www.timesleader.com/features/682406/victory-pig-pizza-celebrates-75-years-in-business-under-ceccoli-family
  • #367 by causearuckus on 24 Jan 2018
  • Hey everyone, been reading this thread to gain some insights on this style of pizza. I stopped at VP over the summer, and it was unique and awesome. Will post a few pics below.

    My wife's family is from the area, and her Grandfather's cousin was one of the first cooks at VP when it opened. He happened to take what he learned and started Pizza Loven.  Her grandfather claims that the recipe found here: http://k0lee.com/vp.php is the actual recipe for VP. I tried scaling down the second recipe on the page, and it was way too dry. Doing the math I believe its somewhere around 55% hydration. I was going to try somewhere higher, maybe around 60%, but it looks like 65% might be the magic number. I am hoping to try again this weekend, so will post my updated recipe.

    I also had difficulty getting the crust to finish while keeping the toppings "rare". I may try putting foil on the top.

    Also, my grandfather-in-law was adamant that Pizza Loven uses WI White cheddar on their pies.


  • #368 by NepaBill on 25 Jan 2018
  • I believe your grandfather is correct about the cheese..  Local to Victory Pig and L'oven are numerous pizza supply businesses. One is Genoa in Plains, PA. 18705, and the other is City-Mager in Wilkes-Barre 18702..  I'm betting these two businesses were around long before Sysco Foods made their presence known to this area..  They both offer cash-n-carry, and both are open to the public..  They both carry Land O'Lakes mild cheddar cheese, which comes in 40lb blocks..  This cheddar is unlike any cheddar you can find in a grocery store, besides it being only $2.xx per pound, it is very mild and creamy, no sharpness at all to it..  Land O'Lakes sells this cheese in Mild, Medium, and Sharp, but I believe these places only carry the Mild.  Both Genoa, and City-Mager also carry high quality tomato products (Escalon and Stanislaus) for sauce making, along with spices at a very reasonable price..  Not sure if anyone has ever compared "Detroit Style Pizza" to V.P. & L'Oven, but I have been playing with Detroit style, and the dough is spot on..  The only major difference I see, is the cheese used..  Detroit supposedly uses "Brick" cheese, which is a brand also available locally..  For those not familiar with Brick Cheese, it's a buttery tasting Mozzarella like cheese..  This site is great!  I love reading these posts..  Support your Local Mom & Pop Pizza shops!!  Make sure to frequent V.P. and L'Oven, so you can compare your latest batch to theirs..  Also, if you are familiar with the area, my favorite pizza in this style is "Spare Time Pizza" in Dallas, PA.  located in the Bowling Alley..  Yes I said Bowling Alley.. 
  • #369 by causearuckus on 25 Jan 2018
  • I am thinking Detroit dough might be wetter (more hydration) than VP dough. But you are right, they are pretty similar.
  • #370 by PizzaBinge on 06 Aug 2018
  • This site is great!  I love reading these posts..  Support your Local Mom & Pop Pizza shops!!  Make sure to frequent V.P. and L'Oven, so you can compare your latest batch to theirs..  Also, if you are familiar with the area, my favorite pizza in this style is "Spare Time Pizza" in Dallas, PA.  located in the Bowling Alley..  Yes I said Bowling Alley..

    NepaBill, have you ever had Ceccoli’s Pizza in Parsons/Plains? If not I highly recommend giving it a try, they won me over from VP, L’Oven, and Pizza Perfect. They are family members of Victory Pig and strayed years ago to open a few locations under the name “Pizza II”, but now only have one location under Ceccoli’s.
  • #371 by NepaBill on 06 Aug 2018
  • Thanks PizzaBinge..  I will definitely have to try it..  Also, if you like that style, you MUST try Back Mountain Bowl in Dallas..  Their pizza is better than all the others mentioned..  I can't compare to Ceccoli's yet..  TY!
  • #372 by ldhawai on 06 Aug 2018
  • My friends' own Ceccoli's in Parsons. The same people(Cousins) that ran Pizza 2 in Plains and Pizza 2 East on Mundy St back in the day.
  • #373 by pizzaman1 on 03 Sep 2018
  • Hello everyone, hopefully I can find some answers here....

    Im just starting to experiment with this recipe so I wanted to go for a certain desired thickness, a person on the forum told me that for my desired thickness I should go for a dough ball weight around 350 g for my 10x14 pan, and all other ingredients around 2%. Can anybody tell me if I used to much IDY yeast? and if so please explain why. I was just told that I did use to much IDY, but I thought I was doing the right thing because the other person told me to just use all other ingredients around 2%.

    Also, I made 2 dough balls, I put one in the pan today at 3:00 and placed covered on my stove. I put the other in the pan covered and placed in fridge. (to use tomorrow, to experiment a cold fermentation vs room temp fermentation.  Im going to post the recipe I used below. I used the expanded dough calculator for this recipe.... thanks everyone


     Flour (100%):    444.89 g  |  15.69 oz | 0.98 lbs
    Water (70%):    311.42 g  |  10.98 oz | 0.69 lbs
    IDY (1.6%):    7.12 g | 0.25 oz | 0.02 lbs | 2.36 tsp | 0.79 tbsp
    Salt (1.9%):    8.45 g | 0.3 oz | 0.02 lbs | 1.76 tsp | 0.59 tbsp
    Sugar (2%):    8.9 g | 0.31 oz | 0.02 lbs | 2.23 tsp | 0.74 tbsp
    Total (175.5%):   780.78 g | 27.54 oz | 1.72 lbs | TF = N/A
    Single Ball:   390.39 g | 13.77 oz | 0.86 lbs
  • #374 by vtsteve on 03 Sep 2018
  • IDY is usually used at 0.2%-0.5%, except for emergency doughs where you're willing to sacrifice flavor for the fastest possible rise. You're probably going to have to knock back that fridge dough, or it'll climb out of the pan.   :)

    More yeast will produce a faster rise, but the enzymes in the flour also need time to act -- proteases create free aminos, amylase converts some of the starch to maltose/glucose, etc., all of which contribute to the flavor of a properly-fermented dough.
  • #375 by pizzaman1 on 03 Sep 2018
  • ok, in "steel bakers" recipe at post #21 he used 2% IDY. when I asked another person for advice they also said to use all ingredients around 2%. Can you give your input on this? thanks
  • #376 by steel_baker on 03 Sep 2018
  • ok, in "steel bakers" recipe at post #21 he used 2% IDY. when I asked another person for advice they also said to use all ingredients around 2%. Can you give your input on this? thanks

    The recipe shows you what worked for me. I now live at nearly 7,000' above sea level so I have changed it to suit my altitude. It's fine to make small adjustments in the ingredients to suit taste, texture, & baking situation. I had to experiment a lot to get it right initially. You may have to as well.

    s_b
  • #377 by Pete-zza on 04 Sep 2018
  • Hello everyone, hopefully I can find some answers here....

    Im just starting to experiment with this recipe so I wanted to go for a certain desired thickness, a person on the forum told me that for my desired thickness I should go for a dough ball weight around 350 g for my 10x14 pan, and all other ingredients around 2%. Can anybody tell me if I used to much IDY yeast? and if so please explain why. I was just told that I did use to much IDY, but I thought I was doing the right thing because the other person told me to just use all other ingredients around 2%.

    Also, I made 2 dough balls, I put one in the pan today at 3:00 and placed covered on my stove. I put the other in the pan covered and placed in fridge. (to use tomorrow, to experiment a cold fermentation vs room temp fermentation.  Im going to post the recipe I used below. I used the expanded dough calculator for this recipe.... thanks everyone


    Flour (100%):    444.89 g  |  15.69 oz | 0.98 lbs
    Water (70%):    311.42 g  |  10.98 oz | 0.69 lbs
    IDY (1.6%):    7.12 g | 0.25 oz | 0.02 lbs | 2.36 tsp | 0.79 tbsp
    Salt (1.9%):    8.45 g | 0.3 oz | 0.02 lbs | 1.76 tsp | 0.59 tbsp
    Sugar (2%):    8.9 g | 0.31 oz | 0.02 lbs | 2.23 tsp | 0.74 tbsp
    Total (175.5%):   780.78 g | 27.54 oz | 1.72 lbs | TF = N/A
    Single Ball:   390.39 g | 13.77 oz | 0.86 lbs
    pizzaman1,

    What steel baker told you is correct. His recipe--the one you modified--is for a specialty Victory Pig style pizza that calls for a lot of yeast. And so long as you carefully follow his instructions as given in his excellent video at Reply 21 at https://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=13048.msg160058#msg160058, as well as any other helpful tips he or others may have advanced in this thread, I think you will have a pretty good shot at success.

    You will also note that I came up with a baker's percent version of steel baker's dough formulation at Reply 63 at https://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=13048.msg161972#msg161972, and also included another version for a different size pan that member Norma had on hand. In your case, if we take the thickness factor that I calculated in Reply 63 and enter it in the expanded dough calculating tool at https://www.pizzamaking.com/expanded-calculator.html, along with the 10" x 14" rectangular pan dimensions that you are using, for two dough balls, then the resulting dough formulation will look like this:

    Bread Flour (100%):
    Water (Bottled) (66.993%):
    IDY (1.956%):
    Salt (Morton's Kosher) (1.956%):
    Olive Oil (0.978%):
    Sugar (1.956%):
    Total (173.839%):
    Single Ball:
    561.37 g  |  19.8 oz | 1.24 lbs
    376.08 g  |  13.27 oz | 0.83 lbs
    10.98 g | 0.39 oz | 0.02 lbs | 3.65 tsp | 1.22 tbsp
    10.98 g | 0.39 oz | 0.02 lbs | 2.29 tsp | 0.76 tbsp
    5.49 g | 0.19 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.22 tsp | 0.41 tbsp
    10.98 g | 0.39 oz | 0.02 lbs | 2.75 tsp | 0.92 tbsp
    975.88 g | 34.42 oz | 2.15 lbs | TF = 0.122938
    487.94 g | 17.21 oz | 1.08 lbs
    Note: The amount of dough (for two dough balls) is for use in a 10" x 14" sloping-sided blue steel pan; no bowl residue compensation.

    You will also note that I included olive oil in the above formulation, which I did not see in your formulation. And I used Morton's Kosher salt as the form of salt, and bottled water as the form of water, whereas your posted formulation is silent on those scores. Also, as steel baker noted, you may need to tweak whatever formulation you decide to use to work in your particular setting. The above formulation might help you use the expanded dough calculating tool in the event you decide to change any of the values or ingredients. If you need any help on that score, let us know. When you are new to pizza making, and playing around with baker's percents and the like for the first time and trying to understand what the expanded dough calculating is doing, it is easy to end up scratching your head and not quite understanding what is going on.

    Steve is also correct with respect to his comments about the high amount of yeast and using cold fermentation. With the amount of yeast you used, the dough would be likely to go crazy with fermentation at refrigerator temperatures for a day or two, and yield a dough that might not be manageable, and possibly overfermented. It might be possible to freeze the dough up front and then let it defrost when you plan to use it but I don't know how effective that approach would be. It would seem easier to just make a fresh batch of dough as desired as instructed by steel baker.

    Good luck and let us know how things go, both positive and negative.

    Peter


  • #378 by pizzaman1 on 04 Sep 2018
  • here is my dough from yesterday that I just now took out of the fridge. any thoughts or opinions? thanks
  • #379 by NepaBill on 04 Sep 2018
  • Looks good to me!!  Bake it up and show us some pictures..
  • #380 by vtsteve on 04 Sep 2018
  • here is my dough from yesterday that I just now took out of the fridge. any thoughts or opinions? thanks

    You must have a really cold fridge!   :-D

    I expected to see more rise from 2% IDY overnight, looks like you're in good shape.
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