Pizza Making Forum

Pizza Making => General Pizza Making => Topic started by: TXCraig1 on January 26, 2015, 04:27:03 PM

Title: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on January 26, 2015, 04:27:03 PM
I'm not trying to clone Mozza but rather trying to come up with a home oven pizza I like besides my Johnny's clone (http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=33831.0). First test:

Total Formula:
97.5% KAAP
1.25% dark rye flour
1.25% wheat germ
72% RO water
2.5% salt
0.15% IDY

Preferment:
41.0% of total formula flour
55.6% of total formula water (this will make the preferment 100% HR)
100.0% of total formula IDY
18 hours at room temp (~68F)

Dissolve the total formula salt in the remaining water. Add in the preferment and mix well. Add in the dark rye flour, wheat germ, and the remaining flour in a half dozen or so increments while mixing at a slow speed. The goal is to incorporate air with the flour. After it has all come together, let it rest for 20 minutes then give it a set of stretch-and-folds. Try to capture air in the dough when you fold. Give it a 12 minute rest followed by another set of stretch-and-folds. Repeat one more time. Divide and ball and refrigerate for 24 hours (48 would be better). Give the balls at least 2 hours at room temp before opening.

The pies below are 350g dough and 14Ē. I left quite a bit of dough at the cornicione which is painted with EVOO prior to topping.  Next time, Iíll probably go up to 400g with the additional dough in the center of the pie. The cornicione was the size I wanted, but the bottom was a bit too thin.

These were baked at 550 convection on stone. I didnít time the bakes. I wish I could have gone a bit longer to get a darker crust, but the cheap mozz I had would have failed.

Next time, Iím not going to add any wheat germ. It was OK, and you really couldnít see it much in the crust, but itís not the flavor Iím looking for. I will try 2% dark rye w/ 1% honey. Depending on how that comes out, I might try to find some barley malt syrup to try instead of the honey. 

The cheese on these is sliced fresh mozz with some grated fontina.  Overall, I really liked the texture of the crust Ė nice and crispy on the outside and very light and tender inside.

Thank you to TinRoof for some helpful insights.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on January 26, 2015, 04:32:53 PM
The sauce was pretty much what I use for NP, and probably just a touch too thin for this pizza. Next time, I'll strain out a bit of the water.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Jersey Pie Boy on January 26, 2015, 04:56:40 PM
This looks great! 
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: tinroofrusted on January 26, 2015, 07:23:26 PM
Nice looking pies, Craig. You got the puffy rim very nicely. I do like the flavor that wheat germ adds but I've noticed that (at least for the coarse wheat germ that I use) it darkens up quite a bit after a couple of days in the fridge.  In addition to rye you could consider a small percentage of spelt, which also gives a nice flavor. 
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: CaptBob on January 26, 2015, 08:12:04 PM
I'm so glad you did this Craig as I've been thinking the same thing. I just got some rye flour and wheat germ so thank you so much for sharing your recipe!

Those pies are drop dead gorgeous!
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: deb415611 on January 26, 2015, 08:57:40 PM
love the puffiness , can't wait to see where you bring this
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: norma427 on January 26, 2015, 09:06:29 PM
Craig,

Your Mozza-inspired pies look wonderful!

Norma
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: jsaras on January 26, 2015, 09:12:39 PM
Looks gorgeous as always.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TomN on January 26, 2015, 09:35:45 PM
Amazing looking pies. I bet they taste amazing too.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on January 26, 2015, 10:03:01 PM
Thanks all; I think there is something here, and I'm going to keep working on it.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: stonecutter on January 26, 2015, 10:12:55 PM
The color and texture of the crust remind me of a lot of the pizzerias where I grew up.   I really like the look of it!
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Jackitup on January 27, 2015, 02:00:39 AM
Mmmmmm.............pizzzza  :drool: being the Homer fan you are Craig, looks GREAT!
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: PizzaManic on January 27, 2015, 08:14:20 AM
Hi Craig

Lovely looking Pizza. What really caught my eye was the KAAP flour you used - I've been looking for a recipe for my home oven - I have to give this a try although one draw back on my side is my oven only goes to 230 Degrees Celsius.

Thanks
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on January 27, 2015, 08:39:41 AM
Lovely looking Pizza. What really caught my eye was the KAAP flour you used

You don't need fancy or expensive flour to make great pizza.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: jeff v on January 27, 2015, 08:49:53 AM
Thanks all; I think there is something here, and I'm going to keep working on it.

Nice work! Except for some tweaks this was the recipe for my mobile pizza biz. I never tried it in the home oven but will have to soon.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on January 27, 2015, 09:09:58 AM
Nice work! Except for some tweaks this was the recipe for my mobile pizza biz. I never tried it in the home oven but will have to soon.

Please feel free to share any insights.  ;D
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: jeff v on January 27, 2015, 10:17:50 AM
Please feel free to share any insights.  ;D

Actually you found out lots from this first bake. I too did not like wheat germ and ended up using only malted BF(95%) and a little spelt (5%). Obviously easy to get browning w that in a wfo, so I like the addition of honey for the home oven.

The rest is personal preferences really. I like 3% salt and a borderline to slightly over fermented dough so I did 33% total formula flour and made a 24 hr polish and 48 hrs bulk ferment in the fridge. Also at an event my overall hydration was 66% but I really prefer the low 70's.

I got the best crumb structure with a short mix (4-6 minutes) a 15 minute rest then 3 sets of stretch and folds 10 min apart before bulk fermenting.

Wow, I haven't typed that much about making a pizza in a long time-thanks. ;)
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on January 27, 2015, 11:11:14 AM
To be clear, there is no honey in the dough pictured above. I'm trying it more for flavor than browning though that may be an added benefit. Better cheese should let me bake for another 30 seconds which I'm hoping will get me where I want to be with browning. I don't want to be as dark as Mozza.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: JD on January 27, 2015, 11:24:02 AM
I've never heard of pizzeria Mozza until this thread, but that pepperoni pizza has got me hypnotized. 
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: jeff v on January 27, 2015, 11:50:19 AM
To be clear, there is no honey in the dough pictured above. I'm trying it more for flavor than browning though that may be an added benefit. Better cheese should let me bake for another 30 seconds which I'm hoping will get me where I want to be with browning. I don't want to be as dark as Mozza.

My misassumption on the browning then.

That sausage and onion pie is one of my favorites.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on January 27, 2015, 09:41:55 PM
This one has 2% dark rye (+98% KAAP)  and 1% honey. For kicks and grins, I took a couple balls to my friends restaurant where he runs a 725F oven.  Unfortunately, I forgot to bring my camera. I didn't like the honey in the dough.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Jackitup on January 27, 2015, 10:00:07 PM
How do you think diastatic malt powder or syrup would play in there? Thinking of getting some myself to try out in some breads and pies. I know some are liking it
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Chicago Bob on January 27, 2015, 10:05:28 PM

  She's a beauty C and I know you are just getting started on this.


Here is a pic from a place that touts the "wood fired oven experience" here in town. Flat crap that can't even touch your home oven deal. They were just voted Durhams #1 pizza. The pleated khaki pants crowd in this town are clueless. They need you, bad.  ;D

http://www.yelp.com/biz/pizzeria-toro-durham

Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on January 27, 2015, 11:01:37 PM
That's kind of scary.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on January 28, 2015, 02:37:17 AM
How do you think diastatic malt powder or syrup would play in there? Thinking of getting some myself to try out in some breads and pies. I know some are liking it

Malt syrup is next on my list to try. Who knows, I might even break down and try DM.  :-[
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: PizzaManic on January 28, 2015, 05:56:45 AM
I read a saying that goes something like this - it's the hand that makes the food taste so good so I guess you right in saying you don't need expensive flour to make great Pizza but we need your hand  :-D

Is there any specific reason for using dark rye? Does it influence texture, taste or is it just for colour?

Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: deb415611 on January 28, 2015, 06:59:30 AM
Malt syrup is next on my list to try. Who knows, I might even break down and try DM.  :-[

If you want some I can send you some.  I have a lb and will never go through it all.  I have the AB Mauri brand.   Based on the ones I did this weekend I don't think it's going to bring you to where you want with this one but would be worth a try and also might be worth a try in a Johnny's clone.

 
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on January 28, 2015, 08:54:29 AM
Is there any specific reason for using dark rye? Does it influence texture, taste or is it just for colour?

Just to give it a bit of depth of flavor. You really can't see it unless you look hard, and I don't think it's doing anything to the texture.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on January 28, 2015, 08:54:45 AM
If you want some I can send you some.  I have a lb and will never go through it all.  I have the AB Mauri brand.   Based on the ones I did this weekend I don't think it's going to bring you to where you want with this one but would be worth a try and also might be worth a try in a Johnny's clone.

 

Thanks Deb, I may take you up on it.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: stonecutter on January 28, 2015, 09:12:10 AM
  She's a beauty C and I know you are just getting started on this.


Here is a pic from a place that touts the "wood fired oven experience" here in town. Flat crap that can't even touch your home oven deal. They were just voted Durhams #1 pizza. The pleated khaki pants crowd in this town are clueless. They need you, bad.  ;D

http://www.yelp.com/biz/pizzeria-toro-durham

I would need more than a glass of wine to wash that brick down.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: zaafreak on January 28, 2015, 11:42:11 AM
That pizza would get thrown into the back yard for the squirrels to eat.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: deb415611 on January 28, 2015, 11:53:24 AM



Here is a pic from a place that touts the "wood fired oven experience" here in town. Flat crap that can't even touch your home oven deal. They were just voted Durhams #1 pizza. The pleated khaki pants crowd in this town are clueless. They need you, bad.  ;D


I have seen that pizza in CT too. 
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: bakerbill on January 28, 2015, 02:13:00 PM
I was looking for the link.  Thank you.

bakerbill
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: bakerbill on January 28, 2015, 02:41:49 PM
What is RO water?  What do you mean by "remaining water?"  Thanks.

bakerbill
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on January 28, 2015, 02:52:51 PM
What is RO water?  What do you mean by "remaining water?"  Thanks.

bakerbill

RO = Reverse Osmosis (http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=20056.0)

Remaining flour and water are the portions of the total flour and water not used in the preferment.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: PizzaManic on January 29, 2015, 02:00:35 AM
Does anyone know the Thickness Factor for this formula?
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on January 29, 2015, 09:03:06 AM
Technically, it 0.093 (12.3oz dough / 132.7 in^2), but keep in mind that TF is not a very good tool for comparing different styles. For example, on one end of the spectrum my Johnny's Clone is the same thickness from one edge to the other and thus a small cornicione. This style has a massive cornicione but is very similar to the Johnny's Clone in thickness in the center of the pie.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: jsaras on January 30, 2015, 10:30:43 AM
How did you decide on the IDY quantity for the preferment? 
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on January 30, 2015, 12:18:17 PM
How did you decide on the IDY quantity for the preferment?

Pure SWAG.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Mmmph on January 30, 2015, 12:21:30 PM
Pure SWAG.

Heheh... :-D This...from the guy who posted http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=26831.0
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on January 30, 2015, 12:32:22 PM
Heheh... :-D This...from the guy who posted http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=26831.0

I suspect working on that helped my swagging skills a bit.  ;D
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Chicago Bob on January 30, 2015, 12:35:24 PM


   If you done got SWAG....I'm going home.  :-\
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Mmmph on January 30, 2015, 01:18:40 PM
I suspect working on that helped my swagging skills a bit.  ;D

Touchť
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on March 08, 2015, 08:31:29 PM
I've made a bunch of different variations of this pizza recently but have not had time to post. Forget the wheat germ and rye flour. Spelt is the way to go for this. My current formulation:

98% KAAP + 2% spelt.
75%HR
2.5% barley malt syrup
2.25% salt
0.15% IDY

Preferment 40% of the KAAP flour at 100% HR for 12 hours. Follow the rest of the directions in the first post.

This crust is awesome!
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: jeff v on March 08, 2015, 09:19:26 PM
Spelt is the way to go for this.
Yes it is.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: hotsawce on March 09, 2015, 01:05:07 AM
I'll have to try spelt. I was actually messing around with some Kamut....I liked the flavor quite a bit.

I've made a bunch of different variations of this pizza recently but have not had time to post. Forget the wheat germ and rye flour. Spelt is the way to go for this. My current formulation:

98% KAAP + 2% spelt.
75%HR
2.5% barley malt syrup
2.25% salt
0.15% IDY

Preferment 40% of the KAAP flour at 100% HR for 12 hours. Follow the rest of the directions in the first post.

This crust is awesome!
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: parallei on March 22, 2015, 10:43:52 PM
Yes it is.

Yes, the spelt is good!  This is tonight's pie.  72% HR overall, 30% of flour @ 100% HR as a poolish for 11 hours, 2.5% barley malt syrup, 2% salt, .25% IDY split evenly between the poolish and final dough, 3% spelt.  Hand mixed, stretch and folds @ 30 min for two hours, into fridge for 18 hours, room temp for 2 hours.  About 9 min on the 1/2 steel.  That is about 2 min too long for my tastes.  Fontina, fresh mozz, white potato, pancetta, red onion, OO, Aleppo Pepper, black pepper.

Oh yeah, GM AP flour.

Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: jsaras on March 23, 2015, 09:01:34 AM
Outstanding!
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: parallei on March 23, 2015, 09:28:28 AM
Thanks jsaras.

And thanks to Craig for the easy to do and quite tasty recipe. :chef:
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on March 23, 2015, 09:45:55 AM
Nice pie. Like the topping combo. What was your oven temp?
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: parallei on March 23, 2015, 09:51:18 AM
Nice pie. Like the topping combo. What was your oven temp?

Thanks.  Temp was whatever 500F on convection in my old Viking is.  Didn't measure the temp on my 1/2" hunk of A36!

I was trying for crisper, but prefer not quite so crisp.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Pete-zza on March 23, 2015, 10:40:29 AM
Paul,

Excellent job. Can you tell me what amount of dough you made and the size of pizza made from the dough?

What intrigues me about your pizza and also Craig's attempts is the large cornicione and what causes it. Is it the amount of yeast used in the preferment (0.15% IDY is a lot for an 18-hour preferment at around 68 degrees), or is it the mix/knead/stretch-and-fold protocol, or is it the shaping of the final skin to achieve the large cornicione, or is it the use of the convection feature (with a steel plate in your case), or maybe some combination of these measures? Maybe even Craig has an opinion on this.

Peter
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on March 23, 2015, 11:11:25 AM
What intrigues me about your pizza and also Craig's attempts is the large cornicione and what causes it. Is it the amount of yeast used in the preferment (0.15% IDY is a lot for an 18-hour preferment at around 68 degrees), or is it the mix/knead/stretch-and-fold protocol, or is it the shaping of the final skin to achieve the large cornicione, or is it the use of the convection feature (with a steel plate in your case), or maybe some combination of these measures? Maybe even Craig has an opinion on this.

That was a big part of my goal for this pie (no pun intended). I think the main driver is a higher TF with the extra dough in the cornicione. My typical NP is 275g/13"=TF 0.073. The pies in my first post were 350g/14"=TF 0.080. All the extra dough is in the cornicione. Beyond that, it has some sugar and it's a pretty well fermented dough with the RT preferment and several days CF. I'm not sure there is much more to it.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: parallei on March 23, 2015, 05:47:52 PM
Paul,

Excellent job. Can you tell me what amount of dough you made and the size of pizza made from the dough?

What intrigues me about your pizza and also Craig's attempts is the large cornicione and what causes it. Is it the amount of yeast used in the preferment (0.15% IDY is a lot for an 18-hour preferment at around 68 degrees), or is it the mix/knead/stretch-and-fold protocol, or is it the shaping of the final skin to achieve the large cornicione, or is it the use of the convection feature (with a steel plate in your case), or maybe some combination of these measures? Maybe even Craig has an opinion on this.

Peter

Hi Peter,

The pizza was 14-inch dia and I used 385g of dough.  So a TF of about 0.09.

I left about a 1-inch, plus a bit, wide strip of just oiled dough around the outside edge.  I know this because that is about how wide the brush I used to apply the oil is.  I don't remember making a special effort to  get more dough into the cornicione.  However, I was probably into glass of wine #2 by that time.

In my case, I think it is a matter of the high hydration and an almost "Tartine Bread" approach to handling the dough.  This approach gives me explosive results on the 2Stone with NP doughs also.  So, in this case it went:

- Dissolve barley malt syrup in most of the water.
- Add polish and mix well
- Add all the flour and mix with spoon or hands
- Add salt and remaining water and mix with hands
- 30 min rest
- Stretch and fold once around in the bowl
- Repeat rest/strech folds for the next 90 min.
- Ball (sort of it was pretty wet)
- Into the fridge

I want to try a Vinne's pie, so perhaps I'll loose the polish to eliminate one variable.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: norma427 on March 23, 2015, 05:49:31 PM
Paul,

Beautiful crumb and pie!

Norma
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: parallei on March 23, 2015, 07:36:22 PM
Paul,

Beautiful crumb and pie!

Norma

Thanks Norma.  High praise from a pro!  I still covet a "Norma's Pizza" cap! :D

Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: woodmakesitgood on March 23, 2015, 11:55:10 PM
Hi Peter,

The pizza was 14-inch dia and I used 385g of dough.  So a TF of about 0.09.

I left about a 1-inch, plus a bit, wide strip of just oiled dough around the outside edge.  I know this because that is about how wide the brush I used to apply the oil is.  I don't remember making a special effort to  get more dough into the cornicione. 

I want to try a Vinne's pie, so perhaps I'll loose the polish to eliminate one variable.

Nice cornicione!
I bet you could easily transition this into a Vinnie pie.

Craig's ideas about a higher TF, and getting more dough into the rim make sense.
Vinnie probably could do this without even thinking about, it after so much practice. Kind of like you did, but with wine.  ;D
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: CaptBob on March 24, 2015, 12:16:32 AM
Nice cornicione!
I bet you could easily transition this into a Vinnie pie.

Craig's ideas about a higher TF, and getting more dough into the rim make sense.
Vinnie probably could do this without even thinking about, it after so much practice. Kind of like you did, but with wine.  ;D

That's EXACTLY what I was thinking Charles! Paul may not have even tried but that seems a lot like a Vinnie pie.....
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: fazzari on March 24, 2015, 09:09:17 AM
Craig
Nice looking set of pizzas you've got started here!  I know you're a fan of stretch and folds and was wondering if you have it figured out why they work so well?  I've done as much reading as I could, and have done a ton of experiments comparing the fold to the mixer...and my conclusion is the folded dough wins hands down when comparing oven spring, color, heat transfer etc.  I can only guess and say it must have something to do with lining up gluten strands in one direction, while incorporating air, and fermenting at room temperature in between folds.  All I have is that guess, but I've done enough experimenting to know it's the only way I will mix dough again.  Again, great looking pizza!!

john
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on March 24, 2015, 09:25:40 AM
Thanks John. I really don't know what the secret is, but I love the way it makes the dough feel and perform. I suspect incorporating air is an important, at least with respect to performance.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: invertedisdead on March 30, 2015, 11:26:37 AM
This is my 2nd round with Craig's dough. Don't have any barley malt syrup or spelt so I replaced the syrup with brown sugar and the spelt with whole wheat flour. I added the whole wheat to the preferment this time. Not enough experience with this dough to know if that was dumb or not.
Trying to reduce my bench flour and had some sticking that turned this one into a football. Just got my pizza stone and I feel like I am starting over, all the experimenting I did in my perforated pizza pan seems to have gone out the window. I just tried the broiler method for the first time and this was a 2-3 minute pie versus my usual 8-10 minute pie. Had to pull or it was gonna burn. Wow! Gonna skip the sweetener in my next batch as my oven seems to be cooking very hot. The temperature control is messed up, for example if I turn it to 200 it will be at 450 degrees. At 550 my hanging thermometer only reads to 600 so no idea what temp the actual stone or oven is.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: HansB on March 30, 2015, 12:04:48 PM
Looks good. I can't wait to try this recipe. I have the spelt, just waiting on syrup to arrive from Amazon! Barley Malt Syrup was hard to find around here...
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Johnny the Gent on March 30, 2015, 12:07:47 PM
You don't need fancy or expensive flour to make great pizza.

Could't agree more. It's the indian, not the arrow  ;)
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Jackitup on March 30, 2015, 03:55:00 PM
Craig, you should add your Mozza recipe to the Dough Generator if you are near the final draft of it. Just bought some spelt to give it a try

jon
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Jackitup on March 30, 2015, 04:15:13 PM
Also, is it really only 2% spelt, for 225 g of flour that would only be 5ish grams of spelt right?
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: invertedisdead on March 30, 2015, 04:41:13 PM
Also, is it really only 2% spelt, for 225 g of flour that would only be 5ish grams of spelt right?

Yeah, that would put you at 4.5 g.
I did 353g of flour with 7g whole wheat cause I don't have spelt.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Jackitup on March 30, 2015, 04:53:05 PM
Good then, the poolish is a poolin', tomorrow morning I will toss in the rest and fire up the BS tomorrow nite!

 jon
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on March 30, 2015, 05:38:19 PM
Yeah, that would put you at 4.5 g.
I did 353g of flour with 7g whole wheat cause I don't have spelt.

Yes, that's right.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on March 30, 2015, 05:39:19 PM
This is my 2nd round with Craig's dough. Don't have any barley malt syrup or spelt so I replaced the syrup with brown sugar and the spelt with whole wheat flour.

I'd use rye flour before whole wheat - for that matter I'd leave it out before I'd use whole wheat. I'd also probably use white sugar rather than brown.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: parallei on March 30, 2015, 06:36:47 PM
I'd use rye flour before whole wheat - for that matter I'd leave it out before I'd use whole wheat. I'd also probably use white sugar rather than brown.

Forget the whole wheat, it would be a totally different taste.  I thought the rye was nice, but I'd keep it in the 2% range.  On the other hand, I preferred the spelt, taste wise.  I used 3%, but would consider bumping it up to 5%.  To my tastes, the spelt doesn't have as strong a flavor as the rye.  Everyone's tastes are differentÖ...
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on March 30, 2015, 07:01:09 PM
Spelt is the right flour for this recipe. It's an incredible pizza.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Jersey Pie Boy on March 30, 2015, 07:18:28 PM
I'm sure it tastes even better than it looks...and it looks unbelievable!

 You specify AP flour rather than BF or HG..this is to keep the protein lower and the pie softer? In the absence of KAAP, is it safe to guess another brand might work also? I have my spelt standing by  :)
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on March 30, 2015, 07:23:13 PM
GM or any other decent AP would be fine. Bread flour would work too; I just like AP a little bit better for most pizza.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on March 30, 2015, 07:25:17 PM
Could't agree more. It's the indian, not the arrow  ;)

If I was teaching pizzamaking, I wouldn't let you use anything except AP until you could make a great pie with it. IMO, that's how you learn the fundamentals that lead to great pizza.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Jersey Pie Boy on March 30, 2015, 07:27:48 PM
Great, thanks..I see the HR mentioned at 72 and 75. Which do you find best at this point....do you prefer the texture of one over the other?

I was a good Jr Pie Boy---I  started with AP..for quite a while :)
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: parallei on March 30, 2015, 07:39:14 PM
Great, thanks..I see the HR mentioned at 72 and 75. Which do you find best at this point....do you prefer the texture of one over the other?

I was a good Jr Pie Boy---I  started with AP..for quite a while :)

I really liked this dough, so I'm going to keep butting in.  72- 75? It depends.  I live a 5280 ft and it is dry as a bone.  Craig is down there in some humid hell hole.  Try (72+75)/2 = 73.5, and report backÖ...
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Jersey Pie Boy on March 30, 2015, 07:51:26 PM
Will do...Thanks!
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: invertedisdead on March 30, 2015, 11:46:31 PM
I'd use rye flour before whole wheat - for that matter I'd leave it out before I'd use whole wheat. I'd also probably use white sugar rather than brown.

Thanks Craig, I do have dark rye flour on hand, but not light. Would that still be applicable or should I omit it? When you were talking about how much better the spelt was than rye I thought I better skip the rye, and whole wheat was the only other flour I had. I might get a small bag of spelt to try. At 2 percent it would last a long time. I see Bobs Red Mill has organic spelt berries which i could grind fresh in the Blendtec.

My usage of brown sugar stemmed from seeing folks use molasses in pizza. I don't have any so I assumed the slight bit of molasses in the brown sugar may contribute to a little more coloration. I guess it's a habit I formed when I first started doing pizzas and had trouble getting color.

Re: flour, I try and stock up when the mexican market has KAAP for .99 cents for the 2lb bag.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on March 31, 2015, 09:00:07 AM
I'd suggest trying the rye. Dark is fine. I think that's what Mozza uses.

I didn't know there was such a thing as KAAP in a 2# bag?
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: invertedisdead on March 31, 2015, 10:28:25 AM
Sweet, I'll be giving that a go soon with the rye flour.

Re: KAAP, Maybe they discontinued it and that's why it was only $1. They have it on the KA website but it shows out of stock. It seems like they only sell the organic flour in the 2 lb bag now.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: waynesize on March 31, 2015, 03:50:26 PM
I picked up some spelt flour today (Arrowhead Mills Organic).  Haven't found the syrup around here, but I want to give it a go anyway. I am not used to working with dough in the 70%+ HR range, but I will give it a try.  I have been getting bored with my usual dough, and this one caught my eye as soon as Craig posted it. Wish me luck! I will start the poolish in the morning.

Wayne
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on March 31, 2015, 04:02:57 PM
You might add 1.5-2% sugar in place of the syrup.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Jackitup on March 31, 2015, 09:45:24 PM
Damned......Really Likey. And the first time using this, BIG HIT!! Warden Rosie put in the the ten EASY! Thin coat of 7/11 tomatoes, onions, mozz/prov mix with more sauce drizzled on top the cheese from a squirt bottle and finished with pepperoni on 1 half and capicola and ground venison on the other. In the BS with stone temp at 655 and cranked at the end to finish. In spots it was like a NY style/Detroit style hybrid. Very Very likeable, enjoyable pie. Nice chew and toothsomeness to the crust but not to be tough, EXCELLENT webbing/crumb structure, a keeper for sure!! :drool:

jon

ps.........roughly 400ish gram ball for a 14" pie, poolish for 12, fridge for 8-9, 5-6 reballs during that time because dough was very sticky, last 3-4 hours room temp with last reball 2 hours before using, tackiness was MUCH less, very forgiving, elastic dough, fun to work with
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: norma427 on March 31, 2015, 10:08:16 PM
Jon,

Your Mozza-inspired pizza looks great!

Norma
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Jackitup on March 31, 2015, 10:15:30 PM
Thank you Norma, but Craig did all the leg work on this, making an easy to understand formula and work flow for this pie, one that I am used to as I am fond of the overnite to 24 hour poolish, BIG thanks to Craig here. If I can get this the first time, anyone can :-D

jon
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Jackitup on March 31, 2015, 10:18:35 PM
One more thing, I used Kyrol HG Bromated flour as that's what I have around for most of my pies or breads

jon
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: norma427 on March 31, 2015, 10:24:00 PM
Thank you Norma, but Craig did all the leg work on this, making an easy to understand formula and work flow for this pie, one that I am used to as I am fond of the overnite to 24 hour poolish, BIG thanks to Craig here. If I can get this the first time, anyone can :-D

jon

Jon,

I know Craig did all the leg work for a Mozza-inspired pizza.  Kudos to Craig too!   8)  I might try a Mozza-insprired pizza at some point in time.  Lol about if you can do it anyone can.  You are a great pizza maker. 

Norma
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Jackitup on March 31, 2015, 10:41:53 PM
Great????? You're too kind Norma, you on the other hand, Ms Super Woman, is Great :-D I just don't take pictures of the crappy, soso ones :P This recipe is really good though. There were inconsistencies with the thickness due to its elastic nature due certainly to the extra reballing I did thus building up the gluten, overly concerned with the initial stickiness (next time I'll back off a bit) but ended up actually liking it that way giving one slice a NY style texture and the next slice or even the next bite a Detroit style crumb. Very interesting pie to the pizza edjamacated eye :-D
Still waiting for that new red hairdoo to show up though :-D >:D :-D >:D

jon
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: waynesize on April 01, 2015, 03:56:34 PM
Found the syrup. Pre-ferment is bubbling, and I am excited to be trying this dough.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Jackitup on April 01, 2015, 10:57:14 PM
My poolish after a 12 hour RT ferment. Just mixed the dough for a triple batch. Craig, if you read this tonite, would you bulk overnite and then reball into 3 tomorrow (using tomorrow nite) or ball into 3 tonite and let go overnite in the fridge

jon
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: CaptBob on April 01, 2015, 11:15:51 PM
Jon...did you use all of the formula yeast in the poolish?
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Jackitup on April 01, 2015, 11:35:26 PM
I added all the water, spelt, barley malt, half the flour and yeast to the poolish. Held back half the flour and all of the salt to mix into final dough tonite. Poolish was very busy, carbonated/boozy smell to it.

jon
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Jackitup on April 03, 2015, 05:04:23 AM
Made more of mozzaCraig's formulation  for my ma, daughter, grandkids, sister and her hubby, everyone said tell Craig thanks, BIG HIT :-D Stone temp 650-680.

jon
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on April 03, 2015, 05:19:36 AM
I added all the water, spelt, barley malt, half the flour and yeast to the poolish. Held back half the flour and all of the salt to mix into final dough tonite. Poolish was very busy, carbonated/boozy smell to it.

jon

Sorry I didn't respond earlier. I just saw this post. If I'm making poolish, I only add flour, water, and yeast. Also, I always use all the formula yeast in the poolish. I don't' see the logic in holding some back. For pizza, 40% of the formula flour generally seems to work best for me.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on April 03, 2015, 05:20:59 AM
Made more of mozzaCraig's formulation  for my ma, daughter, grandkids, sister and her hubby, everyone said tell Craig thanks, BIG HIT :-D Stone temp 650-680.

jon

I'm glad they like it. I think it's a really great flavored dough. I'd encourage you to try it at 550-600F next time. I think you might like it even more.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Jackitup on April 03, 2015, 05:32:08 AM
I'll back it down some but everyone liked as is, no one critiqued anything but my messy garage  :-D
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on April 03, 2015, 05:37:12 AM
I'll back it down some but everyone liked as is, no one critiqued anything but my messy garage  :-D

That's awesome. I'm really happy that they like it.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: CaptBob on April 12, 2015, 04:32:22 PM
I've been wanting to try another Mozza pie and I hope it's okay to post in Craig's thread so here goes.

This dough was: 73% HYD,  KABF, 5% spelt flour, .15% IDY, 1.5% raw sugar ( I didn't have malt syrup), 2.25% salt, 1.5% ghee (clarified butter). 25%, 100% HYD poolish with beer for 14 hours. Mixed 6 minutes, three stretch and folds 45 minutes apart then in to the fridge. 48 hr CF, two hours on the counter then opened. The dough ball was 390g which made a 13 inch pie.

Baked at 600 in the BS for about 4 minutes.

Thanks again to Craig for giving us some great guidance in this thread!
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Pete-zza on April 12, 2015, 04:47:51 PM
CaptBob,

Another stellar performance ;D.

As you know, I have been watching photos of the members' pizzas looking for signs of microblistering. I calculated that your total fermentation time was over two days because of the times between stretch and folds and the tempering at room temperature but you seem to have gotten some decent blistering that quite likely was also helped by the high bake temperature of your BS unit. By any chance did you oil the rim of the skin?

Peter
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: CaptBob on April 12, 2015, 04:50:45 PM
Thanks Peter!.......I should have mentioned it but I did oil the rim with avocado oil pre bake.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Jackitup on April 12, 2015, 05:02:22 PM
Very nice! Norma will like that blistering you achieved!!

 jon
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: CaptBob on April 12, 2015, 05:04:24 PM
Thanks Jon!
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on April 12, 2015, 05:28:46 PM
Bob, that pie looks freggin' awesome. That is exactly the pie I hoped this thread would produce! (Blackstone not withstanding  ;D).
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: CaptBob on April 12, 2015, 05:37:01 PM
Thanks Craig! Couldn't have done it without ya!!
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: zwarbles on April 12, 2015, 05:51:40 PM
Bob, you're my biggest inspiration!
I yen for the day I can make a pie that looks as good as yours!
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: CaptBob on April 12, 2015, 05:59:46 PM
You're too kind Pat but thank you. If not for the likes of Craig, Norma, Peter, and others I'd still be making frisbees and hockey pucks like I was a couple of years ago!
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: norma427 on April 12, 2015, 10:10:42 PM
CaptBob,

Great looking pizza!  Congrats.  8)

Norma
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: CaptBob on April 12, 2015, 10:13:15 PM
Thank you Norma!
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Jackitup on April 12, 2015, 10:36:01 PM
Bob, was the liquid in your formula ALL beer I assume or a beer/water mix? Also, was it fresh, fully cabonated beer or did you leave it out to go flat?  And, lighter beer like a Bud or a darker one like a stout?

Thanks
jon
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: parallei on April 12, 2015, 10:46:10 PM
Bob, that pie looks freggin' awesome. That is exactly the pie I hoped this thread would produce! (Blackstone not withstanding  ;D).

It is a great looking pie.  I guess everyone bagged the home oven thing. :(
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: CaptBob on April 12, 2015, 11:07:02 PM
Bob, was the liquid in your formula ALL beer I assume or a beer/water mix? Also, was it fresh, fully cabonated beer or did you leave it out to go flat?  And, lighter beer like a Bud or a darker one like a stout?

Thanks
jon

Jon..... The beer was for the poolish only. The final dough mix used water for the balance of the hydration. The beer was freshly opened, carbonated, and straight out of the fridge. I promptly drank what was left. I like a wheat beer...lately I've been using New Belgium Snapshot but any hefeweizen or comparable would work I think.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: CaptBob on April 12, 2015, 11:10:02 PM
It is a great looking pie.  I guess everyone bagged the home oven thing. :(

Thank you Paul. I decided to use the BS because it was a nice day here but I think it would have worked just fine in the kitchen oven as well........mine goes to 550 and I don't think the 50 degrees would have made that much difference.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: jsaras on April 12, 2015, 11:19:32 PM

Thanks Peter!.......I should have mentioned it but I did oil the rim with avocado oil pre bake.

Mmmm. Avocado oil!
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: CaptBob on April 12, 2015, 11:39:48 PM
Mmmm. Avocado oil!

I got that from you my friend!
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: parallei on April 13, 2015, 07:24:54 PM
Thank you Paul. I decided to use the BS because it was a nice day here but I think it would have worked just fine in the kitchen oven as well........mine goes to 550 and I don't think the 50 degrees would have made that much difference.

I think you should try the same dough in your home oven!  I'd love to see the results.  I'm sure they would be great, but different.

With a high hydration, 550F, and a well handled dough (which you certainly do), oven spring is a given.  My experience with both my 2Stone and my home oven has indicated that the confined area of the 2Stone, or BS in your case, provides a much better balance between top and bottom heat and a different type of bake at these temperature ranges.  Craig's first pies, in the home oven, are wonderful without the advantages of a BS or 2Stone.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: CaptBob on April 13, 2015, 09:39:51 PM
I agree with you Paul. The pies are certainly different when baked in the oven. A while back I was making pies one night and ran out of propane for the BS. I ended up baking in the oven. I used a Lodge cast iron pizza pan and set my oven at 550, which yields a temp of about 570 on the pan. The pies turned out great but, like you said, different. I did turn the broiler on and used that for about 45 seconds to finish the top. In general, the pies baked in the oven, for me, are slightly more "dense, crispy, and chewey" as opposed to the BS bake.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: tinroofrusted on April 14, 2015, 02:40:20 PM
Craig, you should add your Mozza recipe to the Dough Generator if you are near the final draft of it. Just bought some spelt to give it a try

I've posted Craig's Mozza-inspired recipe on the Dough Generator. You can have a look here (http://doughgenerator.allsimbaseball9.com/recipe.php?recipe_id=33).
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Jackitup on April 14, 2015, 03:03:30 PM
I've posted Craig's Mozza-inspired recipe on the Dough Generator. You can have a look here (http://doughgenerator.allsimbaseball9.com/recipe.php?recipe_id=33).

GREAT!!
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Jackitup on April 14, 2015, 07:33:28 PM
About ready to toss a mushroom and Spam pie in the oven. 1/2" diced Spam fried down to crispy little 1/4" dice with some baby bella mushrooms fried in herbed olive oil. Crust will be painted with a caramel ghee and into  550į oven on convection roast. IR gun reads 577 stone temp
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Jackitup on April 19, 2015, 09:51:17 PM
A 6 day MozzaCraig with mushrooms and green onions. It was a test using all beer for the liquid. Texture was like fried dough, kind of bagelish. Albeit very good I will not go all beer again, got a little too tough. Maybe on other doughs. Liked it a lot though overall

jon
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Jackitup on April 19, 2015, 10:48:52 PM
Upskirt shot and forgot to mention the virgin run with the new mini roller, really, REALLY, LIKEY!!! One handed control so the other hand can be pulling, stretching, turning, lifting aand the rolling is really quite light, just enough to level and not so heavy to push any bubbles out. But has the backbone for heavier rolling if you really needed to lay on some weight. Very much liked it and will not be something just to clutter the kitchen tool crock :-D

jon
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: norma427 on April 30, 2015, 03:44:47 PM
Craig,

Is whole grain spelt okay to use?  That is the only kind of Spelt I could find.

Norma
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on April 30, 2015, 04:22:28 PM
Craig,

Is whole grain spelt okay to use?  That is the only kind of Spelt I could find.

Norma

It's ground up like flour, right?

Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: norma427 on April 30, 2015, 05:26:36 PM
It's ground up like flour, right?

Craig,

Yes, it is ground up like flour, but is more of a cream color other than white.

Norma
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: CaptBob on April 30, 2015, 06:01:51 PM
That looks just like the stuff I've been using Norma....
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on April 30, 2015, 06:08:56 PM
Craig,

Yes, it is ground up like flour, but is more of a cream color other than white.

Norma

I think it will be fine. I bought some a while back too but have not tried it yet.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: norma427 on April 30, 2015, 07:05:29 PM
That looks just like the stuff I've been using Norma....

CaptBob,

Thanks for telling me the spelt I got looks like the spelt you are using.

I think it will be fine. I bought some a while back too but have not tried it yet.

Thanks Craig!  Was the spelt you purchased like the one I got?  I think I am getting mixed up on kinds of spelt. 

Norma
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: parallei on April 30, 2015, 07:32:37 PM
CaptBob,

Thanks for telling me the spelt I got looks like the spelt you are using.

Thanks Craig!  Was the spelt you purchased like the one I got?  I think I am getting mixed up on kinds of spelt. 

Norma

That looks like the stuff, Norma!
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: CaptBob on April 30, 2015, 07:38:03 PM
Norma....here's a dough ball that had 5% spelt. Kind of cream colored and speckley......
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: norma427 on April 30, 2015, 08:02:18 PM
That looks like the stuff, Norma!

Thanks Paul!

Norma....here's a dough ball that had 5% spelt. Kind of cream colored and speckley......

CaptBob,

Thanks for showing us what a dough ball looks like with 5% spelt.

Norma
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on April 30, 2015, 08:18:47 PM
Thanks Craig!  Was the spelt you purchased like the one I got?  I think I am getting mixed up on kinds of spelt. 

Norma,

I got both the whole grain and the white. I have only used the white so far. They don't taste that much different. I've been using the white only because I don't want to see spots in the crumb.

Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: norma427 on April 30, 2015, 09:13:47 PM
Norma,

I got both the whole grain and the white. I have only used the white so far. They don't taste that much different. I've been using the white only because I don't want to see spots in the crumb.

Craig,

Thanks!  I understand now.

Norma
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Jackitup on January 26, 2016, 03:14:04 AM
Started a poolish
Flour        279g (5% of this is spelt)
Water        209g
Salt            6.27g
IDY Yeast    .418g
Malt syrup (ran out so used same amout of maple syrup) 5.57g
Should make a 500g ball

Put 40-50% of the flour and all the spelt, all water, yeast, and 1/2 the maple syrup. Tomorrow after 12-14 hours at room temp I'll mix the rest to sit a few hours at RT for a farewell pizza for wife before she and my daughters and a few friends head to MX. Should be a nice quiet week with me and the dogs to lay around and not get yelled at!!
  :-D
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Jackitup on January 27, 2016, 11:29:00 PM
Finished pie here, fantastic!!! 
http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=26286.msg413446#msg413446
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on January 28, 2016, 08:16:36 AM
Looks great Jon.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Jackitup on January 28, 2016, 12:27:22 PM
Thank you sir ;)

jon
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: mitchjg on January 28, 2016, 06:01:12 PM
 ^^^
Looks great Jon.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Jackitup on February 04, 2016, 11:47:46 PM
Another Mozza pie linked here http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=26286.msg414749#msg414749 I keep coming back to this recipe with only a couple of adjustments. The spelt really adds that nutty flavor and the texture is always great. Easy doing the overnite poolish for 12-18 hours and then a 4 hour ball all at room temp. The poolish gives that extra window of time then just ball 4 hours prior. VERY silky, soft dough that has just the right extensibility to it. Has become one of our favorite doughs. And really been diggin' on the potatoes and onions, the bacon and creme fraiche a perfect addition to this! Great dough Craig!!!

jon
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on February 05, 2016, 09:49:09 AM
Glad you like it!
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: THEBBQMAN on February 09, 2016, 12:52:57 PM
Could I use my Ischia culture in this Mozza recipe, would it help, hurt, any reason why I shouldn't?
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on February 09, 2016, 01:54:00 PM
Could I use my Ischia culture in this Mozza recipe, would it help, hurt, any reason why I shouldn't?

No problem at all. The table should give you a good starting point: http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=22649.0
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: DoouBall on February 06, 2017, 10:49:35 PM
Reviving an old thread with some pictures of my first Craig's Mozza-Inspired Pizza - Fennel Sausage with Panna, Scallions, Red Onions and Fennel Pollen. The fennel pollen is 100% worth it - smelled and tasted amazing as a topper post bake.

KAAP, 70% hydration, 9 hour IDY sponge, 3% spelt and 2% diastatic malted barley. 6 minute mix in KitchenAid on speed 1 followed by 4 sets of stretch folds at 12 minute intervals. 2.5 day cold rise after balling the dough. 350g ball size. Baked in home oven at 570F for 6 minutes. Though it doesn't look that pretty, it is one of the best tasting pizzas I've ever made, and it is amazing that it can compete with Neapolitan pizzas made with Ischia starter. I dropped hydration to 70% to make it easier to handle and it was still great! There was a wonderfully strong sweet, malty and wheaty flavor in the baked dough.

Huge thanks to TxCraig for starting this awesome thread and to everyone who kept it going! Another huge thanks to TxCraig for his Neapolitan recipe which is my go-to on the Blackstone. Now, I finally have a great recipe for indoor baking during the rainy season!
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Jackitup on February 07, 2017, 12:21:59 AM
One of my favorite go to crusts, great job!
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: MaryLiza on February 07, 2017, 05:59:54 AM
I'm not trying to clone Mozza but rather trying to come up with a home oven pizza I like besides my Johnny's clone (http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=33831.0). First test:

Total Formula:
97.5% KAAP
1.25% dark rye flour
1.25% wheat germ
72% RO water
2.5% salt
0.15% IDY

Preferment:
41.0% of total formula flour
55.6% of total formula water (this will make the preferment 100% HR)
100.0% of total formula IDY
18 hours at room temp (~68F)

Dissolve the total formula salt in the remaining water. Add in the preferment and mix well. Add in the dark rye flour, wheat germ, and the remaining flour in a half dozen or so increments while mixing at a slow speed. The goal is to incorporate air with the flour. After it has all come together, let it rest for 20 minutes then give it a set of stretch-and-folds. Try to capture air in the dough when you fold. Give it a 12 minute rest followed by another set of stretch-and-folds. Repeat one more time. Divide and ball and refrigerate for 24 hours (48 would be better). Give the balls at least 2 hours at room temp before opening.

The pies below are 350g dough and 14Ē. I left quite a bit of dough at the cornicione which is painted with EVOO prior to topping.  Next time, Iíll probably go up to 400g with the additional dough in the center of the pie. The cornicione was the size I wanted, but the bottom was a bit too thin.

These were baked at 550 convection on stone. I didnít time the bakes. I wish I could have gone a bit longer to get a darker crust, but the cheap mozz I had would have failed.

Next time, Iím not going to add any wheat germ. It was OK, and you really couldnít see it much in the crust, but itís not the flavor Iím looking for. I will try 2% dark rye w/ 1% honey. Depending on how that comes out, I might try to find some barley malt syrup to try instead of the honey. 

The cheese on these is sliced fresh mozz with some grated fontina.  Overall, I really liked the texture of the crust Ė nice and crispy on the outside and very light and tender inside.

Thank you to TinRoof for some helpful insights.
I loved your recipe. I will try for sure. But there is one question I have to ask. Why can't we do topping with dehydrated vegetables like tomato flakes (http://www.hortonspicemills.com/listing.php?pid=82 )? I think it gives a crispy taste and easy to cook. Have you tried any such recipes?
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on February 07, 2017, 08:35:28 AM
I loved your recipe. I will try for sure. But there is one question I have to ask. Why can't we do topping with dehydrated vegetables like tomato flakes (http://www.hortonspicemills.com/listing.php?pid=82 )? I think it gives a crispy taste and easy to cook. Have you tried any such recipes?

No. I've never even thought about it. I think it's a great idea.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: DoouBall on February 07, 2017, 12:29:42 PM
Could you please let me know how do you manage the process of loading such a wet pizza dough into the oven? I built mine on the counter and used a super peel to pick up and slide into oven. This works reasonably well, and I'd like to learn how to manage with a regular peel. I see a few options before sliding into oven:

1. Build pizza fully on the counter, then slide it onto a floured wooden peel.
2. Build pizza fully on the counter, then slide it onto a perforated metal peel.
3. Build pizza on top of floured wooden peel.

Which one worked out best for you for these 70%+ hydrated doughs? Did you use semolina to prevent sticking?

Thanks! Alex
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on February 07, 2017, 01:54:23 PM
I'm pretty sure I made the pizza on the counter and then drug it onto the peel or slid the peel under. There were made using a wood peel - flour only - no semolina. I don't have much problems with high hydration unless a ferment in balls for more than 24 hours at room temp (low 60's).
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: DoouBall on February 07, 2017, 02:18:18 PM
Great! Thanks! I got a tip from Tony Gemignani's book The Pizza Bible to measure the dough ball temperature before shaping. If it's 65F or below, I start shaping. If it's higher than 65F, I noticed that the dough is much more likely to pancake out during stretching and stick to the peel so I throw it back in the fridge for 10-15 minutes first and it shapes more easily.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: hotsawce on February 18, 2017, 01:29:05 AM
Is anyone here still messing around with Mozza cones or Mozza style doughs? Mozza remains one of my all time favorites (if not, THE all time favorite) and I want to incorporate pieces of it into my style of pizza. I'm finding myself back in this thread after having a number of differing pizzas recently. My favorites of all time so far have been Mozza, Pizzeria Bianco, and Lucali/Giuseppina's. I want to work on a hybrid of them.

Do you all think that brush of olive oil is necessary for the Mozza dough? I do think it helps with the blisters, and I'm wondering how this type of dough would perform at a 3 minute bake... Also, how do you all find stretching a dough that wet to be?

Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on February 18, 2017, 02:37:53 AM
Do you all think that brush of olive oil is necessary for the Mozza dough?

It's absolutely necessary if you want that look.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: hotsawce on February 18, 2017, 10:06:13 AM
Is this still one of your favorite recipes or would you rather do the NY style with the short ferment and LDMP?

Interestingly, I saw Mozza was inspired by Pizzeria Bianco. My only gripe with Mozza is the bake is so long it destroys mozzarella...

It's absolutely necessary if you want that look.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on February 18, 2017, 10:13:02 AM
I do like it, but I almost never make it. I don't know if I have a preference either way between the NY I make and this. I've reverted back to pretty much nothing but NP.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: invertedisdead on February 18, 2017, 10:41:15 AM
I've reverted back to pretty much nothing but NP.

Interesting!

Still doing 48 hr RT ferments?
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on February 18, 2017, 11:13:56 AM
Interesting!

Still doing 48 hr RT ferments?

More and more, I'm doing 24 hours. Still at room temp but split 62F and 77F. I'll post on it in my other thread: https://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=14249.msg469443#msg469443
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: hotsawce on February 20, 2017, 01:11:01 PM
That spiderweb texture in your crust is exactly what I'm trying to achieve. What was your bake setup for this pie?

Reviving an old thread with some pictures of my first Craig's Mozza-Inspired Pizza - Fennel Sausage with Panna, Scallions, Red Onions and Fennel Pollen. The fennel pollen is 100% worth it - smelled and tasted amazing as a topper post bake.

KAAP, 70% hydration, 9 hour IDY sponge, 3% spelt and 2% diastatic malted barley. 6 minute mix in KitchenAid on speed 1 followed by 4 sets of stretch folds at 12 minute intervals. 2.5 day cold rise after balling the dough. 350g ball size. Baked in home oven at 570F for 6 minutes. Though it doesn't look that pretty, it is one of the best tasting pizzas I've ever made, and it is amazing that it can compete with Neapolitan pizzas made with Ischia starter. I dropped hydration to 70% to make it easier to handle and it was still great! There was a wonderfully strong sweet, malty and wheaty flavor in the baked dough.

Huge thanks to TxCraig for starting this awesome thread and to everyone who kept it going! Another huge thanks to TxCraig for his Neapolitan recipe which is my go-to on the Blackstone. Now, I finally have a great recipe for indoor baking during the rainy season!
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on February 20, 2017, 01:54:29 PM
That spiderweb texture in your crust is exactly what I'm trying to achieve. What was your bake setup for this pie?

Make your gluten weak.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: hotsawce on February 20, 2017, 03:20:26 PM
Welp, I started a variation of your recipe last night my preferment was very active this morning (40% of the flour.) Mixed and did a few sets of stretch and folds (dough was still pretty wet.) Didn't really seem to "come together" into something that might be manageable until I balled. They haven't pancaked out (yet) in the containers so maybe I got it right. I'm fearful of over fermenting but who knows.

Excited to see how it comes out... at about 0.09 TF for 10" Mozza sized pies. Going to top similar to what I had at Bianco (DiNapoli tomatoes, that really milky mozz.) I think Mozza generally uses low moisture...trying to straddle the line between getting that bread baker's crust and structure while not obliterating fresh toppings/cheeses. Hopefully it's great eats!

Make your gluten weak.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: DoouBall on February 20, 2017, 06:56:46 PM
hotsawce, my bake setup is 2 pizza stones. One is about 4-5" from the top and the second is about 5-6" below the first. I baked this at 570F, the highest that my Gaggenau oven can go. While I normally use the broiler, I was afraid to burn the olive oil crust, so I kept it on bake mode the whole time. I rotated the pizza once, around the 3 minute mark to even out the bake. After about 5 minutes, I moved the pizza to the bottom stone to crisp up the bottom just a bit. This took about 45 seconds.

I think the key to this style is

1)Use a high hydration dough - the 70% seemed like enough for me, but may be even better with higher hydration?
2)Leave a very large rim and oil it with EVOO using a brush(see picture).
3)Bake it for a solid 5-8 minutes depending on your oven temperature.

good luck!
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: DoouBall on February 20, 2017, 07:04:10 PM
Is this still one of your favorite recipes or would you rather do the NY style with the short ferment and LDMP?

Interestingly, I saw Mozza was inspired by Pizzeria Bianco. My only gripe with Mozza is the bake is so long it destroys mozzarella...

I used low moisture mozzarella from Whole Foods for this. It comes in a 4" x 5" x 1" block wrapped in plastic wrap. This was sliced about 3mm thick - it melted perfectly and didn't get destroyed. Nancy recommends avoiding fresh mozzarella for her pizzas presumably because it gets destroyed in the long bake. The other advantage of low moisture is that it stays melty and creamy much longer as the pizza cools down.

Until you get comfortable with handling high hydration, I would recommend 70% and use lots of bench flour when shaping the dough. I drop by entire dough ball onto a dinner plate covered with flour and coat it in flour on both sides before I even try to stretch it.

By the way, the recipe for the topping in the pic is here:

http://www.oprah.com/food/fennel-sausage-panna-and-scallions-pizza-recipe-mozza-cookbook
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: hotsawce on February 20, 2017, 09:36:01 PM
Thanks for the tips! I'm looking forward to baking these tomorrow. My dough balls are looking nice right now...haven't pancaked and don't feel too sticky to the touch right now; maybe it was the stretch and folds.

I don't have a broiler so will probably just bake on the center rack for about 5 minutes on the steel. I can bake on the upper most rack in about 3. I might try regular, fresh mozzarella... I prefer it but don't know if it will work.  I'm intrigued because Pizzeria Beddia is able to keep the fresh mozz relatively milky in their deck oven (and I've heard the bake is anywhere from 5 to 8 minutes there.)

Any left over dough balls I'm going to try to bake into panino rounds (Mozza does this and it looks like incredible sandwich bread.)
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: DoouBall on February 20, 2017, 11:12:58 PM
Awesome! Please post some pics.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: PizzaManic on February 21, 2017, 04:20:19 AM
DoouBall, no fair mate - you posted a Pic of your pie before it was baked - where's the baked pie  >:D  :drool:
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Jersey Pie Boy on February 21, 2017, 07:04:59 AM
Pretty sure it's in Reply 141
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: DoouBall on February 21, 2017, 12:45:02 PM
You got it, Jersey Pie Boy! I just posted the unbaked pie to illustrate how wide the untopped rim was before baking.  By the way, I just ordered a baking steel and will try this style on the steel - thanks JPB for your advice about this on another thread. 

Hopefully the pizza can survive on the steel long enough to bake through without the bottom burning. In theory, it would have better oven spring on the rim compared to stone, which is the main goal for this style.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Jersey Pie Boy on February 21, 2017, 02:35:56 PM
It should be great...as long as the steel is toward the top of the oven and not too close to the heat source, you should be good...the OS should be amazing. I've been baking mostly on the BS for a while but need to get back inside and hit the steel...The OS is definitely greater and I love that! 
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: hotsawce on February 21, 2017, 02:50:33 PM
I was thinking about baking in the middle to lower middle portion of the oven...wasn't getting the oven spring I wanted at the top and the bake was relatively quick (3 ish minutes.)



It should be great...as long as the steel is toward the top of the oven and not too close to the heat source, you should be good...the OS should be amazing. I've been baking mostly on the BS for a while but need to get back inside and hit the steel...The OS is definitely greater and I love that!
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: DoouBall on February 21, 2017, 03:27:14 PM
JPB, it's been raining non stop in California so my Blackstone is out of commission for now - hence the steel. I also love the Blackstone with TxCraig's NP recipe.

hotsawce, are you using the broiler? I'm curious how well the baking steel works with just max temp bake and no broiler.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: hotsawce on February 21, 2017, 11:56:32 PM
Baked off the pies today. Not bad for a first try. Bake time around 7 minutes. Sturdy and crisp/chewy like Mozza. Good hole structure and great flavor, under 7 ounces per ball. Surprisingly, the fresh mozzarella held up okay. 10".

Baked up remaining dough balls into bread (Mozza bakes dough balls into bread for panini.)

Great dual use. Next time I would reduce hydration slightly to 70%, and use a little less yeast. Maybe increase doughball weight slightly and stretch just a little thinner in the center. It was difficult to get out of the containers without a good amount of flour.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: DoouBall on February 22, 2017, 01:59:51 AM
Looks great!
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: mrmafix on October 07, 2018, 08:05:09 PM
Do we know what temp mozza bakes their pizzas at?
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: CaptBob on October 07, 2018, 09:04:05 PM
I saw 505F on the oven when I was sitting at the counter....
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: jsaras on October 08, 2018, 08:32:28 AM
I saw 505F on the oven when I was sitting at the counter....


I remember the same thing.  Itís quite low for a WFO.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: mrmafix on October 08, 2018, 10:44:52 PM
I am going to try this recipe out using a WFO, anyone have additional pointers?
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: jsaras on October 08, 2018, 11:24:13 PM
I am going to try this recipe out using a WFO, anyone have additional pointers?

Leave plenty of room for the cornicione to do its thing
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Jackitup on October 09, 2018, 12:08:48 AM
The Mozza pie is one of my favorites on the forum!
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: mrmafix on October 09, 2018, 12:13:40 AM
Is there a specified water temp for poolish / final dough?
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Jersey Pie Boy on October 09, 2018, 03:17:25 PM
Jonas, that's an actual Mozza pie, yes?
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: jsaras on October 09, 2018, 03:50:08 PM
Jonas, that's an actual Mozza pie, yes?

Yes it is
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: ARenko on October 09, 2018, 04:29:55 PM
The recipe calls for the full amount of yeast (.15%) in preferment at 68F for 12 hours (then 24-48 hours for finished dough).  My RT is 76F.  Would it be correct to use Craig's baker's yeast prediction model by finding the % yeast that results in 12 hour total fermentation time at 76F and using that amount?  Basically I'm wondering if the chart is applicable with the preferment method.  Is there something about the preferment method that requires increased yeast amount (compared to the chart)?  High hydration of preferment maybe?
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: mrmafix on October 12, 2018, 02:26:40 PM
According to the table, .15% IDY at 68F is a 7-8 hour fermentation. I too have the question of how to adapt the IDY to fit our RT temps (mine is 72F). My gut says at 72F I should be using around .1% IDY?
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: jsaras on October 12, 2018, 03:32:47 PM
The recipe calls for the full amount of yeast (.15%) in preferment at 68F for 12 hours (then 24-48 hours for finished dough).  My RT is 76F.  Would it be correct to use Craig's baker's yeast prediction model by finding the % yeast that results in 12 hour total fermentation time at 76F and using that amount?  Basically I'm wondering if the chart is applicable with the preferment method.  Is there something about the preferment method that requires increased yeast amount (compared to the chart)?  High hydration of preferment maybe?

Preferments donít fit into Craigís chart.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on October 12, 2018, 04:18:25 PM
According to the table, .15% IDY at 68F is a 7-8 hour fermentation. I too have the question of how to adapt the IDY to fit our RT temps (mine is 72F). My gut says at 72F I should be using around .1% IDY?

Preferments open up new possibilities vs. conventional dough - basically, it lets you capture the flavor of an over-fermented dough without over-fermenting your dough and having the problems of an over-fermented dough.

For example, as you noted, 0.15% IDY is way more than the table would suggest for 12 hours. You can do it in the preferment - effectively over-fermenting - but it works because you will then turn it into a dough that you won't overferment. 
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: ARenko on October 12, 2018, 04:23:30 PM
Craig,
Can you suggest how to adjust this recipe for different room temp, or if it is even necessary (considering your last post)?  Is it appropiate if I use the yeast amount that would give ~7 hours (I mistakenly said 12 in my previous post) total fermentation at 76F?  Alternatively how much time should I reduce RT ferment if I use .15%?

Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on October 12, 2018, 04:51:15 PM
I don't know. They best thing to do is experiment, tweak, repeat.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: ARenko on October 16, 2018, 05:34:38 PM
I went with .06% IDY for 12 hours at 76F preferment and cooked after 48 hours in the fridge.  Great crust.  Thanks TXCraig for sharing your recipe.  Excuse the poor photography...

Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on October 16, 2018, 06:11:47 PM
Looks good.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: hammettjr on October 16, 2018, 06:34:39 PM
I haven't read through this thread, so it could be repeat info, but 2 things:

Last weekend I watched the Chef's Table episode on Nancy Silverton on Netflix - I thought it was entertaining.

There's a video of her on YouTube answering questions sent by email, including specifics on how the recipe in the book was altered from the actual pizzeria version.

Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: mrmafix on October 17, 2018, 03:14:14 AM
What are the pros and cons of using diastatic malt barley bs malt barley syrup?
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on October 17, 2018, 06:19:55 PM
What are the pros and cons of using diastatic malt barley bs malt barley syrup?
They serve different purposes. There former is a source of enzymes that convert starch to sugars and the latter is a sweetener.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Gianni5 on October 17, 2018, 06:45:34 PM
Seeing all these Mozza style pizzas made me want to try brushing the crust with oil. Iíve been making pizza for 20 plus years and somehow Iíve never really done it. I thought it made for a slightly crispier cornicione and itís definitely something Iíll try again
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on October 17, 2018, 06:46:06 PM
I like that pizza A LOT!
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Gianni5 on October 17, 2018, 08:11:44 PM
Thank you
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: mrmafix on October 17, 2018, 08:23:16 PM
Seeing all these Mozza style pizzas made me want to try brushing the crust with oil. Iíve been making pizza for 20 plus years and somehow Iíve never really done it. I thought it made for a slightly crispier cornicione and itís definitely something Iíll try again

Using the TXcraig mozza recipe or your own?

Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: norma427 on October 17, 2018, 09:08:06 PM
I like that pizza A LOT!

 ^^^

Norma
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: mrmafix on October 17, 2018, 10:03:49 PM
They serve different purposes. There former is a source of enzymes that convert starch to sugars and the latter is a sweetener.

So they are not interchangeable for this recipe?
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Gianni5 on October 17, 2018, 10:42:48 PM
Iím going to try craigs recipe next.
I actually just took my regular New York style dough, gave it an extra day to ferment, left a little more dough for the cornicione then brushed with olive oil.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: mrmafix on October 18, 2018, 12:36:57 AM
Iím going to try craigs recipe next.
I actually just took my regular New York style dough, gave it an extra day to ferment, left a little more dough for the cornicione then brushed with olive oil.

Mind sharing the recipe?  Iím going to make Craigís this weekend and I would love to make yours too.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Jersey Pie Boy on October 18, 2018, 01:00:11 AM
G5,


That's much better looking than Mozza!
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Gianni5 on October 18, 2018, 01:40:08 AM
Yeah hereís the recipe
Gm superlative
57% water
2% oil
3% salt
.35% fresh yeast
 
Cold bulk ferment 24 hours then balled for 12

Thank you JPB but Mozza is lighter mine was a little dense but I think upping the hydration will help. Hereís a crumb shot and you can see itís a little tight.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Jersey Pie Boy on October 18, 2018, 01:51:31 AM
Thanks Gianni....how do you like Superlative? It's a bread flour rattan than high gluten, correct? I use Full Strength but I know Superlative is an option..though not inclined to test with a 50 lb bag :)
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on October 18, 2018, 06:46:58 PM
So they are not interchangeable for this recipe?

They aren't interchangeable in ANY recipe. Also, the diastatic malt comes in in different strengths that vary by 1000%. Use the strong stuff in a recipe calibrated for the weak stuff, and you'll have nothing left but a bowl of slop.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on October 18, 2018, 06:49:31 PM
Mind sharing the recipe?  Iím going to make Craigís this weekend and I would love to make yours too.

This is the one I'd call "my recipe" in this thread: https://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=36346.msg368906#msg368906
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: mrmafix on October 23, 2018, 10:53:42 PM
Is there a good dough calculator that accounts for different flours and special ingredients?
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Jackitup on October 24, 2018, 01:14:33 AM
Is there a good dough calculator that accounts for different flours and special ingredients?

Read thru this....

https://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=54187.0
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: mrmafix on October 25, 2018, 01:35:09 AM
It was almost impossible to ball up at 75% hydration. Had to use bench flour and it was still hard. Any tips?
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Jersey Pie Boy on October 25, 2018, 05:15:13 AM
 ;D I just tried this...and now I'm not so embarrassed because it was the same for me...globs of goo. I tried to use as little flour as I could but still more than I wanted. What's the secret Craig? I make breads with higher hydration for sure but the process is very different of course. I have egg on my face...and dried KAAP everywhere else  :-D
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on October 25, 2018, 06:48:31 PM
Add some additional sets of stretch-and-folds if needed. Giving the flour time to absorb water (20 min or so) before the first mixing will also help.

Doing half the time in bulk will make balling easier. Ball into plastic bags with a bit of spray oil. Tear them open and the ball will roll out. There is no way around using a decent amount of bench flour.

Check out Bill/SFNM's Tartine posts for more on working with high hydration pizza dough.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: mrmafix on October 29, 2018, 01:52:20 AM
Doughs got over fermented hence the shaping was way off. But, the dough tasted amazing.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: mrmafix on November 04, 2018, 08:58:39 PM
Just went to mozza this weekend and their cooks said the dough is fermented at RT, not fridges. What % of IDY would you use if fermenting at RT instead of fridge?
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: mrmafix on November 04, 2018, 09:11:06 PM
Also how would using BF differ from AP in this recipe?  Crispier?  More dense?
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Gianni5 on November 13, 2018, 05:58:18 PM
I finally had a chance to try Craigís recipe. I didnít have the barley malt syrup and I also went with 70% hydration instead of 75% just because itís my first shot at this recipe. It was probably one of the best crusts Iíve ever made. Thanks for taking some of the guess work of it Craig.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on November 13, 2018, 08:22:56 PM
Looks great.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: corkd on November 13, 2018, 08:50:19 PM
Iím going to try craigs recipe next.
I actually just took my regular New York style dough, gave it an extra day to ferment, left a little more dough for the cornicione then brushed with olive oil.
Just the outside rim brushed with oil? The entire dough?
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Gianni5 on November 13, 2018, 10:41:07 PM
The rim mostly but I end up brushing oil on the outer 2Ē or so too if that makes sense
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: hotsawce on November 14, 2018, 12:59:44 AM
How was stretching/handling?

I finally had a chance to try Craigís recipe. I didnít have the barley malt syrup and I also went with 70% hydration instead of 75% just because itís my first shot at this recipe. It was probably one of the best crusts Iíve ever made. Thanks for taking some of the guess work of it Craig.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: corkd on November 14, 2018, 11:38:59 AM
The rim mostly but I end up brushing oil on the outer 2Ē or so too if that makes sense
Thanks- likewise I have been making pizza a long time but have never done that. One of my favorite local WFO places does it and I really like the result.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Gianni5 on November 14, 2018, 12:26:16 PM
It handled nicely. It actually was a little elastic I think because I gave it quite a few stretch and folds. Other than that it was nice. I put a few more dough balls in the fridge overnight that Iím going to bake today and I think it will be much more relaxed
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: tboxer on January 07, 2019, 03:01:19 PM
I was hoping to get some advice on this recipe. I have made it a few times by following the recipe in the book, but as you probably know that recipe just has you make the dough the day of. I tried to do a cold ferment on mine and when I came back to it a few days later it looked like a puddle.

I saw someone mentioned they reballed and then let it rise again for another 24 hours, but does anyone know what they do in the restaurant?
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: jsaras on January 07, 2019, 03:37:46 PM
I was hoping to get some advice on this recipe. I have made it a few times by following the recipe in the book, but as you probably know that recipe just has you make the dough the day of. I tried to do a cold ferment on mine and when I came back to it a few days later it looked like a puddle.

I saw someone mentioned they reballed and then let it rise again for another 24 hours, but does anyone know what they do in the restaurant?

If you're going to do a cold fermentation for several days, reduce the yeast to 0.25% and it should be fine.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: tboxer on January 07, 2019, 05:23:55 PM
Thanks!
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: mrmafix on February 12, 2019, 02:40:13 PM
Has anyone used this recipe with a baking steel?  If so, any tips?
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: mrmafix on February 16, 2019, 02:46:03 AM
Love this recipe
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Gianni5 on February 16, 2019, 04:10:50 PM
Love this style too. I made another attempt at it a while back but never posted pics here
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Pazzo on February 16, 2019, 10:06:24 PM
At what temp do you think Mozza bakes?
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: CaptBob on February 17, 2019, 12:25:06 AM
About 500f 'ish.....
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: tinroofrusted on February 17, 2019, 12:39:54 AM
I think about 550F.  Not too hot. 
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: mrmafix on March 14, 2019, 01:16:49 PM
Two questions.

1.  Does anyone know if mozza uses a sourdough starter or IDY?
2.  Can you use a sourdough starter instead of IDY in a poolish?  If so, would you recommend it? 
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: jsaras on March 14, 2019, 01:19:37 PM
Two questions.

1.  Does anyone know if mozza uses a sourdough starter or IDY?
2.  Can you use a sourdough starter instead of IDY in a poolish?  If so, would you recommend it?

Their dough is not sourdough.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: mrmafix on March 14, 2019, 02:05:50 PM
Their dough is not sourdough.

Figured, doesn't taste like it.  Just wanted to verify.  Thank you. 
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: mrmafix on March 28, 2019, 07:55:12 PM
Does anyone know if Mozza uses AP or some type of BF?
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: jsaras on March 28, 2019, 11:56:51 PM
Does anyone know if Mozza uses AP or some type of BF?

Last I heard, they were using Mello Judith bread flour
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: mrmafix on March 29, 2019, 02:19:59 PM

Last I heard, they were using Mello Judith bread flour

That is interesting.  Seems like a low protein %, but mozza's dough is around 75% hydration.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: jsaras on March 29, 2019, 04:20:15 PM
That is interesting.  Seems like a low protein %, but mozza's dough is around 75% hydration.

Based on how the dough handles, I doubt the hydration is that high: https://youtu.be/_rItExSIAwQ
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: mrmafix on March 29, 2019, 10:14:55 PM
Based on how the dough handles, I doubt the hydration is that high: https://youtu.be/_rItExSIAwQ

What does it look like to you, 65%?
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: jsaras on March 29, 2019, 11:22:41 PM
What does it look like to you, 65%?

I'd guess 67%
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Kreetak on April 07, 2019, 03:33:45 PM
Hello guys!
I tried to do this recipe and I'm very happy! I did it with 75% (a little difficult to work with the dough) And I used spelt and agave syrup.

Thank you for this recipe!
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on April 07, 2019, 03:37:37 PM
Love this recipe

Happy to hear it!
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: vdempsey on May 03, 2019, 09:42:13 AM
I'm not trying to clone Mozza but rather trying to come up with a home oven pizza I like besides my Johnny's clone (http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=33831.0). First test:

Total Formula:
97.5% KAAP
1.25% dark rye flour
1.25% wheat germ
72% RO water
2.5% salt
0.15% IDY

Preferment:
41.0% of total formula flour
55.6% of total formula water (this will make the preferment 100% HR)
100.0% of total formula IDY
18 hours at room temp (~68F)

Dissolve the total formula salt in the remaining water. Add in the preferment and mix well. Add in the dark rye flour, wheat germ, and the remaining flour in a half dozen or so increments while mixing at a slow speed. The goal is to incorporate air with the flour. After it has all come together, let it rest for 20 minutes then give it a set of stretch-and-folds. Try to capture air in the dough when you fold. Give it a 12 minute rest followed by another set of stretch-and-folds. Repeat one more time. Divide and ball and refrigerate for 24 hours (48 would be better). Give the balls at least 2 hours at room temp before opening.

The pies below are 350g dough and 14Ē. I left quite a bit of dough at the cornicione which is painted with EVOO prior to topping.  Next time, Iíll probably go up to 400g with the additional dough in the center of the pie. The cornicione was the size I wanted, but the bottom was a bit too thin.

These were baked at 550 convection on stone. I didnít time the bakes. I wish I could have gone a bit longer to get a darker crust, but the cheap mozz I had would have failed.

Next time, Iím not going to add any wheat germ. It was OK, and you really couldnít see it much in the crust, but itís not the flavor Iím looking for. I will try 2% dark rye w/ 1% honey. Depending on how that comes out, I might try to find some barley malt syrup to try instead of the honey. 

The cheese on these is sliced fresh mozz with some grated fontina.  Overall, I really liked the texture of the crust Ė nice and crispy on the outside and very light and tender inside.

Thank you to TinRoof for some helpful insights.

TXCraig1,

Can I substitute the IDY in your Mozza clone dough formula for a natural sourdough starter? If yes, how much should my starter % be?

Vida
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on May 03, 2019, 10:01:12 AM
TXCraig1,

Can I substitute the IDY in your Mozza clone dough formula for a natural sourdough starter? If yes, how much should my starter % be?

Vida

Sure, If it was me, I'd change it to a room temp ferment. I'm not a fan of using cold ferment on sourdough. Maybe something like 7.5% starter for 12 hours at 77F. You can use this table to help find a starting point for whatever time/temp you want: https://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=22649.0
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: vdempsey on May 03, 2019, 10:07:22 AM
Sure, If it was me, I'd change it to a room temp ferment. I'm not a fan of using cold ferment on sourdough. Maybe something like 7.5% starter for 12 hours at 77F. You can use this table to help find a starting point for whatever time/temp you want: https://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=22649.0

Excellent TXCraig1. Will definitely try it. Although going on a short holiday (how will I survive without making pizzas for 2 weeks), so this will be in my dreams for now.  8)
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Francois.du.nord on May 03, 2019, 07:46:52 PM
Not going to lie. The pizzas in this thread look fantastic. I'm just kicking off a batch of dough for dinner 2 nights hence. Here is what I've got going right now.

100% poolish using TXCraig's adjusted recipe with 2% spelt, and I decided to see how CapotBob's beer for the poolish worked. I've got (left to right):

One Degree Sprouted Spelt
KAAP 11.7%
Poolish @ 100% hydration AP yeast @1.25X IDY amount, 16% water for yeast activation, 84% beer
Utepils: Ewald the Golden, Bavarian Style Hefewiezen

In front is Briess Dried Malt Extract (DME), which is (to the best of my understanding) a fully dried version of the Liquid Malt Extract that is specified upthread. Brewing beer comes in handy when you need to slake your thirst AND when you need offbeat ingredients.  ;)

For those of you who are curious, the mod factor for DME vs LME is 75% DME = 100% LME.

Challenge with DME is it is EXTREMELY hygroscopic (attracts water) After opening it will quickly turn rock hard if you dont seal it extremely well.

I'll keep y'all posted.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Francois.du.nord on May 05, 2019, 08:53:26 PM
Just finishing up the pizza I started in the post directly above. While not an expert's result, given my skill levels, I declare it a complete success. This recipe is on my short list for home oven bakes

Details: 15 hr pre ferment with 100% poolish as above. 400 g ball, 29 hr cold ferment, 5 hr RT before opening. I was probably a bit over fermented, but the ball was still workable.

Toppings were artichoke bottoms, kalamata olives, capers and leek rings on a simple red sauce with some fresh mozz.

10 minutes on steel. In the home oven, starting at 500 and reduced to 450 at 6 minutes. 30 seconds doming to finish.

Crust taste was very reminiscent of a good rustic artisan loaf. Cornicione was crisp outside with a soft interior, some spring back after biting into it.

Thanks to all for the guidance.

Edit: This morning I realized I forgot to oil the cornicione!  Darn It! I guess we can't call this Mozza style.


Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: vdempsey on May 05, 2019, 11:28:13 PM
Just finishing up the pizza I started in the post directly above. While not an expert's result, given my skill levels, I declare it a complete success. This recipe is on my short list for home oven bakes

Details: 15 hr pre ferment with 100% poolish as above. 400 g ball, 29 hr cold ferment, 5 hr RT before opening. I was probably a bit over fermented, but the ball was still workable.

Toppings were artichoke bottoms, kalamata olives, capers and leek rings on a simple red sauce with some fresh mozz.

10 minutes on steel. In the home oven, starting at 500 and reduced to 450 at 6 minutes. 30 seconds doming to finish.


Crust taste was very reminiscent of a good rustic artisan loaf. Cornicione was crisp outside with a soft interior, some spring back after biting into it.

Thanks to all for the guidance.

Francois.du.nord,

That is a nice looking pizza!

Vida
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: vdempsey on May 29, 2019, 09:35:43 AM
Sure, If it was me, I'd change it to a room temp ferment. I'm not a fan of using cold ferment on sourdough. Maybe something like 7.5% starter for 12 hours at 77F. You can use this table to help find a starting point for whatever time/temp you want: https://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=22649.0

My attempt at TXCraig1's  Mozza clone dough formula with my 7.5% sourdough starter.

Did 12 hour RT ferment but didn't take IT and I live in Philippines so expect that ambient temperature is higher. Had to put in WC (wine cooler) to stop bubble activity in Bulk Ferment. After splitting into 2 balls and less than an hour in RT 87-88F in IT, had to moved them into refrigerator. Then launched 1st ball in my oven much later than I had anticipated.

I really liked the taste of the crust.  2% Spelt flour added that extra oomph.  And I substituted  Malt Barley syrup with a local sweetener, Yacon syrup as couldn't find Malt Barley syrup.  I think that was pretty good too.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Pazzo on June 03, 2019, 09:35:31 PM
What do you think this would be like for an 18" pie?
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: vdempsey on June 03, 2019, 09:50:28 PM
What do you think this would be like for an 18" pie?

Is this question directed to me? If yes, I think an 18" pie would look better. 

I'm still a newbie, stretching and opening pies are still very new to me and so I am very cautious. Maybe too much.

Definitely not pleasing to my eyes but the taste of the crust was good. 

Vida
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Pazzo on June 03, 2019, 10:28:35 PM
Is this question directed to me?
Vida

Thanks for the answer, it was meant for anyone. I've never made an 18" pizza with this type of dough so not sure how it would hold up.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: vdempsey on June 03, 2019, 10:50:10 PM
Thanks for the answer, it was meant for anyone. I've never made an 18" pizza with this type of dough so not sure how it would hold up.

Pazzo,

I shall leave it to the pizza experts to answer your question.  :)

Vida
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Pazzo on June 07, 2019, 05:42:11 PM
What do you think this would be like for an 18" pie?

Might not have been meant for an 18" pizza but it turned out great. I'll definitely use this formula again but probably not in such a large pie.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: vdempsey on June 07, 2019, 08:32:16 PM
I think your pizza looks good Pazzo.  :pizza:
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Pazzo on June 07, 2019, 09:10:11 PM
I think your pizza looks good Pazzo.  :pizza:

Thanks. I should have split the dough in half and made two pizzas more similar to a Mozza or Craig's original pie in the beginning of the thread. I think the dough shines much more in that style than a big NY style. It's a great formula and workflow though, give it a try!
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: inutero303 on June 15, 2019, 06:03:10 AM
I'm not trying to clone Mozza but rather trying to come up with a home oven pizza I like besides my Johnny's clone (http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=33831.0). First test:

Total Formula:
97.5% KAAP
1.25% dark rye flour
1.25% wheat germ
72% RO water
2.5% salt
0.15% IDY

Preferment:
41.0% of total formula flour
55.6% of total formula water (this will make the preferment 100% HR)
100.0% of total formula IDY
18 hours at room temp (~68F)

Dissolve the total formula salt in the remaining water. Add in the preferment and mix well. Add in the dark rye flour, wheat germ, and the remaining flour in a half dozen or so increments while mixing at a slow speed. The goal is to incorporate air with the flour. After it has all come together, let it rest for 20 minutes then give it a set of stretch-and-folds. Try to capture air in the dough when you fold. Give it a 12 minute rest followed by another set of stretch-and-folds. Repeat one more time. Divide and ball and refrigerate for 24 hours (48 would be better). Give the balls at least 2 hours at room temp before opening.

The pies below are 350g dough and 14Ē. I left quite a bit of dough at the cornicione which is painted with EVOO prior to topping.  Next time, Iíll probably go up to 400g with the additional dough in the center of the pie. The cornicione was the size I wanted, but the bottom was a bit too thin.

These were baked at 550 convection on stone. I didnít time the bakes. I wish I could have gone a bit longer to get a darker crust, but the cheap mozz I had would have failed.

Next time, Iím not going to add any wheat germ. It was OK, and you really couldnít see it much in the crust, but itís not the flavor Iím looking for. I will try 2% dark rye w/ 1% honey. Depending on how that comes out, I might try to find some barley malt syrup to try instead of the honey. 

The cheese on these is sliced fresh mozz with some grated fontina.  Overall, I really liked the texture of the crust Ė nice and crispy on the outside and very light and tender inside.

Thank you to TinRoof for some helpful insights.



Hey Craig ..

have a question , been trying to replicate the Mozza pizza dough .. i followed your formula and came out great ! ..
the only problem is that the balls on the fridge got super flat after 24hrs .. i think this due to the high hydration
i never did  72-75% before .. im usually on the 60% and it holds up great

is this normal ? or im i doing something wrong .. i have all the dough on trays .

i can send u a photo if that helps ..

many thanks bud !

Tin

Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on June 15, 2019, 06:33:26 PM
Yes, it's a soft dough that will flatten out, I like to use individual cheap twist-tie plastic food bags for fermenting recipes like this, but smallish plastic tubs with some oil would also be a good choice.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: jkb on June 15, 2019, 06:46:04 PM
I like to use individual cheap twist-tie plastic food bags for fermenting recipes like this

Why make unnecessary trash?
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on June 15, 2019, 06:55:08 PM
Why make unnecessary trash?

Good thing I'm not drinking yet. That would open the door for so many comments I'd regret later  :-D
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: jkb on June 15, 2019, 10:15:11 PM
Good thing I'm not drinking yet. That would open the door for so many comments I'd regret later  :-D

Have some bourbon and think about it.   :-*
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: inutero303 on June 16, 2019, 06:36:39 AM
Yes, it's a soft dough that will flatten out, I like to use individual cheap twist-tie plastic food bags for fermenting recipes like this, but smallish plastic tubs with some oil would also be a good choice.

What about if u are making 50 pizzas for party .? i cook a lot of parties and use the classic dough trays ..

do i need to buy a lot plasitc tubs ?

what about re balling it few hours before to give it more shape ?

thanks craig !!!

Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: TXCraig1 on June 16, 2019, 06:16:25 PM
What about if u are making 50 pizzas for party .? i cook a lot of parties and use the classic dough trays ..

do i need to buy a lot plasitc tubs ?

what about re balling it few hours before to give it more shape ?

thanks craig !!!

There is no right answer. Try the different methods and see which works best for you. It's not necessarily the same as what works best for someone else.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Francois.du.nord on July 10, 2019, 08:15:32 PM
It was a busy 4th celebration up north. I almost forgot to post but here is one of the Mozza-esque pies that came out of the KP. I used the wheat beer starter, but subbed in honey instead of malt extract since I left my malt powder at home. Still turned out nicely if I do say so myself.

This is a 140 second pizza, Mushroom, Spinach, Orange Pepper and Stuffed Green Olive. Delicious!

Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Chicago Bob on July 10, 2019, 09:21:07 PM
It was a busy 4th celebration up north. I almost forgot to post but here is one of the Mozza-esque pies that came out of the KP. I used the wheat beer starter, but subbed in honey instead of malt extract since I left my malt powder at home. Still turned out nicely if I do say so myself.

This is a 140 second pizza, Mushroom, Spinach, Orange Pepper and Stuffed Green Olive. Delicious!

      Me likey.... mucho! https://tse1.mm.bing.net/th?id=OGC.ef7cbfb09546a5a962874c1bae228a75&pid=Api&rurl=https%3a%2f%2fmedia.giphy.com%2fmedia%2fBlVnrxJgTGsUw%2fgiphy.gif&ehk=JBMvmGn7mJ%2fTJOF48HEMjA
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Francois.du.nord on July 11, 2019, 02:40:55 PM
Thanks Chi-Bob!!
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: ivowiblo on January 19, 2020, 12:48:58 AM
Hi!

Any idea on adapting this recipe to RT fermentation in balls? I mean, replacing the 48 hs CF with RT.

If in the prediction model I compare the time for 0.16% IDY for both temperatures, I get that 61hs at 41F maps to 4hs at 72F. I doing 48hs, then it should be 2.5hs. Does it makes sense?

Thanks!
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: Jersey Pie Boy on January 19, 2020, 01:06:58 AM
One thing to be aware of is that the chart doesn't account for doughs  made with poolish
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: foreplease on January 19, 2020, 01:31:12 AM
HiDoes it makes sense?
Somewhat. You can change fermentation temp, % yeast used, or time spent fermenting in order to change what time (how long since final mixing) your dough will be ready to use. You found in Craigís prediction model that:
0.16% yeast suggests 61 hrs at 41į will  give you dough ready to use
óand tható
0.16% yeast suggests 4 hrs at 72į will give you dough ready to use
óand I did not understand what you meant by this sentence: ďI doing 48 hrs then it should be 2.5hs.Ē Does that mean 2.5 hrs at room temp after 48 hrs at cold ferment?


I think the easiest changes you could make would be the amount of yeast used. Choose a time you want the dough to be ready. Compare that to how much time you have available, adjust expectations if necessary. Choose a temperature you can maintain, look to the chart for the predicted amount of yeast you will need. Compare your results to what the chart suggested and note any big changes in that thread. This will be easier to determine, thanks to Craigís chart, than guessing about changing fermentation temperature or length of time fermenting, which will almost surely not match the time you plan to use the dough (not on your first guess anyway).


Bottom line is only change one variable at a time and start with the easiest one. Good luck. Post how your next experiment comes out.
Title: Re: Mozza-inspired Pizza for Home Ovens
Post by: ivowiblo on January 19, 2020, 10:58:00 AM
Hey! Thanks for your responses.
There was a typo in my question. What I meant is: "it's doing 48 hs CF...". I'm referring to the recipe. And then I did a basic math like "48 hs from those 61 leads to 2.5 at RT".

Just for having a ballpark of the times here to start experimenting...