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Author Topic: Hello! a few questions from an enthusiastic noob! :)  (Read 730 times)

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Offline shayke

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Hello! a few questions from an enthusiastic noob! :)
« on: April 03, 2022, 04:03:10 PM »
Hello there! :)

after baking two times on my new oven, kinda Napolitana-style pizzas, I want to try and make a new-york style pizza.
from what I saw on various youtube videos, NYS is thicker, and the dough contains olive oil. I wanted to ask for a few guidelines from the pros out there.

* is there a specific way to flatten the dough? in Napolitana I simply move the "air" from the center toward the crust (which eventually creates the high, puffy crust and very thin center).
* any special notes in regards to the resting time?
* most importantly: should I bake it the same way I do the napolitana, with the biscotto and around 450 degrees, or is there a more recommended way? I'm using the p134h. I got both original stone & biscotto.

what I wish to achieve is a pizza that is thicker, with a crust that is about the same height as the rest or maybe just slightly higher, and crispier all through (crispy on every bite and not "falling" in the middle like the Napolitana - which I'm quite in love with, I must say! I just wish to test more styles :).

Offline GumbaWill

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Re: Hello! a few questions from an enthusiastic noob! :)
« Reply #1 on: April 03, 2022, 04:52:57 PM »
Hello, Shaykster!
 Welcome to the pizza club! I could be wrong, but the thicker big crust style you describe sounds more like an "American Style" Try a search over in that forum you may find what you're looking for. Regarding the normal temperature for Neo pies, I imagine you are speaking centigrade? NYC-style pies are cooked longer and at about half the temperature. Good luck as you embark on a new phase of your pizza journey!

 Cordially,
 Will F.
 
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Online jkb

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Re: Hello! a few questions from an enthusiastic noob! :)
« Reply #2 on: April 03, 2022, 05:10:04 PM »
Dough 58% hydration, 0.9g/cm^2.  260degC.
John

Offline shayke

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Re: Hello! a few questions from an enthusiastic noob! :)
« Reply #3 on: April 04, 2022, 06:23:35 AM »
Dough 58% hydration, 0.9g/cm^2.  260degC.

thank you!
what does the 0.9g/cm^2 mean? excuse my ignorance :).

Online jkb

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Re: Hello! a few questions from an enthusiastic noob! :)
« Reply #4 on: April 04, 2022, 08:31:49 AM »
thank you!
what does the 0.9g/cm^2 mean? excuse my ignorance :).


Dough weight to pizza area ratio.
John

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Offline FoodSim

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Re: Hello! a few questions from an enthusiastic noob! :)
« Reply #5 on: April 04, 2022, 09:03:08 AM »
Dough 58% hydration, 0.9g/cm^2.  260degC.

0.9g/cm2 would be 5.80644g/in2, a thickness factor of 0.2048, or 893.8g for a 14" round pizza. That's thicker than the thickest Detroit style. I think you meant a different value.
The yeast flies south in November.

Offline [email protected]

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Re: Hello! a few questions from an enthusiastic noob! :)
« Reply #6 on: May 03, 2022, 09:37:31 AM »
shayke, as a very enthusiastic noob 18 months ago I bumped into this primer that really helped point me in the right direction for making way better NY Style.

The author got a lot of help here and synthesized it in a very helpful blog. If you follow her directions, you will make a very credible NY Style pizza. And it even has a button to convert measurements to metric.

https://feelingfoodish.com/the-best-new-york-style-pizza-dough/comment-page-7/

Great sauce too:

https://feelingfoodish.com/pizza-sauce/
« Last Edit: May 03, 2022, 11:40:06 AM by [email protected] »
Dean

Offline lazerlike42

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Re: Hello! a few questions from an enthusiastic noob! :)
« Reply #7 on: May 05, 2022, 11:13:13 PM »
shayke, as a very enthusiastic noob 18 months ago I bumped into this primer that really helped point me in the right direction for making way better NY Style.

The author got a lot of help here and synthesized it in a very helpful blog. If you follow her directions, you will make a very credible NY Style pizza. And it even has a button to convert measurements to metric.

https://feelingfoodish.com/the-best-new-york-style-pizza-dough/comment-page-7/

Great sauce too:

https://feelingfoodish.com/pizza-sauce/

I'm not exactly a beginner as I've been making pizzas and trying to make a good NY style for 5 years or more, but I am a beginner in that I have just in the past week or so "cracked the code" (and repeated it to make sure it wasn't a fluke) and reading through this link I can say for sure that a few of the points made here have been the difference that made all the difference in taking my pizza from pretty mediocre to reminding me of the pizzerias I used to eat at.

In particular, the points that I didn't know for years that really have made the most difference:

1) Freezing the cheese ahead of time
2) Not putting too much cheese on (basically making sure there are visible "patches" of sauce visible once the cheese is laid)
3) Shredding the cheese myself

I'd add one extra thought and one minor disagreement, coming from someone that's kindof a hybrid between very experienced (having been trying for years) and yet a beginner (having just figured out how to do it "right"):

1) I think using a pizza screen can be helpful at least when trying to get everything else right. Getting a pizza onto and off of a peel successfully is one of the things I've found to be the hardest to master. There's a real art to it, and it's easy to get it wrong and really mess up some pizzas when trying to get the hang of it, which makes it hard to evaluate (or to enjoy the fruits of!) all the other stuff you're doing. How's the dough? What adjustments need to be made to it? It's hard to tell if your crust is badly messed up because you had a hard time with the peel or it sticking. This is especially true if you're putting toppings on. For the best of both worlds, set the pizza on the screen and put it on the stone/steel, then after it's firmed up for a few minutes slide it off of the screen onto the stone/steel for the rest of the cook time. (It can be helpful to use a large spatula to make sure it's separated from the screen before trying to slide it off).

2) I slightly disagree that one should never use a rolling pin as a beginner. Yes, it will mean the crust won't wind up as the very best style crust one could ever achieve, BUT as with the peel, shaping the dough is a real art form. Working on developing that artistry is someone one who wants to get good at making pizzas ought to do, but having done it both ways I don't personally think the rolling pin crust is so far inferior that it's not worth doing it if every time you go to make a pizza you wind up messing up the crust and making it hard to enjoy and to learn everything else. I think a nice middle ground that really helped me develop the skill to shape the dough without the pin was to use the pin to start the dough, flattening it out from a ball into an 8 inch round or so, and then to take that round and form it the rest of the way by tossing it (or by whatever other method).

Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Hello! a few questions from an enthusiastic noob! :)
« Reply #8 on: May 06, 2022, 12:04:46 PM »
Working on developing that artistry is someone one who wants to get good at making pizzas ought to do, but having done it both ways I don't personally think the rolling pin crust is so far inferior that it's not worth doing it if every time you go to make a pizza you wind up messing up the crust and making it hard to enjoy and to learn everything else. I think a nice middle ground that really helped me develop the skill to shape the dough without the pin was to use the pin to start the dough, flattening it out from a ball into an 8 inch round or so, and then to take that round and form it the rest of the way by tossing it (or by whatever other method).
lazerlike42,

The late Tom Lehmann often suggested the rolling pin method you mentioned. See, for example, Reply 4 at:

https://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=69676.msg670841;topicseen#msg670841

Peter

Offline [email protected]

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Re: Hello! a few questions from an enthusiastic noob! :)
« Reply #9 on: May 06, 2022, 02:19:27 PM »
I'm not exactly a beginner as I've been making pizzas and trying to make a good NY style for 5 years or more, but I am a beginner in that I have just in the past week or so "cracked the code"

I've been working on trying to make a decent NY slice for a lot longer than 5 years, lol. It is an amazing feeling when you finally crack the code as you describe it and taste that flavor that you didn't realize you remembered so well and missed so much.

Compared to the wealth of experience and expertise resident in this forum, I suspect I'll always consider myself an a noob by comparison. Lot of them have forgotten more about pizza than I will probably ever know.

That said, cold ferment and using proper ingredients., flour and cheese particularly, probably the biggest game changers for me.

Have never rolled a pizza crust as they were no were to be seen in the pizzerias of my youth, but one of these days I'm going to give a Lucali style pie a try and will bust out the rolling pin for that one. Felt the same way about screens initially but seeing the amazing success HammettJr and Gumbawill have with their screens inspired me to give it a go.

I like a very thin crust and the screen lets me stretch a 15 oz dough into an 18 inch pie. When using a peel I generally go a bit heavier on dough weight and flour the peel and then sprinkle very generously with Semolina and give it a shake or two while dressing the pie. Do love the feeling of sliding one right onto the baking surface and guests are always impressed.
Dean

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Offline shayke

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Re: Hello! a few questions from an enthusiastic noob! :)
« Reply #10 on: May 09, 2022, 05:57:37 AM »
A few of my guests already told me that I've ruined the concept of "pizza" for them - for they don't want to eat outside anymore, lol.
I'm very satisfied but also thrive to learn more and improve. at the moment I'm focusing on the process and doing each and every stage properly. the hardest thing for me was actually using the pizza peel and place the pizza inside the oven. it becomes easier the more I practice.

I'm testing the 00 Caputu flower now, which we have available here in Israel. I wanted to ask if there is any difference between the red one and the blue one? I purchased them both - only used the red so far and it's pretty good :).


Offline amolapizza

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Re: Hello! a few questions from an enthusiastic noob! :)
« Reply #11 on: May 27, 2022, 08:04:35 PM »
Sorry for the late reply as I'm behind on forum reading! :D

They are very similar, but the red makes a stronger dough.  IMO they are both good for making pizza, maybe the red needs another 2% water.
Jack

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Offline GumbaWill

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Re: Hello! a few questions from an enthusiastic noob! :)
« Reply #12 on: May 27, 2022, 08:31:06 PM »

The author got a lot of help here and synthesized it in a very helpful blog. If you follow her directions, you will make a very credible NY Style pizza. And it even has a button to convert measurements to metric.

https://feelingfoodish.com/the-best-new-york-style-pizza-dough/comment-page-7/

Great sauce too:

https://feelingfoodish.com/pizza-sauce/

I like feeling foodish. I once use one of her recipes for one of my blog creations.

https://www.thefreshloaf.com/node/68622/ciambotta-stuffed-semoilna-remicinata-filone-meow-sexy
Will Falzon
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Re: Hello! a few questions from an enthusiastic noob! :)
« Reply #13 on: May 28, 2022, 02:20:45 AM »
I like feeling foodish. I once use one of her recipes for one of my blog creations.

https://www.thefreshloaf.com/node/68622/ciambotta-stuffed-semoilna-remicinata-filone-meow-sexy

FF brought me here. Was searching for a better dough recipe and the Lehman inspired one posted at FF was a quantum leap forward. Late bloomer as always 😉
Dean

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