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Author Topic: 24-Hour New York Style Pizza Recipe (Start to Finish)  (Read 1470 times)

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Offline politon

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24-Hour New York Style Pizza Recipe (Start to Finish)
« on: January 01, 2022, 09:03:27 PM »
Sometimes you just want a great pizza in 24-hours or less from start to finish without a complicated workflow and dough that is difficult to handle or requires hours of rest prior to being baked. The combination of bromated high-gluten flour and a dough conditioner makes this easy to accomplish. The resulting pizza crust is crunchy on the outside and soft on the inside. It's also slightly chewy, but not overly so. The slices are very thin and foldable, but not floppy or limp.
    Example Preparation Timetable
  • The evening before the bake, mix dough and refrigerate by 9:45 p.m.
  • The next day, remove dough from refrigerator and divide at 5:45 p.m.
  • At 6:00 p.m. begin preheating oven.
  • At 7:15 p.m. open dough ball and prepare pizza.
  • At 7:30 p.m. bake pizza.
I adapted the Mid-America Restaurant Expo (formerly NAPICS) dough formula which can be found here.

It's my understanding that a lot of NY pizzeria dough formulas use high-gluten flour which contains potassium bromate (a slow oxidizing agent that builds gluten and improves oven spring) and a separate dough conditioner such as PZ-44 which contains the reducing agent L-cysteine. Cysteine reduces elasticity (minimizes dough shrinkage and snapback), shortens mixing time, improves extensibility (making it easier to stretch and hand toss the dough), and significantly reduces dough relaxation time.

This recipe was tested with the following products:24-Hour New York Style Pizza
Yields (2) 13" Pizzas
Code: [Select]
High-Gluten Flour (100%): 430 g
Water (62.093%): 267 g
IDY (.163%): .7 g
Fine Sea Salt (1.744%): 7.5 g
Olive Oil (3%): 12.9 g
Baker's Sugar (1%): 4.3 g
Dough Conditioner (2%): 8.6 g
Total (170%): 731 g
Single Ball: 365.5 g

Whisk dry ingredients together in stand mixer bowl. Add room temperature water and mix with a silicone spatula until a shaggy dough forms. Add olive oil and attach bowl to the stand mixer. Using a dough hook, mix on lowest speed (stir) for 5 minutes. Transfer dough to an oiled container, cover with plastic film, and refrigerate for a minimum of 20 hours.
[Note: Final dough weighed 728 g and had a finished internal temperature of 75F. Ambient temperature was 70.7F.]

Remove dough from refrigerator, weigh, divide, and ball. Transfer balls to separate oiled containers and cover with plastic film. Allow dough to rest while oven preheats. If you're planning to only bake one pizza, return the remaining covered container to the refrigerator.
[Note: Dough ball weighed 364 g. Thickness factor = 0.096]

Place pizza stone on bottom rack and preheat convection oven at 550F for at least 1 hour and 15 minutes.

Open dough ball, stretch and hand toss, add toppings, peel, and bake directly on pizza stone for 6 minutes. Rotating halfway through.
[Note: Dough ball had an internal temperature of 70F. Pizza stone registered 576F with an infrared thermometer.]

The test pizza had 4 oz. of sauce, 8 oz. of Great Value whole milk low-moisture mozzarella, and 5 oz. of cooked hot Italian sausage.






Offline politon

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Re: 24-Hour New York Style Pizza Recipe (Start to Finish)
« Reply #1 on: January 04, 2022, 12:01:56 AM »
Same batch of dough, but with a 93-hour cold ferment. Still handled the same, no gluten degradation. In fact, gluten development actually improved.

I'm pleasantly surprised that the dough conditioner did not inhibit gluten development during an extended fermentation period.

Offline hammettjr

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Re: 24-Hour New York Style Pizza Recipe (Start to Finish)
« Reply #2 on: January 04, 2022, 10:16:36 AM »

It's my understanding that a lot of NY pizzeria dough formulas use...a separate dough conditioner...

Nice looking pies! Where did you get the info that alot of pizzeria dough uses conditioners? I'm not disagreeing, but I've read several times on the forum that people think  bromate and conditioners are unnecessary. But I struggle to accept the argument that pizzerias use bromate simply because it's always been that way.

One more question: is that a 12" rack the pizza is cooling on? I'm also in the minority with you, using TF >= 0.09. But I'm still surprised by how thin your slice is. Could just be a result of the size of the rim, particularly as a proportion of the overall pizza.
« Last Edit: January 04, 2022, 10:20:36 AM by hammettjr »
Matt

Offline politon

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Re: 24-Hour New York Style Pizza Recipe (Start to Finish)
« Reply #3 on: January 04, 2022, 05:30:38 PM »
Nice looking pies! Where did you get the info that alot of pizzeria dough uses conditioners? I'm not disagreeing, but I've read several times on the forum that people think  bromate and conditioners are unnecessary. But I struggle to accept the argument that pizzerias use bromate simply because it's always been that way.

One more question: is that a 12" rack the pizza is cooling on? I'm also in the minority with you, using TF >= 0.09. But I'm still surprised by how thin your slice is. Could just be a result of the size of the rim, particularly as a proportion of the overall pizza.

Thank you, hammettjr!

It's simply a conclusion that I've come to over the years based on a variety of observations and inputs. Let me try to explain. I apologize in advance for rambling.  :)

I've been making pizza and other baked goods from scratch using consumer level flours from the supermarket for over 10 years. And while I've enjoyed artisan baking and learning various techniques, it's a lot of work at times. With more advanced bakes (i.e. Pandoro), it's almost a herculean effort to achieve the desired outcome. That being said, a couple of things stood out to me and drove my curiosity.
  • Albeit that there are commercial artisan pizza makers like Brian Spangler of Apizza Scholls (just to name one of many), I wouldn't classify the sheer majority of independent pizzerias in the United States as such. There is no way that they are taking the time to employ artisan methods and techniques in their workflow; autolyse, extended cold fermentation, slap and folds, coil folds, stretch and folds, et. al. It's just not practical in a country where consumers largely view the product as fast food and thus associate it with a low price point. So there has to be another way to achieve similar results with less effort and skill.
  • Ever since I was a child, I've witnessed the college bro at our local pizzeria effortlessly toss dough that doesn't tear, keeps it shape, and seemingly defies physics. How did they achieve such gluten strength and extensibility without employing artisan methods?
This forum and the PMQ think tank, being the wealth of information that they are, were key inputs for me. Here is a small sampling of relevant posts:Peter Reinhart also acknowledged in his book, titled "American Pie: My Search for the Perfect Pizza" that "many NY pizzerias use bromated flour." An excerpt is printed with permission at https://www.bakepedia.com/peter-reinharts-neo-neopolitan-pizza-dough/

I believe it's fair to generalize that a lot of NY pizzerias use high-gluten flour which contains potassium bromate. Based upon my own experience working with All Trumps, it is because the potassium bromate encourages abundant gluten development and consistent oven spring. While the abundant gluten development shortens mixing times and allows the baker to avoid time consuming methods such as stretch and folds to achieve the same result, it does have a downside. At least in the case of All Trumps, the dough tends to be "bucky" and has a strong tendency to snap back. That is what leads me to conclude that they also use dough conditioners to solve for that.

Moderator Pete-zza posted a link to a great commercial brief that explains the dough chemistry and interaction between potassium bromate and reducing agents like L-cysteine in reply #116 at https://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=13820.msg145444#msg145444

With regards to the cooling rack, it's 11 1/2 inches by 16 5/8. The TF is misleading. Because I hand toss the pizza, the majority of the dough is in the cornicione. It's very thin.

--Paul

 


Offline Gags

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Re: 24-Hour New York Style Pizza Recipe (Start to Finish)
« Reply #4 on: January 05, 2022, 02:23:10 PM »
Great looking pizza!  I just ordered some dough conditioner - thanks for including a link.
I typically use Gemignani's NY dough and have been taking a little bit longer than expected to let the dough relax while forming.
I'll give this a go!
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Offline politon

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Re: 24-Hour New York Style Pizza Recipe (Start to Finish)
« Reply #5 on: January 05, 2022, 04:42:21 PM »
Great looking pizza!  I just ordered some dough conditioner - thanks for including a link.
I typically use Gemignani's NY dough and have been taking a little bit longer than expected to let the dough relax while forming.
I'll give this a go!

Thank you, Gags! Let me know how it works out for you. I'm really impressed with it so far.

Offline Pizza Shark

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Re: 24-Hour New York Style Pizza Recipe (Start to Finish)
« Reply #6 on: January 07, 2022, 08:35:39 PM »
That's impressive.

Offline jkb

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Re: 24-Hour New York Style Pizza Recipe (Start to Finish)
« Reply #7 on: January 08, 2022, 10:00:07 AM »
Looks amazing!   NY?   ???
John

Offline RHawthorne

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Re: 24-Hour New York Style Pizza Recipe (Start to Finish)
« Reply #8 on: January 10, 2022, 10:22:01 AM »
The baker's sugar caught my attention. That's something I've never heard of before. I looked it up online, and it would seem that it's more or less just confectioner's sugar, but some sources say it's a little different from that. If you don't mind, why do you use it? Have you noticed any real benefit from using it vs. using other types of sugar?
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Offline HansB

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Re: 24-Hour New York Style Pizza Recipe (Start to Finish)
« Reply #9 on: January 10, 2022, 10:49:46 AM »
The baker's sugar caught my attention. That's something I've never heard of before. I looked it up online, and it would seem that it's more or less just confectioner's sugar, but some sources say it's a little different from that. If you don't mind, why do you use it? Have you noticed any real benefit from using it vs. using other types of sugar?

It is nothing like confectioners sugar. It is very fine, called caster sugar in the UK. It just dissolves faster than granulated, it's all I've used for years. As you're in Michigan you can get it at Meijer.


« Last Edit: January 10, 2022, 10:51:43 AM by HansB »
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Offline RHawthorne

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Re: 24-Hour New York Style Pizza Recipe (Start to Finish)
« Reply #10 on: January 10, 2022, 11:09:26 AM »
It is nothing like confectioners sugar. It is very fine, called caster sugar in the UK. It just dissolves faster than granulated, it's all I've used for years. As you're in Michigan you can get it at Meijer.
That's interesting. I shop at Meijer all the time and have for many years, and I've never seen it on the shelves there. But what makes it better for baking? What has been your experience with it?
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Offline HansB

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Re: 24-Hour New York Style Pizza Recipe (Start to Finish)
« Reply #11 on: January 10, 2022, 12:05:00 PM »
That's interesting. I shop at Meijer all the time and have for many years, and I've never seen it on the shelves there. But what makes it better for baking? What has been your experience with it?

It dissolves faster/easier. It's the only sugar I use other than confectioners.
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Offline politon

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Re: 24-Hour New York Style Pizza Recipe (Start to Finish)
« Reply #12 on: January 10, 2022, 12:06:48 PM »
The baker's sugar caught my attention. That's something I've never heard of before. I looked it up online, and it would seem that it's more or less just confectioner's sugar, but some sources say it's a little different from that. If you don't mind, why do you use it? Have you noticed any real benefit from using it vs. using other types of sugar?

It's just regular granulated sugar that's ground finer, so that it dissolves easily. You can make it by putting granulated sugar in the spice grinder and giving it a couple of pulses. If you grind it too fine, it will turn
to confectioner's sugar.

I haven't necessarily noticed any tangible benefit whereas pizza is concerned.

Offline Gags

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Re: 24-Hour New York Style Pizza Recipe (Start to Finish)
« Reply #13 on: January 14, 2022, 03:23:59 PM »
Thank you, Gags! Let me know how it works out for you. I'm really impressed with it so far.

Hi Politon,

I just did a batch with the dough conditioner and it seemed to negatively affect water absorption? 

By that I mean, a similar batch I did a few weeks ago in similar weather was great to work with except for a bit of snap back when forming the skin.  To mitigate this, I would let the open skin lay on the bench for a bit, then open it up more.  The last touch was to dress the pie, then do the Neapolitan style two-point stretch around the pie to open it up further on the peel.  The weight of the toppings help keep it in place one stretched.  This batch contained no conditioner.

This time, though, with the conditioner, the dough seemed very wet.  I had to dust it quite a bit when pulling it out of the proofing box, then a bunch of bench flour while shaping.  When shaping, it would stick to my hands and to itself if it accidentally overlapped in a section.  It seemed weaker and I had tearing in the first couple pies.  The dough was so wet that I could overlap it to patch the holes and it would readily stick.  With these issues, I couldn't open the 530g dough to a full 16", more like 15" or a bit below.

Any issues with absorption?

The texture and flavor were great, but as you can see, they were fairly poofy and not as thin as I'd like. 
Part of that is me really limiting the pre-bake cornicione size.

My formula is pretty much Gemignani's NY dough:
F:   100%
W:  65%
IDY:  1%
Kosher Salt:  2%
Malt Powder: 2%
Dough Conditioner: 2%
Olive Oil: 1%

Method: 
20-min autolyse, quick hand kneading (5 mins), then ball, then in the fridge for 3-day cold ferment with reforming each day. 
2-3 hours before bake, reball and transfer to floured proofing box

Thanks!
Ryan
« Last Edit: January 14, 2022, 03:26:01 PM by Gags »
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Offline politon

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Re: 24-Hour New York Style Pizza Recipe (Start to Finish)
« Reply #14 on: January 14, 2022, 04:47:25 PM »
Hi Politon,

I just did a batch with the dough conditioner and it seemed to negatively affect water absorption? 

By that I mean, a similar batch I did a few weeks ago in similar weather was great to work with except for a bit of snap back when forming the skin.  To mitigate this, I would let the open skin lay on the bench for a bit, then open it up more.  The last touch was to dress the pie, then do the Neapolitan style two-point stretch around the pie to open it up further on the peel.  The weight of the toppings help keep it in place one stretched.  This batch contained no conditioner.

This time, though, with the conditioner, the dough seemed very wet.  I had to dust it quite a bit when pulling it out of the proofing box, then a bunch of bench flour while shaping.  When shaping, it would stick to my hands and to itself if it accidentally overlapped in a section.  It seemed weaker and I had tearing in the first couple pies.  The dough was so wet that I could overlap it to patch the holes and it would readily stick.  With these issues, I couldn't open the 530g dough to a full 16", more like 15" or a bit below.

Any issues with absorption?

The texture and flavor were great, but as you can see, they were fairly poofy and not as thin as I'd like. 
Part of that is me really limiting the pre-bake cornicione size.

My formula is pretty much Gemignani's NY dough:
F:   100%
W:  65%
IDY:  1%
Kosher Salt:  2%
Malt Powder: 2%
Dough Conditioner: 2%
Olive Oil: 1%

Method: 
20-min autolyse, quick hand kneading (5 mins), then ball, then in the fridge for 3-day cold ferment with reforming each day. 
2-3 hours before bake, reball and transfer to floured proofing box

Thanks!
Ryan

Hi Ryan,

I didn't experience that problem with my formula.

In this instance because the dough conditioner already contains an unspecified enzyme and LDMP contains diastase enzymes, the combination of the two was probably too much. Diastase enzymes breakdown the long starch molecules into sugars. Likewise, most dough conditioners contain alpha-amylase, which is also an enzyme that breaks down starch into sugar. This break-down process is called hydrolysis. When starches are hydrolyzed, the water that they were holding is released into the dough. This high enzyme activity combined with a long fermentation (more time to break down starch) probably caused the sticky dough.

My suggestion would be use one or the other, but not both.

Regards,

--Paul

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Offline quietdesperation

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Re: 24-Hour New York Style Pizza Recipe (Start to Finish)
« Reply #15 on: January 25, 2022, 12:27:04 PM »
pizza looks great, if your goal is 24 hour or less pizza, you might try craig's recipe, which, in my experience, creates excellent pizza in 5-6 hours and, to my family and friend's palate, is indistinguishable from a 2 day cf:

https://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=39200.msg411931#msg411931
« Last Edit: January 25, 2022, 12:29:50 PM by quietdesperation »
jeff

Offline Gags

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Re: 24-Hour New York Style Pizza Recipe (Start to Finish)
« Reply #16 on: January 27, 2022, 11:20:58 AM »
Hi Ryan,

I didn't experience that problem with my formula.

In this instance because the dough conditioner already contains an unspecified enzyme and LDMP contains diastase enzymes, the combination of the two was probably too much. Diastase enzymes breakdown the long starch molecules into sugars. Likewise, most dough conditioners contain alpha-amylase, which is also an enzyme that breaks down starch into sugar. This break-down process is called hydrolysis. When starches are hydrolyzed, the water that they were holding is released into the dough. This high enzyme activity combined with a long fermentation (more time to break down starch) probably caused the sticky dough.

My suggestion would be use one or the other, but not both.

Regards,

--Paul

Thanks much for the detailed explanation!  I wondered if something like that could be the case.  I had another batch ready for the next day and I was able to work with it better, having learned from the prior day.  I'll give it another go without the LDMP.  Thanks again!
"I'd trade it all for just a little bit more"

Offline politon

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Re: 24-Hour New York Style Pizza Recipe (Start to Finish)
« Reply #17 on: January 27, 2022, 01:20:02 PM »
Thanks much for the detailed explanation!  I wondered if something like that could be the case.  I had another batch ready for the next day and I was able to work with it better, having learned from the prior day.  I'll give it another go without the LDMP.  Thanks again!

You're welcome!

Offline RHawthorne

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Re: 24-Hour New York Style Pizza Recipe (Start to Finish)
« Reply #18 on: January 27, 2022, 01:52:46 PM »
 Very nice looking pies. I will not use bleached flour, but I don't have as much of a problem with bromated flour. I tried a Gold Medal unbleached bromated flour a few months back, and I wasn't wild about the results. I tried it a few times, and the dough always had a weird feeling like soft silly putty. It was definitely extensible, but it didn't aerate well in the outer rim at all, and the overall result was just not impressive to me. Looks like bromated flour can definitely work well for some people. But whatever. I'm happy with the results I've been getting with other types of flour.
 I also had a problem using a dough conditioner a while back, but of a different kind; the dough was always too elastic and didn't aerate well in the outer rim when baked. I stopped using the stuff and never looked back. There might be good dough conditioners out there, but I'm not feeling like I need one.
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