Detroit Style - My way

[HansB]

Hans,

Very nice looking Detroit's! 

Great experiment using cheese on the par bake!!

Norma

Thanks Norma!!

[rkrider99]

I'm not sure if I should start my own thread or tag on to here. HansB, you inspired me. On my normal Tuesday night pizza binge, I decided I needed to try a Detroit Style.

Now, I didn't have the right pan, or the right cheese, but since it was my normal Tuesday night pizza ritual, I thought I might add it on. I found a 9" cake pan, which I've had forever. Very heavy, coated, Oneida brand, if anyone in interested. Had mozzarella available.

I used your recipe in post #1, using KAAP @ 65% hydration, 1% IDY, 2% salt, 2% sugar.

Since I can't make comments during the pictures.

Pic 1: after 3 hours of RT fermentation
Pic 2: after 5 hours of fermentation - already overfermented
Pic 3: Topped
Pic 4: Out of the oven
Pic 5 : Side view
Pic 6 : Cut view

It was really highly risen and pillowy when I topped it, but it collapsed as I was topping it. I know it was overfermented. Next try will be better. But it was excellent as it was.

How does everyone reheat leftover DS pizza. Yeah, I know, what do you mean  leftover, but we also made 2 16" pizzas that evening, just in case.

[jmoschgat]

Anyone have issues with undercooked bottoms?  I'm trying to make this in my Baker's Pride P44 and the top cooks way before the bottom, or the bottom doesn't cook enough.  It is super pale and gummy.  Par baking works (requires about 8-10 min par bake and then 8-10 min top bake and comes out pretty good, but trying to figure out how to cook this all at one time.  Cooking at 525.  Wondering if it makes sense to put a screen under to help air get under the bottom?

yes, i am and was having this issue. I have found if i cook the pizza uncovered until the cheese is where i want it, i pull out the pan and cover with foal and cook another 5-10 minutes the bottom is where i want it to be. as you said this does increase cook time a bit, but it is the only method i have found so far. i am cooking on the middle rack on 500. I used a similar recipe to OP, but with brick cheese heavy around the outside and scattered throughout, then a mixture of provolone and mozzarella on top.

[Santo]

Hans, I love this pizza.  Thank you!! 

I modified the post 105 recipe (https://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=42012.msg461690#msg461690) a little by dropping the sugar and going with .7 percent Diastatic malt because mine is a Lintner 60 (and Hans uses a Lintner 20).     I think the number was right on as the amount of browning was perfect for me, but I might try pushing it to 1 percent next time. With my malt I'm pretty sure 2 percent would have been too much.  Unfortunately, I am the worst with pictures, and I forgot to snap one before I cut into them, and I forgot to get a crumb shot or side shot, but everyone really loves this pizza.

Pizza 1 is a family favorite.... fresh off the cob corn, Mexican chorizo, cotija, mozzarella, cheddar, and heirloom tomato/cilantro from my garden post bake.

Pizza 2 is a Detroit style spicy spring...   mozzarella, sweet and spicy fra diavolo sauce, and lots of hand sliced pepperoni. 

Pizza 3 is a classic cheese pizza but with some cheddar mixed in with the mozzarella, basil from the garden, pecorino Romano, parmigiano reggiano, and garlic.

Great look on these pies!

[Santo]

Hey I made your pie Hans and i really appreciate your guidance and recipe. Heres the pics from my work flow. It was a success! I will say that on my reheating, I turned the oven up to 550 F and put the slices in the lloyds for 2 mins and then a minute on the stone, and the bottom of the pie got a shade or 2 darker and way more crispy than the original bake. It was way better after the reheat! I think for my oven i'll need to either incorporate the stone, or put my Lloyds pan closer to the bottom, to achieve that great bottom. I didn't have crisco so i just worked with olive oil as well which may not have helped my bottom get as dramatic as some of the ones i saw on this great thread.

Thanks again! Your work flow was the real deal! Oh btw i dressed this more in the style of a NYC sicilian because that's what i'm most familiar with. I put 8 oz cheese slices on dough, sauce on top of that, and then 8 more oz cheese on top. I'm using a 14x14 lloyds sicilian pan and i scaled up the recipe. Very nice Hans thanks! 

[HansB]

You're very welcome. You made a very nice pizza!

[FoodSim]

How does everyone reheat leftover DS pizza.

I reheat two (42°F) slices at a time in a toaster oven at 450°F for 8.5 minutes from a cold start (no preheating).

[HansB]

How does everyone reheat leftover DS pizza.

I have tried many methods and found this to be almost as good as fresh baked:

"So we polled several experts, and the recommendation was near-unanimous: Use a skillet.

How To Reheat Pizza

Put your slice in a non-stick skillet on medium-low for a couple minutes. Once the bottom is crisp, add a couple drops of water to the pan, turn the heat to low, and cover with a lid. In about a minute, you'll have fluffy crust and melted cheese."

[wilson502]

Another Detroit pizza I cooked up last night. This is based off of post 115, in a 8x10. Was cooked in my Ooni for about 12 minutes or so. I switched to butter flavored crisco per Hans suggestion, and swapped havarti cheese for Mild cheddar from my last cook. This turned out so good. I used Alta Cucina tomatoes that were pulsed lightly with a stick blender.

[Santo]

Hello,

I made this pizza for the 2nd time. I had a problem both times with the resulting pie not crisping as much as i wish it was. I see some stunning looking bottoms here but mine is still a bit pale and after cooling down, it is getting soggy. I have been doing reheats on the stone. I am not sure but i suspect that I overproofed the dough. This is my process, taken from the very famous post# 115 of yours.


682 gram dough ball (14x14 lloyds sicilian pan)
392g bread flour
274g water
4g yeast
8g salt
4g LDMP (my LDMP is 60 degrees lintner so I am using only 1%)

I mixed it in my kitchenaid standing mixer for 2 minutes on "Stir" and then 7 minutes on speed 6. The water I started with was 100 degrees F. Perhaps this was too warm of a starting point?

I balled the dough and put it into my lightly oiled pan. I covered with plastic wrap and let it rise for 2 hours. After 2 hours I was able to press and stretch it most of the way. I gave it another 30 minutes and i was then able to press it into the corners. I then let it rise until it hit the 7 hour mark (this was a 4.5 hour rise after getting it to the edges of the pan but all together from mixing the dough till dressing the pie was 7 hours total). I could be wrong but i think I noticed at the 6 hour mark it looked more pillowy and at the 7 hour mark i THINK it looked a bit flatter. So i figured i better hurry up and get this in the oven.

By this point i had my stone preheated on the 2nd to bottom oven rack for 1 hour, at 525. I used this rack and i used the stone because last time i made this pizza it was also just not crispy enough initially out of the oven and needed some reheats on the stone to get it crispier.

I dressed the pie with thickly grated WMLM galbani on top of the dough, followed by spoonfuls of milled sclafani tomatoes, about 1.5 cups of sauce for the 14x14 pan. Then i went back in with even more thickly grated wmlm galbani. Then a dusting of pecorino romano and some olive oil.

Into the oven onto the stone for 15 minutes and here is my outcome. Just still too blonde for my liking. And this time the crust was just not as satisfying as the first time i made it.



The pictures show the side of the pie, bottom before reheat, then the reheating, then what it looked like after the reheat (too crunchy this time but not in a lively way. kind of a flat way.) and then the full pie.

Any idea what went wrong? Does my outcome sound like it did suffer from the over fermenting? I wish i had pictures of the dough to show. Thank you so much for the help.

Here are the pictures i did capture.

[HansB]

Well, the pizza looks very good. I don't see anything that is unusual. I can only compare it to what I do. I mix for about a minute in a food processor, I use a very small amount of Crisco in the pan and I bake directly on the center rack of the oven at 525° for about 13 minutes. I also use a different pan, so the metal thickness may be different, but yours looks similar. Hope others may be of more help.

[wilson502]

Well, the pizza looks very good. I don't see anything that is unusual. I can only compare it to what I do. I mix for about a minute in a food processor, I use a very small amount of Crisco in the pan and I bake directly on the center rack of the oven at 525° for about 13 minutes. I also use a different pan, so the metal thickness may be different, but yours looks similar. Hope others may be of more help.

Looks like I used way more crisco than you do for your cooks. Next time I make this ill do a light coating instead and will post how it turns out. My Ooni Koda 16 and 3/8" steel plate direct replacement have been worth every penny. I still cook in my home oven with steel plates once in a while, but its just so much more convenient and effective to use my Ooni.

@Santo, using a Steel plate may give u more of a browned bottom you are looking for vs a stone. Steel is much more thermally conductive than a stone, so that may give you the results u desire.

[stickyD]

Another Detroit pizza I cooked up last night. This is based off of post 115, in a 8x10. Was cooked in my Ooni for about 12 minutes or so. I switched to butter flavored crisco per Hans suggestion, and swapped havarti cheese for Mild cheddar from my last cook. This turned out so good. I used Alta Cucina tomatoes that were pulsed lightly with a stick blender.

That crust looks amazing.

[Santo]

Hey so I made this pie again and I had much better success this time around. The last time i baked this pie i wasn't getting crispy enough at 525 in the middle rack. My oven just doesn't want to do it that way haha.

So this time I did things differently. I let it for proof a bit shorter (last time i was overproofed and collapsing), and cooked at 550 degrees on the bottom rack in Lloyd’s Sicilian pan for 8-10 minutes. The pan had a medium coat of olive oil maybe 4-5 tbsp. The bottom of this pizza was really fantastic and it stayed crispy on the top and bottom even after it was left out on the cooling racks for quite some time. However parts of the pie burned on the bottom and I had a little issue with sticking near the corners. I think the sticking is because I have some issues getting the dough to stretch to the corners and maybe a thin part of the dough let some cheese seep through to the bottom of the pan in this area on 2 corners of the pie.

I don't have crisco and I want to try to work with e.v.o.o. and/or butter.

Question: If I butter the pan first and then lay down a layer of e.v.o.o. would this help prevent sticking even more? Would the butter, with its milk solids, do something different or unexpected to the bottom crust? I am not sure how butter behave in a 550 degree oven on bottom rack...

In order to maximize the oven spring and crispiness, but prevent burning, I’m considering a few options.

1. lowering the oven temperature to 525 but still staying on bottom rack
2. only cooking on the bottom rack for half of the bake and then moving to middle rack for 2nd half.

Please let me know what you think.  I'm going to dial this in and report back because I was really satisfied with this great pizza thank you Hans!

[Pizza-Face]

Different formula today. Poolish with par bake. Although the dough weight was the same as I always use, par baking made for more rise and lighter crust. Using a small amount of cheese on the par bake really minimized the shrinkage of the dough. Not sure if I prefer par baked or not. The advantage is that I vacuumed packed and froze two that I can use quickly on a whim.

HansB, thanks for showing us how to use cheese to prevent pulling from the sides. Do you have a PIC of how you stacked the cheese in there before you par baked it? You got a perfect little line with no mess at all!

-Thanx in advance.

[HansB]

Here you go.

[Pizza-Face]

Here you go.

Thanx. Last time I tried small cubes.... it still pulled away. I see now I will have to get a regular sized hole shredder, all I have now is the large hole "potato shredder". I think some of the key is sticking some vertically down in between to get a lock on it when melting occurs, ergo the shreds have to be the right size.

[HansB]

I just sprinkle it around the edge, I have done it with larger and smaller shreds.

[wilson502]

Cooked up this tasty beast tonight, took HansB advice and used a very light coating of the Crisco butter flavored on the pan. I think this gave me the result I desired. I switched up the cheese blend with WMLM, Muenster, and a sliced Wisconsin Jack that is sold at the local US Food Chefstore (formerly Cash and Carry). Really enjoyed how this came out.

[HansB]

Cooked up this tasty beast tonight, took HansB advice and used a very light coating of the Crisco butter flavored on the pan. I think this gave me the result I desired. I switched up the cheese blend with WMLM, Muenster, and a sliced Wisconsin Jack that is sold at the local US Food Chefstore (formerly Cash and Carry). Really enjoyed how this came out.

Well done.