Tonight's Lou. Butter flavored crisco in the pan is night and day vs oil

[Garvey]

I tried out this recipe a couple nights ago, in general it was a good success but there are two things that I think I need to adjust:

My first issue was with the crust. Flavor and everything was excellent, but I couldn't help but feel that the crust was a bit chewy. It didn't have that signature light crunchy by not crispy feel that I remember. I don't know what could have cause this, the first one I actually over baked on accident and it was definitely crispy but still a little chewy. I baked it by putting the dish/pizza in the oven on a preheated stone at 435, jacked up the temp to 475 for 15 min, then turned it back down and baked it for another 15 minutes at 435.

This was the dough breakdown I used (from earlier in this thread), and I let it rise for about 6 hours. Anyone aware of what might have caused the crust to be a bit chewy? Would Semolina help? I am still trying to find a post or reply anywhere from Nate where he might've mentioned why he stopped using it..

Flour (100%):               266.67 g  |  9.41 oz | 0.59 lbs
Water (57.1429%):     152.38 g  |  5.38 oz | 0.34 lbs
ADY (1.07999%):         2.88 g | 0.1 oz | 0.01 lbs | 0.76 tsp | 0.25 tbsp
Salt (0.79734%):          2.13 g | 0.08 oz | 0 lbs | 0.38 tsp | 0.13 tbsp
Corn Oil (14.2857%):  38.1 g | 1.34 oz | 0.08 lbs | 8.47 tsp | 2.82 tbsp
Vegetable (Soybean) Oil (5.7143%):  15.24 g | 0.54 oz | 0.03 lbs | 3.36 tsp | 1.12 tbsp
Sugar (1.13906%):     3.04 g | 0.11 oz | 0.01 lbs | 0.76 tsp | 0.25 tbsp
Total (180.15929%):    480.43 g | 16.95 oz | 1.06 lbs | TF = 0.112379   

The other thing I'm looking to solve is that when I made some half pepperoni half sausage pies, the pepperoni side got a bit soupy on top (and sort've throughout) while the sausage side did not.

Thanks in advance

What recipe did you use?  The first post from this thread is 46% water and 23% oil, and yours is 57% water and 20% oil.

[Chi15]

What recipe did you use?  The first post from this thread is 46% water and 23% oil, and yours is 57% water and 20% oil.

I went down through Nate's posts a bit to see if he had ever updated his recipe since the first post was several years ago. In 2018 he started a thread "14 inch Malnatis" where he posted this, which is the recipe I followed since I figured it would be more up to date / refined:
https://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=53648.msg538658#msg538658

"Haven’t posted in awhile.  Been busy with “life”.  Have made a few changes to my recipe.

14 inch Malnatis Recipe

100% 350g AP flour
20% 70g (20g vegetable, 50g corn)
57% 200g warm water
1 tsp ADY
1 tsp sugar
1/2 tsp salt

Very soft 1 min knead, 6hr rise, pressed down a few times

Preheat stone to 435F
Turn heat to 475 and put pizza in.  Cook for 15 mins then turn back down to 435 and put foil on top to prevent crust burning.  Cook for 30 mins total and let rest for 10 mins before cutting."

[Garvey]

I went down through Nate's posts a bit to see if he had ever updated his recipe since the first post was several years ago. In 2018 he started a thread "14 inch Malnatis" where he posted this, which is the recipe I followed since I figured it would be more up to date / refined:
https://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=53648.msg538658#msg538658

Ah, ok.  You made a recipe from a one thread, Pizza A, and then came over to a completely different thread, Pizza B, to ask questions about Pizza A.  Mystery solved.  Thanks. 

[wayner]

Why butter flavored Crisco rather than butter?  Is it because the milk solids in the butter will burn?  And if so, why not use clarified butter?

[Garvey]

Why butter flavored Crisco rather than butter?  Is it because the milk solids in the butter will burn?  And if so, why not use clarified butter?

I’ve used ghee in dough to great success, but the usage in this thread is for the pan, not the dough.  I’m guessing that the “plastic” quality of the shortening is useful somehow in sticking to the pan in a way that clarified butter would not?

[wayner]

I’ve used ghee in dough to great success, but the usage in this thread is for the pan, not the dough.  I’m guessing that the “plastic” quality of the shortening is useful somehow in sticking to the pan in a way that clarified butter would not?

Thanks - I meant for greasing the pan.  I use a cast iron frying pan for my pan. 

But I have also wondered about the dough - I posted a question about that which no one responded to around why use corn oil rather than "better" types of oils.  Is it for authenticity with Lou's or does it make a better dough than other types of oil/fat?

[Garvey]

Yeah, corn oil is a flavor thing for Chicago pies.

[wayner]

Yeah, corn oil is a flavor thing for Chicago pies.

But is it better than using all olive oil or other oils?  Or just more authentic, in terms of dough color (yellower I would think) and flavor?

[Garvey]

Authentic flavor, for sure.

[wayner]

Authentic flavor, for sure.

But does authentic equal better?  Does it make sense to try with 100% olive oil, or use melted butter in place of corn oil?

[Garvey]

But does authentic equal better?  Does it make sense to try with 100% olive oil, or use melted butter in place of corn oil?

Let your freak flag fly, my man!  You do you!   

[wayner]

Just worried that I will not be allowed within the Chicago city limits again!  I will be banned as a heretic and blasphemer!

[vcb]

Nah, you're good.
The restaurants don't all use corn oil. Some use Vegetable oil, Soybean Oil, some use a combo of any of those along with regular (NOT extra virgin) olive oil.

[wayner]

Just so you know, I cheer for Peter Malnati on the PGA Tour since whenever I hear his name I think of Chicago style pizza!

[Booty156]

Hi, looking to try this style of pizza for the first time. Not sure if anywhere sells them around here in the UK. Just have a few questions if that's okay.

Is my maths correct for a 12-inch pizza, straight sides 2 inches. With the pizza going up 1.25 inches. See attachment.

<https://www.amazon.co.uk/gp/product/B0029K3BMS?psc=1> Is this the correct crisco product? And this only goes around the pan, not in the dough?

How do I make the sauce? I saw comments saying there's a video, but I couldn't find that. I think it's just straining a tin of tomatoes - hand crushing and adding salt/basil to taste?

Is there also a rough amount of cheese, topping and sauce I should be using for a 12inch pie?

Cheers, Kai

[wayner]

That's the right Crisco but you can also use Ghee or Clarified butter.

For the tomato sauce, you may need two 14 oz cans for a 12".  I use about one can for 9" pies.  Make sure you drain the tomatoes well and then you can just hand crush or use a blender or food processor.

On the cheese, I use a ball of mozza that is about 4" in diameter and cut it into slices to cover the bottom of the crust.  One ball of mozzarella should be enough.  I then grate a bit more to put on top.

[briansemerick]

I love Lou's when I'm in the mood - but as a Chicago native I gotta say I've never had anything from Lou's I would consider "deep dish".  Their pizzas are pan at best.  The crust is not that thick, and the only "deep" part is the edge which should be solid as a rock and almost break your teeth when taking a bite.  lol.    I know their site calls them "deep dish" but that is reserved for stuff like Gino's East in my opinion, or Pequod's.  Gotta be at least an inch thick in the center to be called deep, for my money.

when getting one local, make sure to get buttercrust, and uncut.

the first pic in this thread is WAY deeper than Lou's actually is in person.

[bobluvspizza]

I tried this the other night. 8" pan. Recipe and pics below. My biggest mistakes were:

1. I forgot to season the tomato sauce with salt, and I could have used more herbs. I used a generic "Italian seasoning" from the spice rack. It was bland. I used a 28 oz Cento tomato chunk can strained of most excess liquid.
2. Cheap store-brand mozzarella that was also expired. Pre-sliced and most of an 8oz package. It didn't melt very well and was bland. I owe it to myself and the world to up the cheese game!

I think I nailed the dough thanks to following Pythonic's instructions. It was a same-day affair using King Arthur All-purpose. You can't see it but there is a generous amount of pepperoni under the sauce. I could have added a bit more.

It cooked on a stone at 450 for 20 minutes then I foiled the top for another 10. Removed the foil and went another couple of minutes.

[Garvey]

Wow, that’s a lotta tomatah!

Did you use the whole 28oz can on an 8” pizza?

[Chicago Bob]

Wow, that’s a lotta tomatah!

Did you use the whole 28oz can on an 8” pizza?

     He nailed the dough though....thatsa nice looking crust there!