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Offline foreplease

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Re: Jets pizza
« Reply #320 on: November 15, 2021, 06:36:42 PM »
I've been following this thread for more than ten years now!
Jeepers! (can you tell Iím from Michigan lol). You can tell me next year in your annual reply.  :-D  Just giving you a hard time. 10 years is remarkable. Hope you have made some good ones in that time.
-Tony

Offline ellementz

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Re: Jets pizza
« Reply #321 on: January 02, 2022, 02:25:35 PM »
I grabbed pies from Jet's and another Detroit style pizzeria today.   Jets had much better crust and the other place had especially great toppings, but the crust was too thick and dense.   Im down with Jets! I didnt detect any whirl, and I was looking for it, but it definitely had a light and especially crunchy crust.

Peter, I highly doubt they are mixing by hand.  I think thats just marketing worded to sound like they might be, when really they are just saying the dough is put into pans by hand.  There was an 80qt Hobart front and center.

Worth a try if you have a chance to try Jet's.

We use Whirl, not for the pan though that's corn oil. We use Whirl for the flavored crust, the cheese bread and cinnamon sticks.

Offline ellementz

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Re: Jets pizza
« Reply #322 on: January 02, 2022, 11:12:33 PM »
Iíve found that a combination of ghee and corn oil gives me a similar crispness to Jetís.  Still need to figure out how to replicate their Turbocrust flavor though.

Super simple. It's Whirl Butter (if you can call it butter lol) granulated garlic and romano cheese (grande brand)

Offline PaulGilpin

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Re: Jets pizza
« Reply #323 on: January 25, 2022, 11:32:10 PM »
We use Whirl, not for the pan though that's corn oil. We use Whirl for the flavored crust, the cheese bread and cinnamon sticks.

Thank you very much for your helpful information, ellementz. Who manufacturers the Detroit style pans for Jet's? Can they be purchased by the general public?

Offline RustyCheese

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Re: Jets pizza
« Reply #324 on: February 25, 2022, 01:59:54 PM »
@Ellementz
I have some questions for you about this regarding Jets Pizza :)

1. For the whirl mixture, it goes on the crust before or after the bake? Do you use like a ketchup squirt bottle with it and just put it on the edges?

2. Its just plain corn oil in the bottom of the pans? Nothing else added?

3. How much sauce is used for each large? Does oil go on the dough before the sauce or just sauce?

4. For Jets cheese bread is it the same method as the deep dish with corn oil on bottom? And do you put whirl on top of the whole thing under the cheese? or on top after baking?
« Last Edit: February 25, 2022, 04:25:07 PM by RustyCheese »

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Offline Pizza Journey

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Re: Jets pizza
« Reply #325 on: October 13, 2023, 09:36:20 PM »
Seems like corn oil alone misses the mark on the crunch. I tried it with peanut oil and the crunch was awesome, but the taste was slightly off. Maybe a mixture or some other type would get the best of both worlds?

Offline c0rpse

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Re: Jets pizza
« Reply #326 on: October 26, 2023, 03:46:25 PM »
Seems like corn oil alone misses the mark on the crunch. I tried it with peanut oil and the crunch was awesome, but the taste was slightly off. Maybe a mixture or some other type would get the best of both worlds?

That's interesting that you say that. I thought corn oil worked great! I also tried corn oil mixed with a little ghee and that may even be closer. Hard to say, but I definitely do think corn oil is the way to go.

Offline Michael Scott

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Re: Jets pizza
« Reply #327 on: October 29, 2023, 12:11:21 PM »
That's interesting that you say that. I thought corn oil worked great! I also tried corn oil mixed with a little ghee and that may even be closer. Hard to say, but I definitely do think corn oil is the way to go.

They just use plain corn oil and nothing else added. Also keep in mind they have efficient Middleby Marshall conveyor ovens with heat technology that differs from our home ovens. These ovens (at least some of the older models, I'm not sure about the new ones as they've evolved even more) I believe have multiple sleeves top and bottom throughout the cook chamber that can be opened, closed, or left open half way... They control the airflow blowing heat from top and bottom of the pizza as it passes through.
They're able to cook fully loaded pizzas in 10 min or less with perfect browning. Pizza is crunchy but still tender and not overcooked.

Another thing is the type of pan you're using and gauge metal thickness and matching it with your cook temp/time. I've never used lloyd pans or DSP company pans, but I have some no good blue steel pans from a bad batch that seemed to burn my pies on the bottom, leaving a burnt oil smell and taste.
« Last Edit: October 29, 2023, 02:12:21 PM by Michael Scott »
Jim

Offline Pizza Journey

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Re: Jets pizza
« Reply #328 on: December 30, 2023, 11:18:20 AM »
I believe I have perfected this recipe for home use. It tastes almost exactly like Jets, with the same crunch, but slightly better. The dough can also be used for excellent breadsticks.

340g King Arthur bread flour
270g water
1/2 tsp yeast
1 tsp sugar
1 tsp salt

Cast iron 9x13 pan
Stone (preheat at 500 on middle rack)

Mix all dough ingredients together in a stand mixer until the dough ball comes together. This could be 5-10 minutes of mixing and it will be very sticky due to the high hydration. I use a paddle attachment rather than a dough hook.

In a small bowl, stir together 1 tbsp of corn oil and 1 tbsp of peanut oil (your choice on which oils you use, but 2 tbsp seems to be a good amount). Pour into the cast iron pan and swirl around to coat the pan.

Scrape the dough into the oiled pan, and with wet hands press it out flat. Does not have to be perfect or reach the sides, a vague rectangular shape is fine. It will rise to fill the pan.

Cover and let rise for at least a few hours, up to 8 hours. For the final hour of rising, remove the cover so the top dries out a bit. This dryness will help with spreading the sauce and toppings, and oven spring.

Cover the pan with aluminum foil and bake on the preheated stone at 500 for 23 minutes.

Uncover and continue baking until the top is done to your desire.

This achieves a perfectly crunchy bottom and emulates the Jet's style perfectly. The dough is airy, springy, crunchy, and delicious.

Online Pete-zza

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Re: Jets pizza
« Reply #329 on: December 30, 2023, 01:12:58 PM »
Pizza Journey,

Very nice job. And, interestingly, but for the hydration value (270/340 = 78.4%), your dough formulation dovetails very nicely with what I concluded when I was trying to reverse engineer and clone the Jet's dough many years ago. This included using very small amounts of salt and sugar, bread flour, and using oil for the pan, not the dough itself. I'd be curious to know how you came up with your dough recipe, and especially the hydration value, and also the type of yeast you used (I assume IDY based on another post of yours).

In my case, it took me until Reply 191 (page 10 of this thread), at https://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=8247.msg413711#msg413711, to post a Jet's clone dough formulation.

Peter

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Offline Pizza Journey

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Re: Jets pizza
« Reply #330 on: December 30, 2023, 01:52:11 PM »
Hi Peter, I got the basics of the recipe from ellementz a few pages ago. That got me most of the way there. The rest has come from experimentation - but it's so delicious that I don't mind trying things a few times  ;D

I believe the high hydration is what nails the Jet's style. The oven spring is really good because of it. I've tried all types of yeast, and also sourdough. My favorite is using my own sourdough starter, but regular IDY is fine if you give it a long enough ferment time (3 hours minimum).

Online Pete-zza

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Re: Jets pizza
« Reply #331 on: December 30, 2023, 03:00:38 PM »
Pizza Journey,

Thanks for the clarification. I imagine that it took some effort on your part to convert volume measurements to weights. Volume measurements can vary widely depending on how one measures out flour and water. The forum even has a tool for doing weight to volume conversions or volume to weight conversions but even then one must say how the ingredients are measured out. That can be quite tricky. The abovementioned tool can be seen at:

https://foodsim.toastguard.com/

I once discussed the above issue at Reply 4 at:

https://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=65141.msg638446;topicseen#msg638446

On another matter, I noticed that you used a cast iron pan whereas member elementz said to use a Detroit style of pizza pan. Could that account for your being able to use such a high hydration, one that I believe is a bit higher than what elementz uses? Many of the members who have tried the Jet's dough have used a hydration of around 65%. I don't recall offhand at how we arrived at that value. But one of the few places that I saw Jet's dough being made was toward the end of a YouTube video .


The dough in the video looks to be quite soft. Could it be that a hydration value of 65% using a standard bread flour and the right type of pan and bake method will also produce good results?

Peter

Offline Pizza Journey

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Re: Jets pizza
« Reply #332 on: January 01, 2024, 11:20:12 AM »
I can only talk about what worked for me, but I have a few thoughts on the hydration:

- High hydration helps with the dough rising to fill the pan properly
- High hydration gives the finished crust a lighter, more airy quality which I think is desirable given the oiled pan/fried bottom
- Cast iron + high hydration does require a longer cooking time in order to get the bottom properly crunchy. I have to cover the pan in order to avoid burning the top.

I'm sure they do it differently in the real restaurants, but I was aiming for a finished product that was as close to Jet's as possible with my home equipment.

It may not be true to the Jets process, but with my equipment it is very close to the Jets product.

Online Pete-zza

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Re: Jets pizza
« Reply #333 on: January 01, 2024, 12:23:20 PM »
Pizza Journey,

Out of curiosity, I decided to see if I could use the conversion calculator at https://foodsim.toastguard.com/ to see if I could convert ellementz's recipe to baker's percent format. To do that, I had to make assumptions on how flour and water were measured out. The hydration percent I came up with was 77%, or about a couple percent below the hydration value you used. Of course, what ellementz did may well have been different than what is done in the Jet's pizzerias.

I might also add that member HansB, who is famous for his Detroit style pizza, uses a hydration value of 70% (https://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=42012.0). Even Jet's says that its pizza is Detroit-style:

https://www.jetspizza.com/jets-detroit-style-101/#:~:text=When%20people%20think%20%E2%80%9CDeep%20Dish,that%20is%20baked%20to%20perfection.

Likewise, Buddy's considers its pizza to be Detroit style:

https://www.buddyspizza.com/about-buddys#:~:text=About%20Buddy's%20%E2%80%94%20Buddy's%20Pizza&text=In%201946%2C%20Detroit%2DStyle%20Pizza,a%20whole%20lot%20of%20heart.

Peter

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