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Offline piesofsatan

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NYC guy makes NYC pie
« on: August 02, 2020, 01:06:17 PM »
Hey all, this forum has helped me so much over the past couple of months with info, so first of all just wanted to thank all of you for doing what you do!!

I've lived in the NYC-area my entire life (grew up 12 miles from the city in Valley Stream, LI, now living in Brooklyn for the past 10 years), and I've made pizzas when I was younger from just buying dough from the local joint, but it took the quarantine for me to attempt making dough from scratch. It was discouraging at first, but basically I bought a baking steel and things improved greatly, now I'm on my 6th or 7th pie at this point and I've been having a lot of fun.

Yesterday I made a same-day dough. I ran out of bread flour, so I used the NYT / Roberta's recipe as a guide ( https://cooking.nytimes.com/recipes/1016230-robertas-pizza-dough ) as I had Caputo's 00 Chef's flour and APF on hand. Now I know 00 isn't suitable for home ovens, I just bought it on a whim upon seeing it at the store recently. I essentially followed the recipe completely but added a teaspoon of sugar to the mix to help the browning.

I covered and put in the cold oven for 4 hours, but my house is fairly warm even with the A/C going as it is August in NYC so it rose quicker than expected.

My sauce was made with La Valle WP, essentially following J Kenji Lopez Alt's recipe - https://www.seriouseats.com/recipes/2010/10/new-york-style-pizza-sauce.html . Still can't decide if I like cooked sauce or a simple raw tomato sauce more on my pizza but I do know I still haven't perfectly achieved that NYC sauce flavor, hoping to learn more and figure it out.

Cheese was a brick of LMWM Wegman's brand Mozz. I've used this the most recently as it is always there at Wegman's when I'm shopping. I'm not a huge fan of the flavor and actually today went out and got a brick of WM Pollyo, Biazzo, and Galbani to switch it up and see if I notice a difference upon my next attempts.

Overall I was really happy with how this one came out aesthetically, the dough recipe said it yielded two 12" pies, but I split it a bit unevenly to make one approx 14" and one 10" pie. This was the easiest time I've had opening the dough as I feel like I just got the motions down and really learned not to touch the middle while stretching. The browning issue with 00 people spoke about I definitely noticed, but I also like my pies on the well done side so I left it in a bit longer. Just wish the crust rose a bit more, but assuming that has something to do with the short fermentation period as well as the flour types.

Anyway, photo attached. I have a long way to go flavor wise (I'd really like to get something akin to Scarr's sauce), but every time I make one it gets better and better.




Offline piesofsatan

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Re: NYC guy makes NYC pie
« Reply #1 on: August 02, 2020, 04:19:53 PM »
Also, sorry, did not realize Kenji isn't the most popular person on this forum, but during quarantine his videos actually made me want to give it a go.  :-\

Offline piesofsatan

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Re: NYC guy makes NYC pie
« Reply #2 on: August 24, 2020, 03:20:23 PM »
Pie from the other night!

Dough was made based on the Scarr's clone recipe from this forum. Bianco DiNapoli tomatoes. Cheese was the wildcard because I was only able to find FoodTown brand WMLM mozz, but did a blend of that and Biazzo part-skim, with some fresh mozz to sprinkle on top. Got one of the long spouted measuring cups Norma recommends to try her method of spiral saucing with some cheese on before saucing, then more after. Spilt a bit on the edge in places for my first go at it but I was still happy with the result. Cooked on a round 16" baking steel (wish I had a rectangle one to do bigger pies) at 500 degrees F.

It's not the prettiest, and certainly not quite where I want my pizza to be yet, but I was happy with this one!
« Last Edit: August 24, 2020, 03:29:59 PM by Pete-zza »

Online RHawthorne

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Re: NYC guy makes NYC pie
« Reply #3 on: August 28, 2020, 04:11:26 AM »
Wow, I'm surprised I'm the first one to reply to this post. I have to say that for somebody who's only made NY style pizza a few times, your efforts look quite impressive. The only thing I'd say is that the crust on the pizza shown in your first post looks just slightly thick, but it still looks excellent. There's no doubt that you'll pick up lots of good tips and advice here, but it looks like you've definitely got the fundamentals down. Keep up the good work.
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Offline HansB

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Re: NYC guy makes NYC pie
« Reply #4 on: August 28, 2020, 06:11:07 AM »
Also, sorry, did not realize Kenji isn't the most popular person on this forum, but during quarantine his videos actually made me want to give it a go.  :-\

No need to apologize. My first real successful pizza was made using the New York Style formula from Kenji, it may not have been authentic NY but it was really good. I have often recommended Kenji's Foolproof Pan Pizza recipe to people as a first pizza bake, everyone has had great results with it and I still make it ocasionally.
« Last Edit: August 28, 2020, 06:21:53 AM by HansB »
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Online RHawthorne

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Re: NYC guy makes NYC pie
« Reply #5 on: August 28, 2020, 06:20:48 AM »
Also, sorry, did not realize Kenji isn't the most popular person on this forum, but during quarantine his videos actually made me want to give it a go.  :-\
I've heard him say a couple of things I didn't agree with when it comes to pizza, but overall I think he knows food well enough. Have you seen negative posts about him here? I never have.
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Offline Peter B

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Re: NYC guy makes NYC pie
« Reply #6 on: August 29, 2020, 11:32:15 AM »
These pies look pretty damn good to me.  I know what you mean about the flavor being off though.  I have had pies that looked great and just lacked that certain something.
If you are looking to get the sauce right (as I am), here is something you can try:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00F9TCLAY/?tag=pmak-20

I am able to find it in multiple stores here near Columbus, OH.  So since they are from NJ, I would guess that you would be able to find it more easily in the NY area.  I found it in an Italian bakery and the GFS restaurant supply place.  I think the sauce tasted spot-on to me.  Since it is not a common thing that you would be able to find in a grocery store, I am still working on being able to create a decent sauce from a can of tomatoes.
I said to my little one, "come here so I can change you".
He said "change only comes from within".  :-/

Offline piesofsatan

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Re: NYC guy makes NYC pie
« Reply #7 on: August 31, 2020, 05:14:42 PM »
Wow, I'm surprised I'm the first one to reply to this post. I have to say that for somebody who's only made NY style pizza a few times, your efforts look quite impressive. The only thing I'd say is that the crust on the pizza shown in your first post looks just slightly thick, but it still looks excellent. There's no doubt that you'll pick up lots of good tips and advice here, but it looks like you've definitely got the fundamentals down. Keep up the good work.

Thanks so much! Yeah the crust definitely puffed a bit more than typical NY style, but that is just me still working the kinks out as far as stretching goes, and also accommodating a smaller than i'd like pizza peel, though there are a few spots here in NYC that have a puffier than usual crust that I love, like Roebling Pizza in Williamsburg, believe it has been there since 1960! https://s3-media0.fl.yelpcdn.com/bphoto/oVXmvnC2PVh1S0fQQP0IYg/o.jpg

No need to apologize. My first real successful pizza was made using the New York Style formula from Kenji, it may not have been authentic NY but it was really good. I have often recommended Kenji's Foolproof Pan Pizza recipe to people as a first pizza bake, everyone has had great results with it and I still make it ocasionally.

The pan pizza I've done as well and is really easy and always comes out great!

I've heard him say a couple of things I didn't agree with when it comes to pizza, but overall I think he knows food well enough. Have you seen negative posts about him here? I never have.

All were older posts through searches i've done when researching, but it seemed like people thought that he'd borrowed a lot of specific info from this forum's users for his recipes without any credit. I have enjoyed watching Kenji's videos, and like I said - watching/reading his recipes has made me more confident in doing this, and ultimately led me here so can't be all bad.

These pies look pretty damn good to me.  I know what you mean about the flavor being off though.  I have had pies that looked great and just lacked that certain something.
If you are looking to get the sauce right (as I am), here is something you can try:
https://www.amazon.com/dp/B00F9TCLAY/?tag=pmak-20

I am able to find it in multiple stores here near Columbus, OH.  So since they are from NJ, I would guess that you would be able to find it more easily in the NY area.  I found it in an Italian bakery and the GFS restaurant supply place.  I think the sauce tasted spot-on to me.  Since it is not a common thing that you would be able to find in a grocery store, I am still working on being able to create a decent sauce from a can of tomatoes.

Wow, I've never heard of this before! I'd love to try it out - will do some research. The main goal though is to get that flavor on my own, but would be fun to play around with something like this too!

--

I really appreciate everyones responses!! Feels great to receive such nice compliments on the pies. I find it really hard to take a break from doing it, ha! Just got a bunch of new flour in, and one last can of Bianco DiNapoli for now so will be making more ASAP. Next post below I'll show a square pie I made recently.
« Last Edit: August 31, 2020, 05:31:42 PM by Pete-zza »

Offline piesofsatan

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Re: NYC guy makes NYC pie
« Reply #8 on: August 31, 2020, 05:29:03 PM »
Sicilian slices were a big favorite for me as a kid. One sicilian, three garlic knots and a can of coke was my go to order at my local growing up, Pizza Amore in Valley Stream (Not to be confused with the wonderful Amore in Flushing!), so naturally when I started making pizza from scratch I wanted to do a sicilian pie. Before I attempted one, I got one of those Lloyd Detroit Style pans to mess around with because I loved the idea of the burnt cheese crust around it. Did a couple versions of detroit style, was pretty satisfied but I really just wanted to make a square like I grew up with, maybe with a couple of detroit traits (like the burnt cheese crust)

This is what I came out with. Used the dough recipe from Kenji's detroit style pie, but everything else was riffed by me. Sauce was Bianco DiNapoli WP, pushed through a mesh strainer (still don't have a food mill), put into the food processor with 2 cloves of garlic grated, some granulated garlic, oregano, evoo, salt, pepper, etc. Pulsed a few times and chilled until ready to use. Cheese was Biazzo WM Mozz, Biazzo has been the best for me so far flavor-wise, Pecorino Romano, and then Parm to finish. (Will be taking a trip out to Sansone Market soon to grab some Grande Mozz finally as I've never been able to find it / use it yet.)

Baked in the Lloyd pan at 500 F until it looked done, definitely came out still looking somewhat like a Detroit pie but I did the sauce application in diagonal lines like places I grew up with, as well as putting sesame seeds on the bottom crust and a bit on top too, and used Mozz, so as far as I'm concerned its a sicilian pie.

I feel like it could've been left in a TINY bit longer to get a bit crispier on the bottom but otherwise I was pretty happy with this one.


Offline Peter B

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Re: NYC guy makes NYC pie
« Reply #9 on: September 01, 2020, 08:14:09 AM »
Some REALLY good looking pizza in these last two posts.

Re: Don Pepino.  My thought is that I can use it as a baseline to compare against something I am making.  That way, I always have a decent reference point.  What I have found is that there is no "NY style sauce", even though there are lots of recipes on the web that say so.  For example - I have seen recipes (and ate a pizza) with a lot of sugar, which just seemed distracting to me.  I think Forkish even says something about it being typical to the style.  Some recipes says that 'every' NY pizza place cooks their sauce (I find that hard to believe), some use a lot of dried oregano, etc.  I also realized that I guess I am not as picky about sauce as I thought I was - haha.  The Don Pepino would be fine for me if it had a little more oregano or whatever.  So I guess it comes down to the tomatoes having that right balance of brightness, freshness, etc. for what you are looking for.

Now that I think of it - I saw a video where Marc Ioconno (from Lucali) walked someone through making a home version of his pie.  I could have sworn that he said to use Del Monte tomato sauce with some seasonings and cook it for a long time.  I am open to trying that, but I suspect it is not what I am looking for.  Then again - I have never eaten at Lucali, so maybe if I did, I would want to rethink everything.   ???
I said to my little one, "come here so I can change you".
He said "change only comes from within".  :-/

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Offline Peter B

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Re: NYC guy makes NYC pie
« Reply #10 on: September 01, 2020, 04:18:29 PM »
BTW Satan - can you share a few things please:
  • Can you give me an idea of the diameter of pizza you are making, with regard to how much sauce?
  • Also - how much cheese?
  • You are baking on a stone or steel - yes?

I want my pies to look like yours, and you look like you nailed the cheese and sauce amounts.
I said to my little one, "come here so I can change you".
He said "change only comes from within".  :-/

Offline piesofsatan

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Re: NYC guy makes NYC pie
« Reply #11 on: September 01, 2020, 05:46:23 PM »
BTW Satan - can you share a few things please:
  • Can you give me an idea of the diameter of pizza you are making, with regard to how much sauce?
  • Also - how much cheese?
  • You are baking on a stone or steel - yes?

I want my pies to look like yours, and you look like you nailed the cheese and sauce amounts.

Oh to be clear the last round pie pic is a picture of a Roebling Pizza pie, not mine, I wish!!

These are usually 14-15" pies as my peel cant handle any bigger, I just ordered a new one that is 16x18 so in theory i'll be able to launch a 16" pie onto my 16" inch round baking steel though it'll be risky, haha.

The sauce and cheese questions will be harder to answer. The most recent pies I posted I was using a spouted measuring cup, thanks to a tip from Norma, and doing her method of putting some cheese down on the dough, then spiral the sauce with the measuring cup, then more cheese on top. I eyeballed both of the last two pies. I'll weigh it all out next time and let you know!

And yes, as I mentioned I'm using a steel!
-
And also, just for anyone reading or wondering, haha, my username comes from my favorite song by a 70's punk band from Cleveland called The Pagans, their song was called Eyes of Satan, which is the handle I use for everything else, but considering the nature of this forum PiesOfSatan seemed more fitting ;)

Offline hammettjr

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Re: NYC guy makes NYC pie
« Reply #12 on: September 01, 2020, 07:48:15 PM »
The Sicilian looks really good. Did you make any knots to go with it?  :chef:

Edit: also, call Sansone before you go to tell them what you want. They may need to run over to the warehouse to get it as the new retail shop has limited selection.
« Last Edit: September 01, 2020, 10:30:28 PM by hammettjr »
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Offline Peter B

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Re: NYC guy makes NYC pie
« Reply #13 on: September 02, 2020, 08:05:09 AM »
And also, just for anyone reading or wondering, haha, my username comes from my favorite song by a 70's punk band from Cleveland called The Pagans, their song was called Eyes of Satan, which is the handle I use for everything else, but considering the nature of this forum PiesOfSatan seemed more fitting ;)

Well played!
I said to my little one, "come here so I can change you".
He said "change only comes from within".  :-/

Offline radstronomical

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Re: NYC guy makes NYC pie
« Reply #14 on: September 02, 2020, 10:05:24 AM »
Now that I think of it - I saw a video where Marc Ioconno (from Lucali) walked someone through making a home version of his pie.  I could have sworn that he said to use Del Monte tomato sauce with some seasonings and cook it for a long time.  I am open to trying that, but I suspect it is not what I am looking for.  Then again - I have never eaten at Lucali, so maybe if I did, I would want to rethink everything.   ???

In a video on him making pizza in his shop (the one from Food Skills here: https://youtu.be/BSHh0MmJM1U?t=300), he says he uses fresh tomatoes that he cooks for four hours. I could have sworn he also said "our own" tomatoes in some video I saw, but can't find that and doesn't seem sustainable at a little shop in brooklyn.

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Offline Peter B

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Re: NYC guy makes NYC pie
« Reply #15 on: September 02, 2020, 11:39:29 AM »
Here is the video I was referring to.  They start to talk sauce around the 5 minute mark.  There is also the dough and sauce recipe in the description.  I think I would try the sauce at some point to see if I like it.  I kinda think I prefer the uncooked variety, but how bad could it be, right?



I said to my little one, "come here so I can change you".
He said "change only comes from within".  :-/

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Re: NYC guy makes NYC pie
« Reply #16 on: September 02, 2020, 02:48:50 PM »
In a video on him making pizza in his shop (the one from Food Skills here: https://youtu.be/BSHh0MmJM1U?t=300), he says he uses fresh tomatoes that he cooks for four hours. I could have sworn he also said "our own" tomatoes in some video I saw, but can't find that and doesn't seem sustainable at a little shop in brooklyn.
I'm thinking he probably does what Dom DeMarco is known to do, which is to use some canned tomato product as the base, and combine that with some fresh cooked tomatoes. I don't know what he means by "our own" tomatoes, because I've certainly never seen a video which shows tomatoes being grown on his property, so he probably just means tomatoes that he sources somewhere as close to home as possible. But who knows? "Our own" may as well mean tomatoes that he owns, no matter where they come from.
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Offline radstronomical

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Re: NYC guy makes NYC pie
« Reply #17 on: September 02, 2020, 03:49:05 PM »
I think I would try the sauce at some point to see if I like it.  I kinda think I prefer the uncooked variety, but how bad could it be, right?

Yeah, I flip flop between fresh and cooked based on what i'm feeling and what i want out of the pie. I don't love onion in there, but I don't cook for 4 hours so maybe they just dissolve by then. I like to lightly brown some garlic and red pepper flakes, then toss in the tomatoes, salt, a little bit of sugar and basil or oregano depending on the pie and let it simmer for 15-20 minutes. Really good for a more ny style pie or one with stronger flavors on top.

Offline Peter B

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Re: NYC guy makes NYC pie
« Reply #18 on: September 03, 2020, 08:51:18 AM »
The sauce and cheese questions will be harder to answer. The most recent pies I posted I was using a spouted measuring cup, thanks to a tip from Norma, and doing her method of putting some cheese down on the dough, then spiral the sauce with the measuring cup, then more cheese on top. I eyeballed both of the last two pies. I'll weigh it all out next time and let you know!

BTW - you referred to Norma in a way that it felt like that is someone I should know.  Well - I stumbled on this completely coincidentally last night.  Now I see why I should probably know that name a little better.  The relevant portion starts around 18:40.


I said to my little one, "come here so I can change you".
He said "change only comes from within".  :-/

Offline piesofsatan

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Re: NYC guy makes NYC pie
« Reply #19 on: September 03, 2020, 11:09:52 AM »
BTW - you referred to Norma in a way that it felt like that is someone I should know.  Well - I stumbled on this completely coincidentally last night.  Now I see why I should probably know that name a little better.  The relevant portion starts around 18:40.



Yep exactly, and she posts here! Did you hear her give the forum a shout out? ;)

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