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Author Topic: Naturally leavened dough never works right, yeasted dough works fine..frustrated  (Read 99 times)

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Offline therippa

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Whenever I make naturally leavened dough, it seems the gluten never gets strong enough.  I can shape it without bouncing back, but when stretching the dough it's uneven in many spots, thins out, tears easily.  I am using a good starter (my sourdough loaves come out perfect).  I've tried a few recipes (Roberta's, Santa Barabara Baker Original Recipe, SBB new recipe....).  It's always the same.

If I try Roberta's 4 hour yeasted recipe from NYT Cooking though, the dough comes out just fine.  While my stretching technique isn't world class, it works here so I don't think that's a variable.

Today's dough (which was an epic failure)
Last night around 8:00pm - assembled levain
This morning at 8:30 - autolyse (following SBB's new recipe https://santabarbarabaker.com/the-best-pizza-dough-for-your-ooni-pizza-oven/)
9:15 - added salt and olive oil, mixed in stand mixer for 10 minutes
Bulk fermented until about 2:00 in a kitchen with temps ranging from 68-71.
Shaped, let rise until 5:15, started stretching for dinner.
Dough was very relaxed.  Defined the edge, pushed out the middle a bit, tossed and immediately the centers were getting paper thin and tearing, dough had no strength.

Any ideas or suggestions?

Offline Pizza_Not_War

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You need a longer ferment.

Offline Heikjo

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I don't know about longer fermentation if it's already quite relaxed. The recipe has 31% SD, which is quite a lot.

My own SD doughs also tend to get thin spots, which is a result of the larger bubbles in the dough being stretched out. It usually works out fine, but I have to watch it when I open and avoid stretching those already thin parts too much.

Some photos of the dough would help. Does it rise a lot in volume by the time you open it?

SD does introduce a few more variables than yeast, which can cause problems in a dough. This is a very short recipe with a high amount of SD, but maybe you need some time in bulk before balling. If the dough is left from mixing to opening, it may lose all elasticity. Perhaps leaving it 2-3 hours in bulk and then ball it.

The SD can also be a potential issue and cause the dough to lose strength.

One thing you may try is a dough with less starter and let it ferment longer, first in bulk then in ball.
Mostly Neapolitan sourdough pizzas in an electric Effeuno P134H.

Online jsaras

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I don't know about longer fermentation if it's already quite relaxed. The recipe has 31% SD, which is quite a lot.

My own SD doughs also tend to get thin spots, which is a result of the larger bubbles in the dough being stretched out. It usually works out fine, but I have to watch it when I open and avoid stretching those already thin parts too much.

Some photos of the dough would help. Does it rise a lot in volume by the time you open it?

SD does introduce a few more variables than yeast, which can cause problems in a dough. This is a very short recipe with a high amount of SD, but maybe you need some time in bulk before balling. If the dough is left from mixing to opening, it may lose all elasticity. Perhaps leaving it 2-3 hours in bulk and then ball it.

The SD can also be a potential issue and cause the dough to lose strength.

One thing you may try is a dough with less starter and let it ferment longer, first in bulk then in ball.
31% sourdough!!!???!!!.  I donít recall ever going higher than 5%.  If one uses a sourdough starter as a leavening agent, instead of a giant prefermented mass, I think youíre going to have better results.
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Offline billg

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Offline HansB

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In todays dough I used 16% levain.

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