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Author Topic: A great commercial flour type  (Read 5601 times)

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Offline Omidz

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A great commercial flour type
« on: November 29, 2014, 03:24:51 AM »
Hi everyone. Got a flour question for you. Im back to experimenting with flours and dough again. I have used Caputo and Mello Judith quite a few times recently. I have made great  pizzas with both. Of course they behave differently.but been very happy with both. I want to try others that are great performers. I'm after a flour that is:

*domestic, CA based would be even better but not a must.
*commercially available like Mello Judith
*good bang for the buck (good value) bit still very good quality
* I like Neapolitan crusts but want to create something that is stronger (no fork and knife/can be taken Togo)

Your expertise would be much appreciated.

Omid

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: A great commercial flour type
« Reply #1 on: November 29, 2014, 09:58:34 AM »
GM Neapolitan flour is 99% of Caputo Pizzeria in quality at half the price.

The fast bake - not the flour - is what makes NP soft and wet. Changing to a stronger flour won't change that. It will just give you tougher wet pizza.

You can make NP a great to-go item by folding and serving it al libretto like they do on the street in Naples. (picture credit: Matthew, http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,14038.msg140854.html#msg140854)

Other than that, probably get a good malted flour and slow down your bake.
"We make great pizza, with sourdough when we can, baker's yeast when we must, but always great pizza."  
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Offline Pete-zza

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Re: A great commercial flour type
« Reply #2 on: November 29, 2014, 10:28:41 AM »
Omid,

I was going to suggest the same flour as Craig. You can see the specs for that flour at http://www.generalmillscf.com/services/productpdf.ashx?pid=50237000. Much like the imported 00 flours, the GM version is unbleached, unmalted, unbromated and unenriched, and no ascorbic acid. And its protein content is similar to many imported 00 flours.

Peter

Offline Omidz

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Re: A great commercial flour type
« Reply #3 on: November 29, 2014, 10:40:53 AM »
Hi Craig Good d to hear from you! Thhanks for the info. It that makes sense. I'll check out the GM flour. Do they sell at Restaurant Depot? Also any suggestions on a malted flour choice?

How about a 50/50 mix? Jeff V. wrote about this but I have not tried yet.

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: A great commercial flour type
« Reply #4 on: November 29, 2014, 10:50:51 AM »
I don't know who sells the GM flour. I'm sure GM could tell you if you give them a call.

As for malted flour and flour in general, IMO, the choice of flour is a lot less important than what you do with it. Maybe call around and see what you have ready, reliable access to and post the list. I'm sure people could tell you the pros and cons of each.
"We make great pizza, with sourdough when we can, baker's yeast when we must, but always great pizza."  
Craig's Neapolitan Garage

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Offline parallei

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Offline Omidz

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Re: A great commercial flour type
« Reply #6 on: November 29, 2014, 02:01:59 PM »
Thanks Parallei. May I ask what characteristics stood out for you on these flours?

Offline parallei

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Re: A great commercial flour type
« Reply #7 on: November 29, 2014, 02:25:35 PM »
Hi Omid,

The only domestic 00 flour I've used is the Bay State Milling Contadino.  All those links above are relating to that flour.  I'm just a home pizza maker.  That said, I thought it mixed up easily and that the finished dough handled as well as Caputo.  The typical 00 "smoothness" was there.  I also thought it had a bit more wheat taste than Caputo, which I liked.

I got my 50 lb "sample" by just calling Bay State Milling (I never could get GM to even tell me where they sell their 00 flour in the Denver area), so I do not know what it costs.  I'm sure it is much less expensive than an Italian flour.

Hope this helps.  If you try it, let us now what you think about it.

Paul
   

Offline Pizza Baker

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Re: A great commercial flour type
« Reply #8 on: December 02, 2014, 01:45:44 PM »
I am using the Bay State Milling Contadino 00 for Neapolitan pies in my WFO as well as for Detroit Style Pizza and Focaccia in my home oven. It seems to be very versatile. I use 65% hydration for the WFO and 80% or higher hydration for the Detroit and Focaccia. At 65% it is smooth and opens easily. I get it through Gordon Food Service here in MI, not sure who distributes it outside of the Midwest. Jim
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Offline Omidz

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Re: A great commercial flour type
« Reply #9 on: December 03, 2014, 07:22:26 PM »
I have been doing some searching around. I called GM the rep said the main difference in their Neapolitan is that it is untreated and not malted. He is sending me a sample. I left a message for bay state milling but still havn't heard back.

Also in my searching around I discovered that my beloved Mello Judith has been sold to Miller Mills and no longer is owned by Conagra. I am wondering if this is the exact same product or with the ownership change will come a change in the characteristic of the flour. I am pretty sure it is now milled at a different facility. it's local to me here in N. Cal which is good but if the cost or quality has been impacted that would be a big bummer since it is the best flour I have worked with outside of caputo 00.

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Offline theppgcowboy

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Re: A great commercial flour type
« Reply #10 on: December 13, 2014, 01:32:51 PM »
I don't know who sells the GM flour. I'm sure GM could tell you if you give them a call.

Sysco sells it in my area 17 for 50 pounds.


Offline TXCraig1

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Re: A great commercial flour type
« Reply #11 on: December 13, 2014, 01:33:52 PM »
Sysco sells it in my area 17 for 50 pounds.

I talked to someone last night who told me $17 as well.
"We make great pizza, with sourdough when we can, baker's yeast when we must, but always great pizza."  
Craig's Neapolitan Garage

Offline Omidz

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Re: A great commercial flour type
« Reply #12 on: December 14, 2014, 05:15:31 AM »
Craig have you used Bay state and GM? If yes what was your take on the difference?

Offline Omidz

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Re: A great commercial flour type
« Reply #13 on: February 04, 2015, 01:21:45 AM »
Omid,

I was going to suggest the same flour as Craig. You can see the specs for that flour at http://www.generalmillscf.com/services/productpdf.ashx?pid=50237000. Much like the imported 00 flours, the GM version is unbleached, unmalted, unbromated and unenriched, and no ascorbic acid. And its protein content is similar to many imported 00 flours.

Peter
Hi Pete I was going over this post and wanted to know where you saw that the GM is unbromated, no ascorbic acid and unenriched? doesn't look like it states any of that on the GM fact sheet on the flour.

Offline Pete-zza

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Re: A great commercial flour type
« Reply #14 on: February 04, 2015, 08:17:06 AM »
Hi Pete I was going over this post and wanted to know where you saw that the GM is unbromated, no ascorbic acid and unenriched? doesn't look like it states any of that on the GM fact sheet on the flour.
Omid,

If GM uses bromates (potassium bromate), ascorbic acid and enrichments, it is required under law to state such. It is also GM's standard practice. The only ingredient for the GM Neapolitan flour is wheat flour. That flour is intended to mimic the imported Italian 00 flours (see http://www.generalmillscf.com/industries/pizzeria/support-tool-categories/news-articles-and-events/gm-introduces-neapolitan-flour?src=SH) that are also unbromated, unenriched and do not contain ascorbic acid.

If you go to the GM foodservice website and look at the specs for various flours at http://www.generalmillscf.com/Home/products/flour, you will find many examples of flours that contain bromates, ascorbic acid and enrichment packages.

Peter

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Offline TXCraig1

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Re: A great commercial flour type
« Reply #15 on: February 04, 2015, 08:41:35 AM »
Craig have you used Bay state and GM? If yes what was your take on the difference?

Sorry I missed this question when you originally posted it.

I have used the GM Neapolitan Flour but not Bay State. I really like the GM flour. I'd say it's very close to Caputo Pizzeria in pretty much every respect. Recently I made a bunch of pizzas with GM for a party at a friends house in his WFO and was really happy with the pies.
"We make great pizza, with sourdough when we can, baker's yeast when we must, but always great pizza."  
Craig's Neapolitan Garage

Offline Omidz

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Re: A great commercial flour type
« Reply #16 on: February 08, 2015, 03:02:20 PM »
Pete thanks for the info. I also checked with the GM rep and he confirmed everything you said. Just wanted you to know.

Offline Pete-zza

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Re: A great commercial flour type
« Reply #17 on: February 08, 2015, 03:04:51 PM »
Pete thanks for the info. I also checked with the GM rep and he confirmed everything you said. Just wanted you to know.
Omid,

Thank you. I appreciate the feedback.

Peter

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