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Author Topic: First time NY pizza fail -help me please. UPDATE : still need help.  (Read 2905 times)

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Offline RHawthorne

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Re: First time NY pizza fail -help me please. UPDATE : still need help.
« Reply #100 on: May 26, 2021, 10:32:06 PM »
Regarding my discussion with RHawthorne, I believe our discussion was more of a disagreement on what the end-goal should be rather than disagreement about definition.
Sorry in advance if I'm sounding in any way long winded or obnoxious. I just take this stuff very seriously.
 I don't know that we're disagreeing all that much, if we are at all.
  My issue with the use of the term 'efficiency' in as much as it relates to the making of pizza is not so much that it's used in a condescending way, but rather that I think that sometimes it's used in the wrong way . I understand that it has it's place when we're talking about the long view of large scale production goals, and repeatability and such, but from where I'm standing (and I understand that this might not necessarily make sense to some), I'm more concerned with what I would call design efficiency. By that, I mean the efficiency (for lack of better term) of the process of translating a desired product, with all of it's pertinent characteristics, from an idea to a finished product. And this, to my line of thinking in this case, often entails leaving behind what might be considered 'money on the table' from a more 'by the numbers' approach. I could ramble endlessly about this and other things pizza related, but I don't want to bore you to death.
 But if you're still reading this- and thanks if you are- I will say that we aren't necessarily on the same page when it comes to this particular pizza style's desired characteristics. The main point of the conversation has been that of crispiness in the finished product, which is absolutely a valid pursuit on it's own, but I don't really think that that's what NY pizza is all about. I think it's more about the overall balance of chewiness to crispiness,with the chewiness as it's more defining characteristic. It can be a bit crispy around the edges, and that can be a big part of the package, but overall, it's chewier than it is crispy. It can crack a bit on the fold on the cornicione, but it shouldn't be like a cracker.
 Now, to circle back around to the topic of hydration, it's absolutely critical in hitting your target, but I'm not at all sold on the idea that going for maximum hydration will delivered the best results, if that's what you're saying. I think the key to this body style is really in attenuating the release of the moisture in the dough, either by baking at a lower temp for a longer time, or by using some percentage of oil in the mix to prevent the moisture from evaporating too quickly and leaving behind a dried out and burnt crust, or a combination of both of techniques...and probably still others I'm not fully educated on.
 Anyway, hopefully I haven't come across as obnoxious in any way, and thanks for reading this if you did. Respond or don't. I'll take no offense at all if you tune me out.
 
 
« Last Edit: May 26, 2021, 10:35:09 PM by RHawthorne »
If we're not questioning the reason for our existence, then what the hell are we doing here?!

Offline amolapizza

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Re: First time NY pizza fail -help me please. UPDATE : still need help.
« Reply #101 on: June 06, 2021, 12:11:19 PM »
To me the dough looks very delicate, it probably isn't suited to a knuckle stretch.

One trick is to leave a bulge of dough in the middle, once you start stretching the edges the surface inside the rim will expand, and the dough to fill it has to come from somewhere, and it won't come from the rim.

I think I'd concur with some of the others and say drop the hydration a bit, at least for now while you're learning..
Jack

Effeuno P134H (500C), Biscotto Fornace Saputo, Sunmix Sun6, Caputo Pizzeria, Caputo Saccorosso, Mutti Pelati.

Offline Chronic mole

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Re: First time NY pizza fail -help me please. UPDATE : still need help.
« Reply #102 on: June 16, 2021, 06:37:45 PM »
I went to NY for four days and tried some of the famous NY pizza spots talked about here - I understand what NY pizza should taste like and will strive more towards that goal. I also made the following observations:

1. IMO - Scarrs and Paulie Gee's is overrated. I know Paulie Gee himself is beloved on the forum but I was not impressed.

2. Prince St. was really good - the slice and the squares.

3. John's of Bleecker Street was good but not the best pizza I've ever had ( I blame Portnoy for setting my expectations too high).

4. I regret not going to Mama's Too.

4. The best pizza place I've ever been to remains Black Sheep in Minnesota.

Offline psedillo

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Re: First time NY pizza fail -help me please. UPDATE : still need help.
« Reply #103 on: June 16, 2021, 07:32:12 PM »
I went to NY for four days and tried some of the famous NY pizza spots talked about here - I understand what NY pizza should taste like and will strive more towards that goal. I also made the following observations:

3. John's of Bleecker Street was good but not the best pizza I've ever had ( I blame Portnoy for setting my expectations too high).

Using Portnoy as a frame of reference is like picking any random star in the universe to guide your way. His "reviews" if you could call them that are pointless click-baty content that offer zero perspective on pizza.
Paul

Offline Chronic mole

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Re: First time NY pizza fail -help me please. UPDATE : still need help.
« Reply #104 on: June 16, 2021, 07:55:13 PM »
Using Portnoy as a frame of reference is like picking any random star in the universe to guide your way. His "reviews" if you could call them that are pointless click-baty content that offer zero perspective on pizza.

lol, i take your point.

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