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Author Topic: Malty Laminated Beer Pizza  (Read 76769 times)

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Offline Mad_Ernie

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Re: Malty Laminated Beer Pizza
« Reply #180 on: October 06, 2014, 12:17:05 PM »
Dan,

Nice photos.  Good to see you are still in the game.  I made an RT clone this past weekend that came out great as always (no photos, though).

In your mention of the lack of oven spring, how much yeast did you use? 

I am wondering if the competition between your starter and the yeast might have had something to do with it.

Best regards,

-ME
Let them eat pizza.

Offline DNA Dan

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Re: Malty Laminated Beer Pizza
« Reply #181 on: October 06, 2014, 04:24:30 PM »
I used 3g ADY which is just under 0.7% total formulation. I also made the regular recipe with the same yeast, so I know the yeast was good. I could tell in the fridge that the "experimental" dough was not getting puffy or fermenting well. I think perhaps the acidity of the sourdough starter killed or inhibited them. It didn't seem THAT sour, then again I used 200g in the formulation, which I think is a pretty high amount? Another aspect of the sourdough culture I made is I don't know how well the yeast fared in it. I meant I could have just been culturing lactobacillus. It would increase in volume after feeding, but no so much that it was 3 or 4 times the volume. It would just about double. Anyway, the Red Hook ESB is really something special. I can use it to replace the water 100%, add yeast directly to it, and it still grows fantastic.


Offline Lydia

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Re: Malty Laminated Beer Pizza
« Reply #182 on: November 17, 2014, 04:40:46 PM »

DAN


your pies are looking SO good  :drool:



Wonder how Lydia is doing......she is a really nice gal.   :chef:


Hey ALL



I'm not dead "yet"...but man....the weather is kickin' my butt. I seriously wasn't prepared for ice storms in the south, let alone 3 day long tornado outbreaks!  :o  (BTW watching the radar during one of those is just like playing Atari Astroids but your joystick stopped workin' ...you just sit there and pray you don't get hit.  :-D ) In March and April I only had 2-3 no stress days a week while the weather flip-flopped between ice and tornados.


I'm starting to get the hang of it all though.  :-\


But other than that, I DO love it here. The people are great. It's a bit of a time warp for ingredients which is really cool. Red wax cheese, whole milk cultured buttermilk, pork jowel, real string beans, carnation "chocolate" malt, and "meat" OMG I can eat meat again.  ;D [size=78%]  [/size]


I never "EVER" want to eat nasty "california beef" ever again. Not by choice I was nearly vegetarian, now I'm scarfing down triple steak burgers. Its so liberating  :chef:


I miss CAL-mex and california style pizza and C&H sugar.


I'm trying..really trying to get back on the pizza boards. I miss it. I've got a lot or board reading to catch-up though.
The roundest knight at King Arthur's round table was Sir Cumference.They say he acquired his size from eating too much pi.

Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: Malty Laminated Beer Pizza
« Reply #183 on: November 17, 2014, 11:11:14 PM »
Good to hear all is swell Lydia....pm me if you get desperate enough for me to send some C&H sugar your way.  :)
"Care Free Highway...let me slip away on you"

Offline Lydia

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Re: Malty Laminated Beer Pizza
« Reply #184 on: November 19, 2014, 08:57:50 AM »
Good to hear all is swell Lydia....pm me if you get desperate enough for me to send some C&H sugar your way.  :)


Thanks   ;D ...sent a PM
The roundest knight at King Arthur's round table was Sir Cumference.They say he acquired his size from eating too much pi.

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Offline Lydia

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Re: Malty Laminated Beer Pizza
« Reply #185 on: November 19, 2014, 10:00:56 AM »
About the deactivated yeast, I came across something that said "cultured flour" was used in "clean label" breads as a preservative, if the wholesale bakery did not want to use calcium propionate and thus have to declare it on the label.


For current Shakeys...I'm going to agree with the direction your going here. Deactivated yeast has the wrong flavor and aroma....BUT autoysed yeast extract, if its the correct type will give off a parmesan-romano  type flavor and aroma. (other types will give off beef or chicken like flavors) I have no clue on how to obtain it other than through prepackaged mixes like Knorr Bullion.

But for Vintage Shakeys.....There was a time that I had "that flavor" and "that aroma". It was when I had "aging/old"  High gluten malted bread flour stored at extremely high temps around 85- 90 F in a sunroom during summer. So alot like storing flour in a commercial kitchen.
:chef:

Everyone kept asking me HOW I got "that flavor". :-[

I really think that looking into aging and/or high temperature fermenting of malted barely flour (not sourdough culture) is the "real key". Something to do with manipulating the enzymes in the Barley Flour.

I also recall that the flour behaved differently too. It was crispier in a dry crunchy way and had more "tug" to the bite than it had before the abuse.

------------------------------

A local old-school mom n pop place is using a flour with calcium propionate, and baking on deck ovens. Boy o boy, their crusts are as close to vintage Shakeys as I've had in decades.
The roundest knight at King Arthur's round table was Sir Cumference.They say he acquired his size from eating too much pi.

Offline Zing

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Re: Malty Laminated Beer Pizza
« Reply #186 on: December 05, 2014, 10:56:03 AM »
Lydia, that post of yours got me to thinking. As I mentioned in one of the Shakey's threads, the 2013 samples of Shakey's (brought back shortly after I wrote the paragraph you referenced above) did NOT have "That Smell".

Let me formulate my thoughts and then post entries to the major Shakey's threads in case some of the ex-employees remember how various types of dough abuse affected the taste of the final pies. As the chef-turned-cash and carry manager at a foodservice house once told me, "Even if you have the recipe, technique can make it taste different".

Offline Mad_Ernie

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Re: Malty Laminated Beer Pizza
« Reply #187 on: December 08, 2014, 02:29:15 PM »
Lydia, that post of yours got me to thinking. As I mentioned in one of the Shakey's threads, the 2013 samples of Shakey's (brought back shortly after I wrote the paragraph you referenced above) did NOT have "That Smell".

Let me formulate my thoughts and then post entries to the major Shakey's threads in case some of the ex-employees remember how various types of dough abuse affected the taste of the final pies. As the chef-turned-cash and carry manager at a foodservice house once told me, "Even if you have the recipe, technique can make it taste different".

Zing,

There are 2 possible reasons for that lack of smell (and I know of what you are talking about because I have eaten at the Shakey's in Anaheim twice). 
1) Change in the flour formulation.  I was informed in 2012 that Round Table and Shakey's had reformulated their doughs to meet California food regulations regarding fat content.
2) The use of conveyor ovens instead of deck ovens.  I noticed in Anaheim they use the conveyor ovens.  I have also been to the Shakey's in Oroville and they still use the old deck oven (at least they did in 2010 and 2012).  I found 'that smell' to be more noticeable at that location.

-ME
Let them eat pizza.

Offline joelweb

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Re: Malty Laminated Beer Pizza
« Reply #188 on: January 13, 2019, 10:32:30 PM »
Hey DNA Dan. I'm assuming you are still around and am resurrecting this old thread to say thank you for all the time you've put into creating this malty laminated crust and sauce. While I know the Round Table recipe is the culmination of a lot of experimentation and research from several people, you put a lot of effort into the recipe to get it to the next level and Iím going to start there.

While Iím a newbie on the forum, I grew up in Oregon back in the 80s and 90s, and while I ate a little Round Table, my roots were tied to the original Pietro's recipe (the chain was founded in 1957) and all the other great laminated pizzas that could be found in Oregon.

I've been living in Montana for the past 15 years and am tired of the underwhelming pizza in this state and the complete lack of laminated pizzas here. I've decided it's time to take matters into my own hands and see if I can reproduce what I remember from my childhood.

I grew up baking a lot and Iíve read through this entire thread and the Round Table Pizza crust thread.

Also, with some deep searching online, I just found a working commercial dough sheeter for $250. Itís a bit dirty, but was a screaming deal and should be a difference maker.

I wonít have the sheeter in hand til March, but Iíve accumulated all the other equipment and plan to get started soon. Iíll check back when I get up and running.

One quick question, are you still making this pizza?

Offline DNA Dan

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Re: Malty Laminated Beer Pizza
« Reply #189 on: February 11, 2019, 01:02:31 AM »
I'm still in the game making pies. I just sent you a PM.

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Offline joelweb

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Re: Malty Laminated Beer Pizza
« Reply #190 on: March 27, 2019, 10:08:44 PM »
Update.

Pizza sheeter finally came into my possession last Friday. I bought it sight unseen on Facebook marketplace and was pleasantly surprised to find it in really good condition. It was a little dirty from sitting for a few years and there was a small amount of surface rust on the rollers that I needed to sand off, but it was overall in great shape. I cleaned it up, greased the bearings, oiled the chain, and I was sheeting dough. 

I made a couple pies and was very pleased with my first attempt. Crust was nice and light with some air pockets and the flavor was great. I'm currently using a kettlepizza barbecue insert I found on Craigslist and I need to mess around with it before I'll know if I like it. I know it isn't perfect, and I definitely don't have it mastered, but I'm not sure where I would stick a pizza oven at my house. I definitely need to experiment with the sheeter some more too. I tried to not overwork the crust, but also wonder if I could have rolled it a little more. I also think I could have made my crust a little thinner. Overall I think it was a solid and tasty first attempt. Night and day better than when I tried to make this recipe by hand with a rolling pin - that didn't work nearly as well.

I must say that the taste of the pizza reminded me of what I grew up eating in western Oregon. I think the sauce was pretty close, too.

I do need to focus on some better ingredients. I grew up loving Canadian bacon but I'm very dissatisfied with the stuff I can find in the stores around here in western Montana. I'd like to find a local deli that could slice it for me.

Thanks again for the recipe, Dan.


« Last Edit: March 27, 2019, 10:11:27 PM by joelweb »

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