Author Topic: Please help!  (Read 1672 times)

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Offline jwrambo

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Please help!
« on: January 08, 2012, 04:19:34 PM »
Hello all.  Jason Rambo here.  I am joining this forum to help in my new quest of the perfect pizza at home.  My local NY style pizzeria changed hands, and they no longer use the same dough recipe. >:(  Since I no longer have any options in my area that make what I consider a proper NY style pizza, I guess I will have to rely on ya'll to help me out.

The dough to me is the most important aspect to me.  What I am looking to make is thin, approx 1/8", crisp, and a "chewey" texture to the outside edge.  I have tried several recipes online, and none was what I was looking for.  Through research, I have learned the importance of high gluten flour.  I ordered some KASL, but it has not arrived yet.  I just tried some of their bread flour from the local supermarket with poor results.  I did happen to see the flour the pizzeria that changed hands was using.  It is All Trumps, so I guess I will be ordering some of that as well.  I am hoping I can get a good basic recipe for the style of dough I described above.  I could then make that, and report back my likes and dislikes with regards to the texture, chew, etc.  For equipment, I have a Kitchen Aide mixer, a Ninja mixer with dough hook, and if need be I will hand knead.

The recipe I just made, and was not happy with is below.  The crust was not thin enough, not crispy enough, and the outer edge was softer than I would like, more like a bread stick than a chewy pizza crust end.  Cooked it at 450 degrees on a perforated pizza pan for half the time, and then just on the rack to get it to brown on the bottom.


1 packet yeast, rapid rise Fleischman's
1/4 cup oil Canola/Olive oil blend
2/3 cup 110 degree water
1t salt
1T sugar
Pulsed the Ninja for a few seconds.
Added 2 cups of KA bread flour.
Mixed for about 2 minutes in the Ninja.
Had to add one more tablespoon of flour.
Covered in a stainless bowl for hour and a half till it doubled in size.
Rolled out as thin as possible.
Topped and baked till golden brown.



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Re: Please help!
« Reply #1 on: January 09, 2012, 01:26:20 AM »
Jason, welcome to the forum.

First of all, get a digital scale, weigh your flour and water, and only use recipes that weigh the flour and water.  If you see a recipe that goes by volume, that's a sure sign the author doesn't have a clue.

High gluten flour is important, but KASL is a little too high on the gluten scale.  All Trumps is better, and if you can get your hands on some, it certainly helps, but for crisp NY style, it helps to have flour with a protein a little lower than either KASL or All Trumps. You should be able to work with the KASL by blending it with some all purpose, but, in the future, you want to be on the looking for bromated medium high gluten flour like Full Strength.

The most important ingredient, by far, in pizza, is the oven setup and the corresponding bake time that you're able to hit. As you extend the bake time, the pizza will become dense and bready. It's only through quality stone materials that one is able to achieve fast bakes and great pizza.

Tell me about your oven. Electric or gas? If it's gas does it have the broiler in the main compartment?  What's the peak temp?
« Last Edit: January 09, 2012, 01:28:27 AM by scott123 »

Offline jwrambo

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Re: Please help!
« Reply #2 on: January 09, 2012, 11:13:50 AM »
Oven is electric.  Max temp is 550 degrees.  It does have a broiler.  I have a digital scale, so if you have a recipe you would be kind enough to share, that would be fantastic!  The KA bread flour I have right now is 12.7%.  What does the bromated flour do?  I have read about concerns of cancer???


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Re: Please help!
« Reply #3 on: January 10, 2012, 04:32:37 AM »
The concerns of cancer are unfounded.  If they give massive doses to rats, they do get cancer, but the quantity in cooked pizza crust is practically immeasurable and harmless.  Most municipalities allow the same amount of bromate in water that's in bromated flour pizza- that's how harmless it is. If your pizzeria was using a bromated flour and you want to produce something in the same ballpark, you want to use bromated flour as well.

Here's my most recent recipe:


That should be very close to what you're describing, although for a bit more crispiness, I might drop the hydration to 63%.

1/2" steel plate is the key here.  It's a bit on the heavy side, but it's the only easily source-able and proven material to do solid NY style bake times. If you want to go with a lighter material, don't mind spending the money and don't mind working with something a bit unproven, there's silicon carbide kiln shelves.  Theoretically, silicon carbide should be perfect for NY style, but, so far, the results are preliminary. If you want real pizzeria style pizza without modding your oven, though, these are the only two hearth options.

We have been working on gentle oven mods to get slightly higher temps out of ovens without pushing the envelope, and some have been promising. You could use a thick conventional pizza stone and combine it with a mod for good results, but, between this route and steel, steel is much easier to bake on.