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Author Topic: How I make my NP dough  (Read 282934 times)

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Offline levity03

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Re: How I make my NP dough
« Reply #760 on: September 10, 2020, 09:59:42 AM »
Craig -- thank you for your generous advice! The wife only allows biweekly pizza nights so will report back then ;-)

Offline dday_two

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Re: How I make my NP dough
« Reply #761 on: September 26, 2020, 08:29:16 AM »
Hi Graig, have you noticed any particular flavour/texture difference for a 48h fermentation between different temperatures in the range of 59-687F (15-20C)?

F.e. you think there is any noticeable difference between using 4% SD at ~60F and 2% SD at ~63F? Or it as a matter of convenience?

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: How I make my NP dough
« Reply #762 on: September 26, 2020, 10:38:29 AM »
Hi Graig, have you noticed any particular flavour/texture difference for a 48h fermentation between different temperatures in the range of 59-687F (15-20C)?

F.e. you think there is any noticeable difference between using 4% SD at ~60F and 2% SD at ~63F? Or it as a matter of convenience?

No. I can't say I've noticed a significant difference.
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Offline Bogy

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Re: How I make my NP dough
« Reply #763 on: October 24, 2020, 01:15:18 AM »
Hi Graig, i'm so excited with your topic about sourdough pizza and i thank you a lot for that. and i like to inquire about RT daily starter feeding routine you suggest as i want to use the discard from this daily feeding (as active) as a levain to my dough (no need to build anew one from my starter)

1- what temperature you like to keep your starter in? and what you suggest for this feeding routine (once or twice or more)?
2- If i want to keep my starter at 60-65F , is this routine be the same or what you suggest?

all thanks to you.

« Last Edit: October 24, 2020, 01:38:42 AM by Bogy »

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: How I make my NP dough
« Reply #764 on: October 26, 2020, 07:51:35 AM »
How you do it is less important than that you do it the same way every time. That's the only to get consistent, predictable results.

I typically feed 1/day and keep it at 75-77F. If I'm not going to use it for a while, I put it in the fridge. It takes a couple days of feedings after taking it out fo the fridge to get it back to full activity.
"We make great pizza, with sourdough when we can, baker's yeast when we must, but always great pizza."  
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Offline 02ebz06

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Re: How I make my NP dough
« Reply #765 on: October 26, 2020, 12:31:16 PM »
How you do it is less important than that you do it the same way every time. That's the only to get consistent, predictable results.

I typically feed 1/day and keep it at 75-77F. If I'm not going to use it for a while, I put it in the fridge. It takes a couple days of feedings after taking it out fo the fridge to get it back to full activity.

Craig, do you find feeding the RT starter once a day any different than twice a day?
Everything I've read says twice a day at RT, and once a week if it is in fridge.
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Offline DoouBall

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Re: How I make my NP dough
« Reply #766 on: October 26, 2020, 12:38:59 PM »
How you do it is less important than that you do it the same way every time. That's the only to get consistent, predictable results.

I typically feed 1/day and keep it at 75-77F. If I'm not going to use it for a while, I put it in the fridge. It takes a couple days of feedings after taking it out fo the fridge to get it back to full activity.

I want to second Craig's excellent recommendation. A lot of sourdough bread guys feed twice a day, but I found it unnecessary. Once a day at the same time and with the same feeding ratio makes the sourdough very strong in just 2-3 days. Craig, what ratio do you use for feeding at once per day? I'm usually at 1:4:4 in colder RT or 1:8:8 at warm/hot RT.
Alex

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Offline TXCraig1

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Re: How I make my NP dough
« Reply #767 on: October 26, 2020, 01:07:34 PM »
I can't even remember how many years it's been since I fed 2x/day, and I've gone as long as 6 months in the fridge with no ill effect and still had quick recovery times of two days tops.

My feeding is a bit different than most. It's kind of a semi wash. I use a quart mason jar, and it has about 1 cup in it. To feed, I fill about 3/4 with water, so about 2 cups. I mix it all up then dump some out so that there is enough water that after I feed, I end up with about a cup. I keep it a thick-batter consistency.
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Offline DoouBall

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Re: How I make my NP dough
« Reply #768 on: October 26, 2020, 04:25:52 PM »
I might try this because my jar is getting crusty.
Alex

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Offline gdepozsgay

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Re: How I make my NP dough
« Reply #769 on: October 26, 2020, 05:05:29 PM »
Can this dough be frozen for later use? If yes, at what stage of the process.
George

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Offline Bogy

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Re: How I make my NP dough
« Reply #770 on: October 26, 2020, 05:51:35 PM »
How you do it is less important than that you do it the same way every time. That's the only to get consistent, predictable results.

I typically feed 1/day and keep it at 75-77F. If I'm not going to use it for a while, I put it in the fridge. It takes a couple days of feedings after taking it out fo the fridge to get it back to full activity.

Thanks Craig

Offline Bogy

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Re: How I make my NP dough
« Reply #771 on: October 26, 2020, 06:00:02 PM »
I want to second Craig's excellent recommendation. A lot of sourdough bread guys feed twice a day, but I found it unnecessary. Once a day at the same time and with the same feeding ratio makes the sourdough very strong in just 2-3 days. Craig, what ratio do you use for feeding at once per day? I'm usually at 1:4:4 in colder RT or 1:8:8 at warm/hot RT.

Hi DoouBall, according to your method
If i keep my starter at 60-65F as colder RT, i need  1:4:4 once a day ... that's right?!

So if i do that daily, is the starter be active when i feed it that i can use it direct as a levain to my dough or need building a new levain?!

for more explanation : i don't want build a levain , i want to use the active mother starter (when feeding it again) direct to  the dough, so (24hrs 1:4:4 at 60-65f) feeding routine can achieve that or not?!
« Last Edit: October 26, 2020, 10:39:43 PM by Bogy »

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: How I make my NP dough
« Reply #772 on: October 26, 2020, 06:17:58 PM »
Can this dough be frozen for later use? If yes, at what stage of the process.

Maybe, but I kind of doubt it would work well.
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Offline ebxsxf00

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Re: How I make my NP dough
« Reply #773 on: November 18, 2020, 10:40:53 AM »
I have a standard starter I use for bread baking. What percentages do you use for your final refresh of starter ? For bread, I use 100% flour, 65% water, 50% starter - sit for 4 hours. Would this work for pizza ? Looks like you use a more liquid starter like 100% water. What percent starter ?

Offline DoouBall

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Re: How I make my NP dough
« Reply #774 on: November 18, 2020, 11:55:32 AM »
Hi DoouBall, according to your method
If i keep my starter at 60-65F as colder RT, i need  1:4:4 once a day ... that's right?!

So if i do that daily, is the starter be active when i feed it that i can use it direct as a levain to my dough or need building a new levain?!

for more explanation : i don't want build a levain , i want to use the active mother starter (when feeding it again) direct to  the dough, so (24hrs 1:4:4 at 60-65f) feeding routine can achieve that or not?!

You can use the starter directly in your dough as long as it has at least doubled within the last 4-12 hours and has not collapsed. No need to build a separate levain for pizza because we're using relatively small amounts of starter for the pizza. As far as the feeding ratio - this is going to be unique to your starter and your temperatures. You can adjust the feeding ratios from 1:1:1 to 1:10:10 so that your starter doubles or triples in the 6-12 hour timeframe. In the summer, I'll use 1:4:4 or even 1:10:10 if I need to slow it down even more. In the winter, I take it down to 1:2:2 or even 1:1:1 because it's more sluggish at lower temps. You can change the ratio also based on when you need it to be ready - for example, if you're feeding the starter in the mornign and you want it ready in 4-6 hours, use 1:2:2 but if you want to make dough at the end of the day use 1:4:4 or whatever ratio you need for it to mature after 12 hours.
« Last Edit: November 18, 2020, 11:57:10 AM by DoouBall »
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Offline Bogy

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Re: How I make my NP dough
« Reply #775 on: November 19, 2020, 12:32:36 AM »
You can use the starter directly in your dough as long as it has at least doubled within the last 4-12 hours and has not collapsed. No need to build a separate levain for pizza because we're using relatively small amounts of starter for the pizza. As far as the feeding ratio - this is going to be unique to your starter and your temperatures. You can adjust the feeding ratios from 1:1:1 to 1:10:10 so that your starter doubles or triples in the 6-12 hour timeframe. In the summer, I'll use 1:4:4 or even 1:10:10 if I need to slow it down even more. In the winter, I take it down to 1:2:2 or even 1:1:1 because it's more sluggish at lower temps. You can change the ratio also based on when you need it to be ready - for example, if you're feeding the starter in the mornign and you want it ready in 4-6 hours, use 1:2:2 but if you want to make dough at the end of the day use 1:4:4 or whatever ratio you need for it to mature after 12 hours.

Thank you  :)

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: How I make my NP dough
« Reply #776 on: November 19, 2020, 08:05:57 AM »
I have a standard starter I use for bread baking. What percentages do you use for your final refresh of starter ? For bread, I use 100% flour, 65% water, 50% starter - sit for 4 hours. Would this work for pizza ? Looks like you use a more liquid starter like 100% water. What percent starter ?

I use mine at ~100% HR. At the small quantities I use, I doubt they HR makes much, if any, difference.
"We make great pizza, with sourdough when we can, baker's yeast when we must, but always great pizza."  
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Offline levity03

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Re: How I make my NP dough
« Reply #777 on: December 02, 2020, 04:00:12 PM »
Hey Craig -- Just following up on my previous query regarding the fragility of the dough when stretching. I had at it again but haven't had time to post. I tried in balls for ~12 hours and it was still pretty similar, hard to work with. Seems the gluten development is just not as strong as I find with ADY. I admittedly had a bit of trouble keeping a steady temp in the bulk -- started too cold, around 61F but warmed up from there - I would say the avg was around 65F when all said and done, before I balled and started to warm up further (high 60s, low 70s) before launch.

My starter is quite strong when I mix, so perhaps it's my method. Would an increase in mix time help? Perhaps I'm not balling tight enough...? I realize it's hard for you to say without seeing but anything else you can think of? Pics below start with the end of bulk, then dough ball activity before launch (looks quite active), then the finished product.

I am thinking of adding a bit of ADY the next time so that it's not such a struggle, though I know I may get shunned for that around these parts!

Offline Icelandr

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Re: How I make my NP dough
« Reply #778 on: December 02, 2020, 04:28:36 PM »
Out of curiosity, how long have you had your starter? I only ask because I too, am new to sourdough and in the early days had a ton of issues that seem to have resolved themselves, not through a stroke of genius on my part but a maturing of the starter (apparently). It has been about 5 months now and I no longer mutter curses when using it, in fact, in retrospect I am glad I tried and persevered, I like the results . . . . .now.
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Offline levity03

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Re: How I make my NP dough
« Reply #779 on: December 02, 2020, 04:32:05 PM »
For about a year or so. I keep it in the fridge and feed it about once a week or so if I'm not using it. Before I use it for bread or pizza, I feed 3x in 12 hr intervals. Even after the first feeding, it's pretty damn active - growing 2x+.

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