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### Author Topic: Where are you dough ?  (Read 33055 times)

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#### shuboyje

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##### Re: Where are you dough ?
« Reply #40 on: February 22, 2013, 01:44:14 PM »
7.7 oz is about 220 grams.  A little on the low end for 12" but certainly within normal.  12 oz would be off the charts high.
-Jeff

#### Chicago Bob

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##### Re: Where are you dough ?
« Reply #41 on: February 22, 2013, 02:38:48 PM »
7.7 oz is about 220 grams.  A little on the low end for 12" but certainly within normal.  12 oz would be off the charts high.
Sorry, I was thinking of something else.
Here is a generic recipe I just plugged into the calculator....it is for an .08 TF...edit:(sorry link won't work, got to figure out how to do that..it wouldn't save what I had plugged in there)   Anyway the total was 9oz. @ 62% hyd.

Also, Jeff what do you think of Morgans dough here...http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,23178.msg238586.html#msg238586

OK, I figured out how to do it...sorta I think.

 Flour (100%):Water (62%):IDY (2%):Salt (2%):Oil (2%):Total (168%): 152.68 g  |  5.39 oz | 0.34 lbs94.66 g  |  3.34 oz | 0.21 lbs3.05 g | 0.11 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.01 tsp | 0.34 tbsp3.05 g | 0.11 oz | 0.01 lbs | 0.64 tsp | 0.21 tbsp3.05 g | 0.11 oz | 0.01 lbs | 0.68 tsp | 0.23 tbsp256.5 g | 9.05 oz | 0.57 lbs | TF = 0.08

And here is what it looks like if you go with Morgan's 11.5 pizza size and a .1 TF

 Flour (100%):Water (62%):IDY (2%):Salt (2%):Oil (2%):Total (168%): 175.28 g  |  6.18 oz | 0.39 lbs108.67 g  |  3.83 oz | 0.24 lbs3.51 g | 0.12 oz | 0.01 lbs | 1.16 tsp | 0.39 tbsp3.51 g | 0.12 oz | 0.01 lbs | 0.73 tsp | 0.24 tbsp3.51 g | 0.12 oz | 0.01 lbs | 0.78 tsp | 0.26 tbsp294.47 g | 10.39 oz | 0.65 lbs | TF = 0.1
« Last Edit: February 22, 2013, 03:44:01 PM by Chicago Bob »
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#### Morgan

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##### Re: Where are you dough ?
« Reply #42 on: February 22, 2013, 03:47:02 PM »
Bob, i made this last dough little smaller than the last 3 and it came out very nicely. I might not left enough dough for the rim before.
Launched stonetemp at 370c, baking time around 05:00 minutes. This really was great tasting pie!

« Last Edit: February 22, 2013, 03:48:35 PM by Morgan »

#### Chicago Bob

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##### Re: Where are you dough ?
« Reply #43 on: February 22, 2013, 03:56:01 PM »
Looking good there Morgan...cornice is coming right along.
Thanks for the crumb pics...they help a lot. Were are you at on hydration on that pizza?
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#### Morgan

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##### Re: Where are you dough ?
« Reply #44 on: February 22, 2013, 04:04:07 PM »
Looking good there Morgan...cornice is coming right along.
Thanks for the crumb pics...they help a lot. Were are you at on hydration on that pizza?

Hydration 63%, but i use flour when i stretch the dough so i really cant say what is the hydration when i launch the pie.
Maybe i should try even higher hydration ? I will make new patch tomorrow, i got some new flour which i never used before.

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#### Chicago Bob

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##### Re: Where are you dough ?
« Reply #45 on: February 22, 2013, 04:17:36 PM »
Hydration 63%, but i use flour when i stretch the dough so i really cant say what is the hydration when i launch the pie.
Maybe i should try even higher hydration ? I will make new patch tomorrow, i got some new flour which i never used before.
OK...are you working off the recipe Scott123 gave you? If so, how is the flavor...do you think it would still be good while dialing the oil back a little or entirely? In exchange you could bump salt up 1% maybe. What type of oil are you using Morgan?

Flour (100%):
Water (63%):
Salt (1.75%):
Oil (2%):
Sugar (1%):
Total (168.25%):
131.31 g  |  4.63 oz | 0.29 lbs
82.73 g  |  2.92 oz | 0.18 lbs
0.66 g | 0.02 oz | 0 lbs | 0.17 tsp | 0.06 tbsp
2.3 g | 0.08 oz | 0.01 lbs | 0.41 tsp | 0.14 tbsp
2.63 g | 0.09 oz | 0.01 lbs | 0.58 tsp | 0.19 tbsp
1.31 g | 0.05 oz | 0 lbs | 0.33 tsp | 0.11 tbsp
220.93 g | 7.79 oz | 0.49 lbs | TF = 0.09
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#### Morgan

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##### Re: Where are you dough ?
« Reply #46 on: February 22, 2013, 04:33:42 PM »
OK...are you working off the recipe Scott123 gave you? If so, how is the flavor...do you think it would still be good while dialing the oil back a little or entirely? In exchange you could bump salt up 1% maybe. What type of oil are you using Morgan?

Flour (100%):
Water (63%):
Salt (1.75%):
Oil (2%):
Sugar (1%):
Total (168.25%):
131.31 g  |  4.63 oz | 0.29 lbs
82.73 g  |  2.92 oz | 0.18 lbs
0.66 g | 0.02 oz | 0 lbs | 0.17 tsp | 0.06 tbsp
2.3 g | 0.08 oz | 0.01 lbs | 0.41 tsp | 0.14 tbsp
2.63 g | 0.09 oz | 0.01 lbs | 0.58 tsp | 0.19 tbsp
1.31 g | 0.05 oz | 0 lbs | 0.33 tsp | 0.11 tbsp
220.93 g | 7.79 oz | 0.49 lbs | TF = 0.09

Yes this was just my own experiment. I added oil and sugar because i used tipo 00 that isn't malted so i was hoping better browning with this setup.
Scott123 dough recipe was made for Hiivaleipäjauho, but maybe it would also work with this tipo 00.

Just testing and experimenting, maybe adding some fat to my belly on the side
So you are thinking i should try to bump the salt 2.75% and cutting the oil off ? I use olive oil, usually it is extra virgin.

I might go back and just re-make the Scott123 suggested formula with this new flour.
« Last Edit: February 22, 2013, 04:39:15 PM by Morgan »

#### Chicago Bob

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##### Re: Where are you dough ?
« Reply #47 on: February 22, 2013, 04:40:52 PM »
I understand...I think to make that crust you talk about in your 1st. post though...you gonna need more heat. Tyr a 50/50 with those 2 flours, no oil and a big hyd number and double the yeast...5 or 6 hours on the counter with some stretch an folds then a few hrs balled on counter....good luck!!
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#### Morgan

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##### Re: Where are you dough ?
« Reply #48 on: February 22, 2013, 05:05:15 PM »
I understand...I think to make that crust you talk about in your 1st. post though...you gonna need more heat. Tyr a 50/50 with those 2 flours, no oil and a big hyd number and double the yeast...5 or 6 hours on the counter with some stretch an folds then a few hrs balled on counter....good luck!!

Stone temperature is not a problem, but the heat from top. I can sure try to launch when stone is +400c, but it will bake the bottom fast.

Which 2 flours are you talking about ? Tipo 00 and Hiivaleipäjauho or something else ?

#### Chicago Bob

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##### Re: Where are you dough ?
« Reply #49 on: February 22, 2013, 05:16:45 PM »
Stone temperature is not a problem, but the heat from top. I can sure try to launch when stone is +400c, but it will bake the bottom fast.

Which 2 flours are you talking about ? Tipo 00 and Hiivaleipäjauho or something else ?
Yes, those 2. What about maybe 335 c?
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#### Morgan

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##### Re: Where are you dough ?
« Reply #50 on: February 22, 2013, 05:24:15 PM »
Yes, those 2. What about maybe 335 c?

OK! Why not, i will test it some day 335c. The basic launch temp has been around 350-380c for me.

Bob, did you have a similar countertop oven to mine ?

#### Chicago Bob

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##### Re: Where are you dough ?
« Reply #51 on: February 22, 2013, 05:35:17 PM »
OK! Why not, i will test it some day 335c. The basic launch temp has been around 350-380c for me.

Bob, did you have a similar countertop oven to mine ?
Actually, about 15 min ago I started a pretty lame search to see what you were cooking in and saw a lot of talk about soapstone or sumthin an bailed...    sorry man.

I do have a Lil Deni countertop that I recently talked about reaching 1050 degrees with...
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#### Morgan

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##### Re: Where are you dough ?
« Reply #52 on: February 22, 2013, 05:38:43 PM »
Bob, i tought that you know what gear im using. http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,23257.0.html

I used basic domestic oven just a while ago, but now getting back to Pronto.
« Last Edit: February 22, 2013, 05:44:04 PM by Morgan »

#### Chicago Bob

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##### Re: Where are you dough ?
« Reply #53 on: February 22, 2013, 06:03:13 PM »
Bob, i tought that you know what gear im using. http://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php/topic,23257.0.html

I used basic domestic oven just a while ago, but now getting back to Pronto.
Nope...I seemed to have missed that thread.
Everything is now coming into Crystal Blue Persuasion...

My Lil Deni is oh so similar to your get up and picking up where that thread left off at( your asking sub if you should pull the bottom heater and install it in the lid)...yes! I believe that is the only way to get one of these to act right and my last question to sub(on a different thread obviously) was where I can by a second heating element for me to install in the lid. Mine does not have the lower element to scavenge.
These ovens use firebrick for their hearth material and that is why the bottom burns at temps over around 800 degrees.
Thanks for bringing me up to speed on your counter top oven Morgan....now I know what we deal'in with bro.

Bob
« Last Edit: March 13, 2013, 12:14:31 PM by Steve »
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#### Morgan

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##### Re: Where are you dough ?
« Reply #54 on: February 23, 2013, 03:22:09 AM »
Thats OK Bob Feel free to add some spices to the Pronto thread

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#### Morgan

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##### Re: Where are you dough ?
« Reply #55 on: February 24, 2013, 12:35:16 PM »
Just made first pie out of the new flours i ordered. Toppings ham, tuna, pepperoni and pineapple. I really think that the dough i made before was better than this one, this isn't even browning so nicely. Have to test tomorrow again, i allways make a patch of 4 balls.

I used this Scott123 suggested formula x4.

Flour (100%):
Water (63%):
Salt (1.75%):
Oil (2%):
Sugar (1%):
Total (168.25%):
131.31 g  |  4.63 oz | 0.29 lbs
82.73 g  |  2.92 oz | 0.18 lbs
0.66 g | 0.02 oz | 0 lbs | 0.17 tsp | 0.06 tbsp
2.3 g | 0.08 oz | 0.01 lbs | 0.41 tsp | 0.14 tbsp
2.63 g | 0.09 oz | 0.01 lbs | 0.58 tsp | 0.19 tbsp
1.31 g | 0.05 oz | 0 lbs | 0.33 tsp | 0.11 tbsp
220.93 g | 7.79 oz | 0.49 lbs | TF = 0.09
« Last Edit: February 26, 2013, 03:31:45 AM by Morgan »

#### scott123

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##### Re: Where are you dough ?
« Reply #56 on: February 25, 2013, 04:02:00 AM »
Morgan, I'm pretty sure all your flours are unmalted. Unless you want to start looking for diastatic malt powder (are there any homebrewers in Finland?), you won't get good browning/good texture unless you ferment the dough for at least 3 days, with an appropriate level of yeast for the dough to only double before baking.

Out of the flours you've used, what's the highest protein level 00 flour?  While I was discouraging you from using the 00 flour earlier, considering what you have at your disposal, I think pizzeria 00 is the best you can get- as long as it's high enough protein.  It's definitely better than hiivaleipäjauho or type 0, which are both too coarsely milled for our purposes.

#### Morgan

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##### Re: Where are you dough ?
« Reply #57 on: February 25, 2013, 06:04:08 AM »
Morgan, I'm pretty sure all your flours are unmalted. Unless you want to start looking for diastatic malt powder (are there any homebrewers in Finland?), you won't get good browning/good texture unless you ferment the dough for at least 3 days, with an appropriate level of yeast for the dough to only double before baking.

Out of the flours you've used, what's the highest protein level 00 flour?  While I was discouraging you from using the 00 flour earlier, considering what you have at your disposal, I think pizzeria 00 is the best you can get- as long as it's high enough protein.  It's definitely better than hiivaleipäjauho or type 0, which are both too coarsely milled for our purposes.

There might be some smaller brewing companies and hobbiest for sure. This new "pizza flour 0" from the last patch has 11.5gr protein, Dallari farina 00 which i also have has 10.2gr protein per 100gr.

Scott, where should i go from here ? I send email to Italy about the Antico Molino Caputo, but did not get any response yet.

Does it have to be malt powder ? I found Barley Malt Extract, but not sure will i found powder. If this extract is OK i will go and get it as fast i can!

Barley Malt Extract 400g

mallasuute Barley malt extract is made of Finnish barley. This is a product with a sweet and mild taste, a golden brown colour and a syrup-like texture.

You can both eat it as such and use it in baking in order to get better flavour and volume and appetizing crust. The dosage in dough is usually 0,5- 1 dl per 1 liter liquid.

If you need a stomach friendly constipation help you can try malt extract.

It is suitable for children as well. The dosage for adults is 1 tablespoonful of malt extract 3-4 times per day, for children 1 teaspoonful of malt extract 3-4 times per day and for babies 1 teaspoonful of malt extract twice a day added into breast milk or baby formula. The prepared mixture is to be used immediately. Barley malt extract 400g is available in the Finnish pharmacies.

« Last Edit: February 25, 2013, 06:25:45 AM by Morgan »

#### Morgan

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• Location: Finland
##### Re: Where are you dough ?
« Reply #58 on: February 26, 2013, 03:23:44 AM »
This Pizza 0 flour just isn't working when used alone, maybe better if combined to other flours or more sugar.

I made this last patch using only Pizza 0 flours. Cornice is way to chewy! I have to ask, by cornice you do mean the outer rim ?

I used this Scott123 suggested dough x4.

Flour (100%):
Water (63%):
Salt (1.75%):
Oil (2%):
Sugar (1%):
Total (168.25%):
131.31 g  |  4.63 oz | 0.29 lbs
82.73 g  |  2.92 oz | 0.18 lbs
0.66 g | 0.02 oz | 0 lbs | 0.17 tsp | 0.06 tbsp
2.3 g | 0.08 oz | 0.01 lbs | 0.41 tsp | 0.14 tbsp
2.63 g | 0.09 oz | 0.01 lbs | 0.58 tsp | 0.19 tbsp
1.31 g | 0.05 oz | 0 lbs | 0.33 tsp | 0.11 tbsp
220.93 g | 7.79 oz | 0.49 lbs | TF = 0.09
« Last Edit: February 26, 2013, 03:28:33 AM by Morgan »

#### scott123

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##### Re: Where are you dough ?
« Reply #59 on: February 26, 2013, 05:29:27 AM »
Cornice = rim

Unmalted flour has a tendency to make for tough crusts, because it lacks the tenderizing aspects of the enzymes from the malt.

I don't think the malt you have listed will work.  There's two kinds of malt, diastatic and non diastatic.  Non diastatic malt is just another form of sugar.  The diastatic malt is what helps break down the compounds in the dough, which in turn, gives you better browning and a better texture with longer bakes.

Unless you can confirm this malt is diastatic/has enzyme activity, I would look elsewhere. Like I said, home brewing stores might carry it.

Otherwise, you should think about developing a 4 day dough, with perhaps more oil.

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