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Author Topic: Problem With Bread Flour with Beddia Recipe?  (Read 965 times)

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Offline TerriblePizza

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Problem With Bread Flour with Beddia Recipe?
« on: January 01, 2019, 03:11:24 PM »
Total Newb here.

I’m from Philadelphia so I gravitated to Beddia’s recipe for dough in the Pizza Camp book. It called for all purpose or bread flour. My local store had King Arthur Bread flour so I tried that first. I was exact with his measurements and mixed by hand. I could not get a good consistency and the flour seemed “stringy” and would not come together as one dough ball. It was as if it were too dry?

I tried 4 times and finally switched to all purpose flour and was able to get a proper dough ball on the first mix. Did I do something wrong?

Thanks all!

Offline norcoscia

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Re: Problem With Bread Flour with Beddia Recipe?
« Reply #1 on: January 01, 2019, 03:39:20 PM »
Maybe I'm remembering the wrong book but I thought that his book called for some pretty high hydrations so (unless I'm remembering wrong) maybe you measured wrong... I can check my book if you would like.
Norm
Baker's Pride GP-61 NG and PizzaParty Ardore (with saputo tiles) LP
Focus is NY style but do others too
Preferred Flour (for NY pies) is All Trumps BB
Preferred temperature for NY is 550F, for NP 900+F
Preferred type of yeast IDY

Offline TerriblePizza

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Re: Problem With Bread Flour with Beddia Recipe?
« Reply #2 on: January 01, 2019, 05:18:07 PM »
All help is appreciated! 

I am certain of my measurements. I tried four different times.

Here are the ingredients:

1 1/2 cup cool water (355g)
2 teaspoons sugar
1/2 teaspoon active dry yeast
1 tablespoon ex virg olive oil
3 1/2 cups all purpose or bread flour (500g)
1 tablespoon + 1/2 teaspoon fine sea salt

Offline norcoscia

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Re: Problem With Bread Flour with Beddia Recipe?
« Reply #3 on: January 01, 2019, 05:46:54 PM »
So, according to my calculations (and it is hard to work backwards with a mix of volume and weight) I believe it comes out to be this. Two things jump out - lots of water, way more than you would see in 95% of the pies here and too much salt (average is 2-3%). If this is the book, what page is that on?

If that is the recipe, no way it could be dry, not at 70%...

PS. - the TF for that would be about .0789 with is about right for a NY style on the thinner side.

PPS. If you use all weight measures it is easer to see what you are doing and make tweaks - I have an online calculator at www.mypizzamaster.com that you can use!

GramsOunces
Flour  (100%)
500.77
17.66
Water (71%)
355.55
12.54
Yeast (0.465%) ADY
2.33
0.08
Salt (3.93%)
19.68
0.69
Oil (2.72%)
13.62
0.48
Sugar (1.61%)
8.06
0.28
« Last Edit: January 01, 2019, 05:57:25 PM by norcoscia »
Norm
Baker's Pride GP-61 NG and PizzaParty Ardore (with saputo tiles) LP
Focus is NY style but do others too
Preferred Flour (for NY pies) is All Trumps BB
Preferred temperature for NY is 550F, for NP 900+F
Preferred type of yeast IDY

Offline TerriblePizza

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Re: Problem With Bread Flour with Beddia Recipe?
« Reply #4 on: January 01, 2019, 06:19:46 PM »
First, thank you so much for your time.

I’m not home at the moment but will check which page it is. He only has one recipe for dough in the book. I am almost certain my numbers are right.

I liked the dough, but both my wife and I said it was too salty. I have read that on this forum from other members as well.

My difficulty was only with the bread flour. The all purpose mixed fine and tasted pretty good.

Thanks again, I will confirm everything when I get home. Happy New Year!

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Offline norcoscia

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Re: Problem With Bread Flour with Beddia Recipe?
« Reply #5 on: January 01, 2019, 06:31:52 PM »
Happy New Year to you too - no worries or rush, I'm here everyday  :)

PS. Flour can take some time to fully absorb the water so I can suggest a workflow that might help (with any flour) if you are interested...
Norm
Baker's Pride GP-61 NG and PizzaParty Ardore (with saputo tiles) LP
Focus is NY style but do others too
Preferred Flour (for NY pies) is All Trumps BB
Preferred temperature for NY is 550F, for NP 900+F
Preferred type of yeast IDY

Offline TerriblePizza

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Re: Problem With Bread Flour with Beddia Recipe?
« Reply #6 on: January 01, 2019, 07:43:09 PM »
You’re the man, Norm! 

Yep. Those are the exact measurements. Page 27 of the book.

I used KA Bread flour and could not get a consistent blend. It was stringy. That’s the best way I can describe it.

To be fair, this was my very first time ever mixing dough!  I’m going to try again this week.

Offline norcoscia

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Re: Problem With Bread Flour with Beddia Recipe?
« Reply #7 on: January 02, 2019, 11:13:17 AM »
I really liked reading his book and got some great ideas for toppings from it (and tried them, yum) . But I did not use his dough recipe or workflow since I'm happy with what I make myself and also like to tweak things from time to time to see what happens. Let me know if you would like anything else, happy to help.
Norm
Baker's Pride GP-61 NG and PizzaParty Ardore (with saputo tiles) LP
Focus is NY style but do others too
Preferred Flour (for NY pies) is All Trumps BB
Preferred temperature for NY is 550F, for NP 900+F
Preferred type of yeast IDY

Offline TerriblePizza

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Re: Problem With Bread Flour with Beddia Recipe?
« Reply #8 on: January 02, 2019, 09:15:05 PM »
So this week I plan to cut back on the salt for sure.  I’d like to try bread flour again. Norm, you are saying that should be enough water to yield a nice dough ball?  Any tips if it comes out “stringy” again?

Offline HansB

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Re: Problem With Bread Flour with Beddia Recipe?
« Reply #9 on: January 02, 2019, 09:22:47 PM »
I think it was unusual that you experienced a difference between KAAP AND KABF. I have used them interchangeably when I have run out of one or the other and have not experienced any difference in mixing/texture at all. Maybe give it another go.
« Last Edit: January 03, 2019, 09:08:46 AM by HBolte »
Hans

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Offline norcoscia

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Re: Problem With Bread Flour with Beddia Recipe?
« Reply #10 on: January 03, 2019, 08:55:23 AM »
Are you measuring by weight or volume - are you mixing by hand or machine? If you cut the salt you may need to adjust the yeast amount or fermentation period or the final dough temperature since those items are very interdependent WRT the final dough characteristics. Are you trying to use the process in his book?
Norm
Baker's Pride GP-61 NG and PizzaParty Ardore (with saputo tiles) LP
Focus is NY style but do others too
Preferred Flour (for NY pies) is All Trumps BB
Preferred temperature for NY is 550F, for NP 900+F
Preferred type of yeast IDY

Offline TerriblePizza

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Re: Problem With Bread Flour with Beddia Recipe?
« Reply #11 on: January 04, 2019, 09:47:31 AM »
Thanks all for chiming in. I am measuring by volume for now (just ordered a scale). I am mixing by hand.

I am trying to stick to his recipe pretty strictly until I get a feel for how all the ingredients play with one another.

Offline norcoscia

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Re: Problem With Bread Flour with Beddia Recipe?
« Reply #12 on: January 04, 2019, 10:09:42 AM »
Good video to watch that explains the importance of a scale. BTW, the scale you use for flour and water will not work very well for yeast, salt or sugar (in a home setting) - you need two scales. The good news is a scale for measuring tiny amounts is pretty cheap now compared to 20-30 years ago.

I made pizza w/o a scale for over 30 years but I knew what to look for and made adjustments on the fly. It has been a while since I read his book but I don't remember him discussing finished dough temperature which is very important if you are managing a fermentation schedule.

To be honest - you can get better advice on dough recipes and workflows (both are important) here compared to a book you cannot interact with. We are all here to help. Have fun and ask any questions you may have...


Norm
Baker's Pride GP-61 NG and PizzaParty Ardore (with saputo tiles) LP
Focus is NY style but do others too
Preferred Flour (for NY pies) is All Trumps BB
Preferred temperature for NY is 550F, for NP 900+F
Preferred type of yeast IDY

Offline TerriblePizza

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Re: Problem With Bread Flour with Beddia Recipe?
« Reply #13 on: January 04, 2019, 05:47:42 PM »
Norm!  My man!  I’m a 15 year Vet on a photography forum so I really appreciate you helping a total newb with all of this info!  Cheers!!

Offline norcoscia

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Re: Problem With Bread Flour with Beddia Recipe?
« Reply #14 on: January 04, 2019, 05:51:29 PM »
OK, now we are expecting some photos of your pizza  :pizza: :pizza: :pizza:
Norm
Baker's Pride GP-61 NG and PizzaParty Ardore (with saputo tiles) LP
Focus is NY style but do others too
Preferred Flour (for NY pies) is All Trumps BB
Preferred temperature for NY is 550F, for NP 900+F
Preferred type of yeast IDY

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Offline TerriblePizza

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Re: Problem With Bread Flour with Beddia Recipe?
« Reply #15 on: January 05, 2019, 09:13:06 PM »
Deal!  Wednesday-ish!

Offline mrmafix

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Re: Problem With Bread Flour with Beddia Recipe?
« Reply #16 on: February 20, 2019, 03:12:26 PM »
OK, now we are expecting some photos of your pizza  :pizza: :pizza: :pizza:

Do you still have a handy excel sheet for dough calculations?

Offline ira

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Re: Problem With Bread Flour with Beddia Recipe?
« Reply #17 on: February 20, 2019, 03:17:02 PM »
I made this one which you're welcome to try.

www.curmudgeoncoffee.com/downloads/PizzaCalculator.zip

Ira

Offline pizzainthe6ix

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Re: Problem With Bread Flour with Beddia Recipe?
« Reply #18 on: May 21, 2019, 12:49:57 PM »
I would use an AP flour, not a bread flour for this IMO.  I use KASL or All Trumps for his recipes.  He uses a lot of salt and a lot of water (which could be for his type of flour....you might want to try different levels of hydration)

Offline ChaucerDreamsOfPizza

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Re: Problem With Bread Flour with Beddia Recipe?
« Reply #19 on: Yesterday at 09:53:09 PM »
Hoping to restart the thread in the hopes of asking another Beddia question, and I should preface this by saying I'm a pizza newbie. In Pizza Camp in making the dough he calls for the step of kneading in the salt (after a ~thirty minute pause after mixing yeast, etc. and flour). I knead by hand, and I'm really curious how long I should be kneading for. Seven or so minutes? Is there a feel for the dough I should be looking for? Appreciate any answers!   

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