Lucali; has anyone come close?

[Nathan Bateman]

Praying you visit the forum again soon. You can't drop this bomb and then vanish!

Thanks for the feedback. Definitely means a lot!

Here's my first dough attempt:

- 100% Organic Unbleached Hard Flour (I can't get King Arthur in Canada, so I went with a good local miller).
- 56% water.
- 2.5% salt.
- 0.15% ADY (I mistakenly used a 1:1 conversion to IDY - still worked fine)

- Lightly incorporate everything then cover and rest for 30 mins. to an hour.
- Return and begin to slap and fold, or knead, until smooth.
- Bulk ferment at 20-22 deg. C for 3 hours.
- Divide and then cold ferment in the fridge for 24 hours. You won't see much activity during this time
- Remove from the fridge and rest at 20-22 deg. C for 4-6 hours. You'll see your dough balls begin to relax and increase a bit in size.

I'm still tinkering with my Ooni Koda 16's temperature dial... hope to have more pictures as I refine this recipe.

Regards,

NB

[machismo]

Thanks for the feedback. Definitely means a lot!

Here's my first dough attempt:

- 100% Organic Unbleached Hard Flour (I can't get King Arthur in Canada, so I went with a good local miller).
- 56% water.
- 2.5% salt.
- 0.15% ADY (I mistakenly used a 1:1 conversion to IDY - still worked fine)

- Lightly incorporate everything then cover and rest for 30 mins. to an hour.
- Return and begin to slap and fold, or knead, until smooth.
- Bulk ferment at 20-22 deg. C for 3 hours.
- Divide and then cold ferment in the fridge for 24 hours. You won't see much activity during this time
- Remove from the fridge and rest at 20-22 deg. C for 4-6 hours. You'll see your dough balls begin to relax and increase a bit in size.

I'm still tinkering with my Ooni Koda 16's temperature dial... hope to have more pictures as I refine this recipe.

Regards,

NB

what was the cook time and temp in your koda 16 ? pie looks excellent btw.

[Nathan Bateman]

what was the cook time and temp in your koda 16 ? pie looks excellent btw.

Thank you very much for the feedback - it definitely means a lot! I should also note that that was my first ever pizza cooked in the Koda.

It's really hard to say due to the Ooni Koda's hot spots as well as the size of pizza I'm making. I always preheat the oven at maximum temperature for around 30-45 minutes so the centre of the stone hits around 860 deg. F and the rear left corner hits around 950 deg. F. Before I put the pizza in, I reduce the temperature dial to its near lowest setting and am able to achieve a 2.5-3 minute bake.

The biggest drawback I'm finding is that at 16" diameter I'm pushing the oven to the absolute limit, which means I can't avoid the hottest corner and direct flame. With a 2.5-3 minute bake time I get a very well developed cracker-like crust, but the bottom just isn't there yet. I'm really hoping I can find the sweetspot with this oven, or else I'll have to invest in something else....

Sorry this wasn't much help.

Regards,

NB

[Nathan Bateman]

Hello all,

Here's another one of my pies cooked over the Thanksgiving long weekend. Always adjusting the dough recipe, ingredient suppliers and the Koda 16 temperature dial. Still searching for the perfect marg...

NB

[RHawthorne]

Thank you very much for the feedback - it definitely means a lot! I should also note that that was my first ever pizza cooked in the Koda.

It's really hard to say due to the Ooni Koda's hot spots as well as the size of pizza I'm making. I always preheat the oven at maximum temperature for around 30-45 minutes so the centre of the stone hits around 860 deg. F and the rear left corner hits around 950 deg. F. Before I put the pizza in, I reduce the temperature dial to its near lowest setting and am able to achieve a 2.5-3 minute bake.

The biggest drawback I'm finding is that at 16" diameter I'm pushing the oven to the absolute limit, which means I can't avoid the hottest corner and direct flame. With a 2.5-3 minute bake time I get a very well developed cracker-like crust, but the bottom just isn't there yet. I'm really hoping I can find the sweetspot with this oven, or else I'll have to invest in something else....

Sorry this wasn't much help.

Regards,

NB

I have an Ooni Pro, and I have pretty much the same problem. The company claims that it can cook a 16" pizza (which is the whole reason I bought it, and not one of the smaller, less expensive models), but I think they frankly should be sued for false advertisement. I can't cook anything bigger than a 12" in it without burning the crap out of the outer edge, undoubtedly because the fuel chamber is just too close to the baking surface. And the baking stones also don't ever give me a good crisp, no matter how long I let it preheat. I started using my baking steel in it a couple of months ago, and that has helped a lot. But overall, I'm kind of wishing that I had just spent less money on a smaller model, or just got one from a different company.

[machismo]

Hello all,

Here's another one of my pies cooked over the Thanksgiving long weekend. Always adjusting the dough recipe, ingredient suppliers and the Koda 16 temperature dial. Still searching for the perfect marg...

NB

I don't have koda 16, but love watching people cook in it. Have you tried the low temp hack by turning the koda dial all the way back to as if you are turning it off. Here is a youtube link, hope that helps. keep posting pics, they look great, specially the top edges look closest to Lucali from what I have seen.

[Nathan Bateman]

I don't have koda 16, but love watching people cook in it. Have you tried the low temp hack by turning the koda dial all the way back to as if you are turning it off. Here is a youtube link, hope that helps. keep posting pics, they look great, specially the top edges look closest to Lucali from what I have seen.

Thanks a lot for the link! I'll definitely give it a try over the weekend and post photos of the results - weather permitted of course.

I probably have to sacrifice matching the Lucali cook time and just focus on optimizing the side and top heat. Looking back on the few times I ate at Lucali, as well as all the video references, there really doesn't seem to be much top heat provided by his oven. The cheeses are just beyond their optimal melting point giving a very creamy texture with almost no blistering - definitely not soupy. It's quite annoying that the lowest temperature setting on the Koda still blisters everything, as shown on my photos... This definitely needs more work.

Regards,

NB

[Komarzer]

Your pie from the picture above looks very good! I have a Koda 16 too, but I just began my journey. I'm gonna follow your experiments, I might be interested in trying NY pies after Neapolitan.

The low flame trick might me useful in your case I think, you should give it a try.

[woodfiredandrew]

my take
white meat sauce pizza
sausage pepperoni pizza

[Justa]

Hi all - been following this thread for a while. Great info here. Here's my attempt:

[PizzaEater101]

Well, this time isn’t a pizza but I tried to do a Lucali calzone. 

Does this look anything like Mark’s calzone?

[NewtoQ]

Anyone try the recipe he gave Kelly and Ryan?Comes out to about the following:

Water - 60%
Yeast - .54%
EVOO - 1.26%
Sea Salt - 1.46%

Thanks all and great looking pies!!!

[piesofsatan]

Well, this time isn’t a pizza but I tried to do a Lucali calzone. 

Does this look anything like Mark’s calzone?

Really does!! I need to make a calzone soon, damn.

[corkd]

Hello all,

Here's another one of my pies cooked over the Thanksgiving long weekend. Always adjusting the dough recipe, ingredient suppliers and the Koda 16 temperature dial. Still searching for the perfect marg...

NB

Looks great! Looks like I spy Radikon!! 

[Nathan Bateman]

Some birthday pizzas. Paired with some Versante Nord and some Lézer *not pictured*

[Glutenboy]

I don't have koda 16, but love watching people cook in it. Have you tried the low temp hack by turning the koda dial all the way back to as if you are turning it off. Here is a youtube link, hope that helps. keep posting pics, they look great, specially the top edges look closest to Lucali from what I have seen.

I happened to see an interesting Koda 16 hack on facebook.   A thin piece of steel, I would assume 31-32 inches long by 2 inches wide bent in the middle at a right angle to serve as a full-length flame guard.  It stands up by itself, and the poster said this solved his hot-spot, sides-cook-before-the-bottom's-done problem.  It sounds like a cool accessory to keep on hand if you have a Koda 16.

[scott r]

Anyone try the recipe he gave Kelly and Ryan?Comes out to about the following:

Water - 60%
Yeast - .54%
EVOO - 1.26%
Sea Salt - 1.46%

I had Lucali on Sunday and it was fantastic.   I definitely think its very possible that this is his actual dough recipe.  It seemed like a very simple direct dough made with all trumps and no biga/poolish/wild yeast.  It wasnt overly soft (not lots of oil) and the crust did not have a lot of salt in it. I detected no sugar.  The 60 percentage hydration seems about right, it could have even been slightly lower like 58, but 60 is probable.  If you want to copy this crust I think this is the recipe to use.

What I noticed most about the pizza is that the crust is not a big deal, but the sauce and cheese is really fantastic, and special in the NY scene. It was my favorite cheese after trying 4 pizzerias that day and many more a week earlier.  He does not hide behind salt to get his flavor, and overall the pizza was less salty than just about all others I tried.  The cheese was rich and milky and the sauce was not overly cooked (I would say barely) and had a fresh full flavor.   I loved this pizza.

[vincentoc13]

Thanks a lot for the link! I'll definitely give it a try over the weekend and post photos of the results - weather permitted of course.

I probably have to sacrifice matching the Lucali cook time and just focus on optimizing the side and top heat. Looking back on the few times I ate at Lucali, as well as all the video references, there really doesn't seem to be much top heat provided by his oven. The cheeses are just beyond their optimal melting point giving a very creamy texture with almost no blistering - definitely not soupy. It's quite annoying that the lowest temperature setting on the Koda still blisters everything, as shown on my photos... This definitely needs more work.

Regards,

NB

Here's a few pies NY pies I did on the Ooni 16, not Lucali, but just wanted to give example, thanks.

[ghost]

He shared a recipe with a vlogger... here's a youtube link to the time where his text message including recipe is on the screen:

https://youtu.be/0t-TxE64HjA?t=131

Seems to be right on with 60% hydration, 0.5% yeast, 1.67% evoo, and 2Tbsp salt for 1587.57g flour.  (Not sure what kind of salt he's using, so I didn't convert).  My guess would be kosher or sea salt.

[jsaras]

After all that, it’s just an undersalted Lehmann dough.