A D V E R T I S E M E N T


Author Topic: How to properly bake foccacia and pizza romana in home oven ?  (Read 956 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline fckace

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 71
  • I Love Pizza!
Hello guys,
Same subject that I have post for the NY style, but this time for foccacia and pizza romana. So I read that in should invest in a teglia ferro blu, but here in France it's difficult to find. Would you recommand any link with a delivering in France ?
For my best results on this style of pizza, it's with the pizzastone preheated for 1h at the bottom middle of the oven, baking with rotating heat.
Are they any other ways ?
Should we precook juste with tomato sauce then add the cheese ?
Other tips ?
Thanks.

Offline surgtech2006

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 151
  • Location: New York
  • Make Pizza, not war
Re: How to properly bake foccacia and pizza romana in home oven ?
« Reply #1 on: April 03, 2019, 03:39:42 PM »
Hello guys,
Same subject that I have post for the NY style, but this time for foccacia and pizza romana. So I read that in should invest in a teglia ferro blu, but here in France it's difficult to find. Would you recommand any link with a delivering in France ?
For my best results on this style of pizza, it's with the pizzastone preheated for 1h at the bottom middle of the oven, baking with rotating heat.
Are they any other ways ?
Should we precook juste with tomato sauce then add the cheese ?
Other tips ?
Thanks.

Where in France are you? My sister lives in Senlis 20 min north of Paris) maybe I can arrange for her to bring a pan or 2 back when she visits again.

Jerry

Offline amolapizza

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 293
  • Location: Luxembourg / Spain
  • If pizza is food for the gods, what am I :)
Effeuno P134H (1700W upper element), EGO 500C Thermostat (upper), Biscotto Fornace Saputo, Caputo Pizzeria (Blue Bag), Mutti S. Marzano (DOP) :)

Offline fckace

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 71
  • I Love Pizza!
Re: How to properly bake foccacia and pizza romana in home oven ?
« Reply #3 on: April 04, 2019, 03:38:59 AM »
Where in France are you? My sister lives in Senlis 20 min north of Paris) maybe I can arrange for her to bring a pan or 2 back when she visits again.

Jerry

Hey thanks for the proposition but I live in South-East of France, this is far away from Senlis  ;)


Try https://www.amazon.it/s?k=teglia+ferro+blu&__mk_it_IT=%C3%85M%C3%85%C5%BD%C3%95%C3%91&ref=nb_sb_noss_1
:D

Wow the shipping price are good.  But they don't seems good quality, based on the reviews  ???
« Last Edit: April 04, 2019, 03:42:01 AM by fckace »

Offline amolapizza

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 293
  • Location: Luxembourg / Spain
  • If pizza is food for the gods, what am I :)
Re: How to properly bake foccacia and pizza romana in home oven ?
« Reply #4 on: April 04, 2019, 07:25:51 AM »
I wonder if those aren't people that managed to mess it up...  Never ever let them get wet/humid as they will rust.  Also when burning them in, you only need the smallest amount of oil (seed or maybe corn oil), far less than you'd imagine.  Really just enough to see that they change appearance in shine, if using more oil it will form sticky places..

I bought these myself and haven't had any problems with them: https://www.amazon.it/gp/product/B00BIZBL4U/?tag=pmak-20

Only complaint is that I think one of them had been opened and the other had a sticker which left behind some glue that I didn't manage to remove completely.  But neither has rusted and the pizza doesn't stick to it.  Note that it might stick a little bit the first few times you use it, and I never oil them before use, I extend the pizza on semola remacinata (grano duro/hard wheat).  Sometimes I give them a shine with oil after baking before putting them in storage.

Here is a video (in Italian) on how to burn them in.



If you need help with a translation let me know once you've bought them.

Effeuno P134H (1700W upper element), EGO 500C Thermostat (upper), Biscotto Fornace Saputo, Caputo Pizzeria (Blue Bag), Mutti S. Marzano (DOP) :)

A D V E R T I S E M E N T


Offline fckace

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 71
  • I Love Pizza!
Re: How to properly bake foccacia and pizza romana in home oven ?
« Reply #5 on: April 05, 2019, 03:45:27 AM »
I wonder if those aren't people that managed to mess it up...  Never ever let them get wet/humid as they will rust.  Also when burning them in, you only need the smallest amount of oil (seed or maybe corn oil), far less than you'd imagine.  Really just enough to see that they change appearance in shine, if using more oil it will form sticky places..

I bought these myself and haven't had any problems with them: https://www.amazon.it/gp/product/B00BIZBL4U/?tag=pmak-20

Only complaint is that I think one of them had been opened and the other had a sticker which left behind some glue that I didn't manage to remove completely.  But neither has rusted and the pizza doesn't stick to it.  Note that it might stick a little bit the first few times you use it, and I never oil them before use, I extend the pizza on semola remacinata (grano duro/hard wheat).  Sometimes I give them a shine with oil after baking before putting them in storage.

Here is a video (in Italian) on how to burn them in.
///

If you need help with a translation let me know once you've bought them.

Ok so I have bought two teglia on Amazon.it, one of each brand (Paderno and Ballarini). They should arrived lunedi.
I watch the video but despite my grandmother was Italian, I do not understand very well italian. Why should we burned them ? Should we do this each time or just once ?
From what I thought, we just apply olive oil on the pan, withouth burning it, and put the foccacia on it so that it doesn't stick.
Thanks !

Offline amolapizza

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 293
  • Location: Luxembourg / Spain
  • If pizza is food for the gods, what am I :)
Re: How to properly bake foccacia and pizza romana in home oven ?
« Reply #6 on: April 06, 2019, 10:45:41 AM »
Well I'm not an expert on this in any way, but I'll try to explain a few things (as I've understood them reading and googling).

The forms are made from iron and not some kind of stainless steel, this means that if they are left humid they will rust.  When manufactured they get covered with a material to preserve the iron and to stop them from rusting.  It's this material that gives them the color and gives the name ferro blu (blue iron).

I said above to never let them come into contact with water, this is somewhat an exaggeration, but in general they never get washed, just scraped clean and then used again.  The recommended way to clean them if there is a lot of bread burnt to them is to scrub them with rough sea salt.  That said you could in an extreme case clean them with water, but you'd be well advised to really dry them afterwards, possibly by leaving them a few hours in a warm oven.  If they are left for a while humid or in a humid place they will rust..  Also if for some reason you have to scrub them with something really abrasive they will lose the special coating, but apparently one can season them with oil again, and they will still work.

The process of burning them in is in order to create a hard glazing on them that will make them non stick and protect the iron from humidity.  You just need the thinnest film possible, if you use more oil it will form areas with a gummy sticky residue that is really hard to remove.  The process probably should be repeated 2-3 times when new, I'd do the outside too at the same time.  Just apply the thinnest layer of oil that you can, and then bake them at 200C for 5-10 minutes.  This process can be repeated every once in a while, but there is no need to do it every time.

In the video I linked they say to use mixed seed oil due to the low smoke point, not sure what kind of oil this is, but I used corn oil (maizena) myself and that seems to have worked.  The video specifies 200C for 4 minutes.  I'm sure I used something like 10 minutes myself.  Not sure how important that is, but the really important thing is that it's a thin layer so that you don't get the gummy/sticky residue in the corners where the oil collects in larger quantities.

I suppose there are a myriad of ways to cook a focaccia or pizza in teglia romana.  The difference between them is that the focaccia rises in the teglia, while the romana rises outside of the teglia, is extended just like a normal pizza and then moved into the teglia for cooking.  If you oil the pan the dough will fry at the bottom, but you can also extend it on semolina and cook without oil.  I suppose there is no right or wrong as it comes to this, a question of personal taste and tradition.

Here is a video from la confraternita della pizza of how to easily make a pizza in teglia alla romana, It's a really easy way to make a high hydration dough (80%), it also shows the technique of extending the pizza and moving it into the teglia.  This is somewhat difficult but gets easier with practice :)  The result is really fantastic and well worth the time!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?time_continue=15&v=Yia0E_Iqtoc

There is a thread in Italian discussing the video at: https://laconfraternitadellapizza.forumfree.it/?t=75899874  Possibly you can read it with google translate and get a lot more information than what I can write in this post :)

Note that there is an error in the video and the real recipe is this:

361g Flour
289g Cold water
2g CY
8g Salt
7g Oil

The flour should be a strong high W one, but I've done this with Caputo pizzeria blue which is a medium strength flour.  I've also mixed the Caputo with about 10-20% semola rimancinata without any issues.

The pizza should be cooked with heat from below in order to get the crunchy bottom, the top cooks by the ambient temperature. I normally cook it on a refractory stone in my F1 at 300C below and 250C above which means that all the heat is coming from the bottom and the upper element was only used to heat up the oven.  Takes me about 12 minutes to cook it.

Then there is the topic of toppings and whether to add them before, during or after cooking, but that's a whole different discussion with probably no right or wrong ;)

Good luck and I hope you learn to make a fabulous focaccia / pizza alla romana, it's really something very tasty :)

Effeuno P134H (1700W upper element), EGO 500C Thermostat (upper), Biscotto Fornace Saputo, Caputo Pizzeria (Blue Bag), Mutti S. Marzano (DOP) :)

Offline fckace

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 71
  • I Love Pizza!
Re: How to properly bake foccacia and pizza romana in home oven ?
« Reply #7 on: April 07, 2019, 02:58:50 AM »
Wow I did not expected a so full explanation, many thanks amolapizza teglia pan has no secret to me anymore !  :-D

Offline amolapizza

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 293
  • Location: Luxembourg / Spain
  • If pizza is food for the gods, what am I :)
Re: How to properly bake foccacia and pizza romana in home oven ?
« Reply #8 on: April 07, 2019, 05:15:05 AM »
One thing I forgot to mention.  When you get the teglias I think they will already be coated with oil to prevent rusting.  Apparently this is some kind of industrial oil that you don't want to mix with your food.  You should wipe them off really good with kitchen paper and burn them in the oven before going through the procedure above.  What I read is to leave them in the oven until they don't give off any smoke anymore.

Maybe it isn't mentioned in the video I linked as those are about teglias made specifically for the confraternita, I suppose they might have been treated differently than other brands.

No problem about sharing the information, I suppose that's why we have the forum! ;)
Effeuno P134H (1700W upper element), EGO 500C Thermostat (upper), Biscotto Fornace Saputo, Caputo Pizzeria (Blue Bag), Mutti S. Marzano (DOP) :)

Offline fckace

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 71
  • I Love Pizza!
Re: How to properly bake foccacia and pizza romana in home oven ?
« Reply #9 on: April 07, 2019, 11:25:29 AM »
Ok, thanks for the additional information. It's also mentionned in the pictures of the amazon link paderno, primo uso 150C for 30 minutes.

I understand now why some reviews are negative, because if you hadn't told me all this things, I would have never think to do them.  ;)

A D V E R T I S E M E N T


Offline amolapizza

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 293
  • Location: Luxembourg / Spain
  • If pizza is food for the gods, what am I :)
Re: How to properly bake foccacia and pizza romana in home oven ?
« Reply #10 on: April 07, 2019, 04:38:44 PM »
Happy to help :)
Effeuno P134H (1700W upper element), EGO 500C Thermostat (upper), Biscotto Fornace Saputo, Caputo Pizzeria (Blue Bag), Mutti S. Marzano (DOP) :)

Offline fckace

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 71
  • I Love Pizza!
Re: How to properly bake foccacia and pizza romana in home oven ?
« Reply #11 on: April 15, 2019, 05:14:47 AM »
So I have made my first foccacia in the new teglia pans and the result was great  :-D

But unfortunatly, some parts of the foccacia has sticked to the pan, no problem to remove it with a spatula, but I'd like to know how to avoid it ?
Of course, I had proceed to the brusciatta of the pan three times before using it, but when I put the dough on the teglia I didn't add any oil. Should I ?


And, how many degrees can support the teglia pan ? Because I'm thinking buying a pizza oven, and I don't know what should be the baking temperature for foccacia. In my home oven, I just put it at max temperature, but is 500C for gas oven/wood oven is fine for baking foccacia ?

Offline amolapizza

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 293
  • Location: Luxembourg / Spain
  • If pizza is food for the gods, what am I :)
Re: How to properly bake foccacia and pizza romana in home oven ?
« Reply #12 on: April 16, 2019, 06:47:03 AM »
Happy to hear that it worked out well!

The pans will get better with time, the first few times I had some parts stick, but haven't had that since.  Nowadays I mostly just wipe it off with paper to get rid of what spilled off the pizza, say oil, tomato, or cheese, then a soft brush to get rid of most of the semolina flour left.

You can add oil but it shouldn't be needed, if you do so it will change the texture of the pizza.  If you do, wipe it off after cooking.

I don't know what the max temperature is..  I cook in my P134H pizza oven on a refractory stone.  300C below and 250C above.  A pizza with just oil/water emulsion, salt and rosemary seems to need about 12 minutes, while one topped with tomato & cheese maybe 14 minutes.  From what I've understood you want a static oven with the majority of the heat coming from below.
« Last Edit: April 16, 2019, 06:48:35 AM by amolapizza »
Effeuno P134H (1700W upper element), EGO 500C Thermostat (upper), Biscotto Fornace Saputo, Caputo Pizzeria (Blue Bag), Mutti S. Marzano (DOP) :)

Offline fckace

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 71
  • I Love Pizza!
Re: How to properly bake foccacia and pizza romana in home oven ?
« Reply #13 on: April 16, 2019, 12:16:24 PM »
Okay, I'll continue without olive oil then. Thanks  :)

Offline amolapizza

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 293
  • Location: Luxembourg / Spain
  • If pizza is food for the gods, what am I :)
Re: How to properly bake foccacia and pizza romana in home oven ?
« Reply #14 on: April 17, 2019, 05:41:16 AM »
Just to say, that there will undoubtedly be people that oil the teglia before making a focaccia..  So try that too, it's another taste.  But your teglias ought to become non stick very quickly and not present a problem without prior oiling.  I'm pretty sure that the pizza in teglia romana is normally cooked without though.
« Last Edit: April 17, 2019, 05:47:53 AM by amolapizza »
Effeuno P134H (1700W upper element), EGO 500C Thermostat (upper), Biscotto Fornace Saputo, Caputo Pizzeria (Blue Bag), Mutti S. Marzano (DOP) :)

A D V E R T I S E M E N T


Offline fckace

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 71
  • I Love Pizza!
Re: How to properly bake foccacia and pizza romana in home oven ?
« Reply #15 on: April 18, 2019, 02:31:40 AM »
Ok, for my next try, I'll do one of each to see what happen. Thanks.  ;)

Offline mike2k84

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 8
  • Age: 34
  • Location: Dirty South (Bavaria) (Germany)
  • I Love Pizza!
Re: How to properly bake foccacia and pizza romana in home oven ?
« Reply #16 on: April 28, 2019, 08:28:11 AM »
hello u 2,

i will try to make pizza romana like in the recitte from the youtube video. but for me its not clear how long i have to rest the dough?! only 1time 30 - 60 minutes? i think thats not all ?!

can u please tell me this

thx

Offline amolapizza

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 293
  • Location: Luxembourg / Spain
  • If pizza is food for the gods, what am I :)
Re: How to properly bake foccacia and pizza romana in home oven ?
« Reply #17 on: April 28, 2019, 10:08:06 AM »
It wasn't clear to me either :)  I think something like this has to be considered a method and a starting point, not an explicit recipe.  It probably also depends on temperatures and flour used, etc, etc.  So as one gathers experience one starts to know that the dough needs more or less S/F, etc, depending on how it feels and reacts.

However, what I do is that I mix it roughly together, then after 30 minutes I do the first S/F in the bowl, after another 30 minutes I do the next one.  The following 4 S/F on the bench I do at 15 minutes intervals.  That's a total of about 2 hours before I put it in the fridge, this also gives the fermentation a chance to start.  After that I've done either 24 or 48 hours in the fridge, I've also played with replacing part of the flour with semolina which seems a good idea.  So far I've tried around 10-15% semolina rimacinata.

The amount of yeast to use probably is also open to experimentation, depending on how cold the dough gets in your fridge.  I store the dough at the top of the fridge, and it seems to end up somewhere around 7C which is probably a little high so I think I need a little bit less yeast than what the recipe says.  I have no space in the bottom of the fridge to store the dough, and if I set the fridge to a lower temp then things start freezing at the bottom.

I think it an excellent method for creating a high hydration dough.  And even though results keep getting better, all the pizzas made have been excellent.  For me the hardest part is extending it and then moving it to the teglia :)
Effeuno P134H (1700W upper element), EGO 500C Thermostat (upper), Biscotto Fornace Saputo, Caputo Pizzeria (Blue Bag), Mutti S. Marzano (DOP) :)

Offline mike2k84

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 8
  • Age: 34
  • Location: Dirty South (Bavaria) (Germany)
  • I Love Pizza!
Re: How to properly bake foccacia and pizza romana in home oven ?
« Reply #18 on: April 29, 2019, 02:17:45 PM »
thx for your help! tomorrow ill start my dough :)

Offline amolapizza

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 293
  • Location: Luxembourg / Spain
  • If pizza is food for the gods, what am I :)
Re: How to properly bake foccacia and pizza romana in home oven ?
« Reply #19 on: April 30, 2019, 03:56:14 AM »
Please post photos of the result  ;D
Effeuno P134H (1700W upper element), EGO 500C Thermostat (upper), Biscotto Fornace Saputo, Caputo Pizzeria (Blue Bag), Mutti S. Marzano (DOP) :)

A D V E R T I S E M E N T


 

wordpress