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Author Topic: Poolish %  (Read 583 times)

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Offline Victorag999

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Poolish %
« on: May 05, 2019, 08:21:27 AM »
Hi forum,

Relatively speaking what are the differences in the longevity of the final dough, handling properties and baking characteristics of a dough that is made with a 100 % hydration poolish at different percentages of pre fermented flour (lets say 20, 40, 50, and 100 %.) Is there true maximum % of poolish (or % of pre fermented flour) where any of you have encountered the final dough is negatively effected to the point of diminishing returns? Besides flavor what are the other advantages of a poolish that most of you encounter when using such pre ferment? I have read the articles by Didier Rosa and done research online I am looking more for some personal input from prior experience all of you have had.

Thank you.

Offline The Dough Doctor

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Re: Poolish %
« Reply #1 on: May 05, 2019, 10:13:09 PM »
OMG! Where to begin....
The poolish provides flavor and sets the stage for potential crispiness and to some degree tenderness. Depending upon the amount of fermentation and temperature it can also impact crust color too.
The % of poolish and its impact upon the dough are dependent upon such things as the strength of the flour, the fermentation tolerance of the flour, the amount of yeast used in the poolish, the temperature of the poolish and the fermentation time.
All I can say is that when I use a poolish with a 12.8% protein content strong bread flour I use 100% absorption, 1/2 of my yeast and 85F water. I will typically allow the poolish to ferment for about 90-minutes. I'm sure others have their own favorite ways to use a poolish.
Tom Lehmann/The Dough Doctor

Offline pizzainthe6ix

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Re: Poolish %
« Reply #2 on: May 15, 2019, 12:38:13 PM »
I will let you know how my recipe works.  I am using the same Caputo 00 flour for my Poolish as my dough and put all my yeast (.075%) in the Poolish and none in the final dough.  Also using 50% of total flour from poolish (250/250) and 80% of the total water comes from pooloish

Offline pizzainthe6ix

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Re: Poolish %
« Reply #3 on: May 21, 2019, 11:50:16 AM »
I tried the following with Caputo 00 Pizzeria flour for the Poolish and final dough.  I could not really tell any difference from using no poolish in this recipe at all to only using 20% (with majority of yeast in the final dough). 

I think I prefer something around the 20% range of total flour but might want to experiment a bit more

Total Formula:
Flour (100%):    497.36 g  |  17.54 oz | 1.1 lbs
Water (63%):    313.34 g  |  11.05 oz | 0.69 lbs
Salt (2.8%):    13.93 g | 0.49 oz | 0.03 lbs | 2.5 tsp | 0.83 tbsp
CY (.075%):    0.37 g | 0.01 oz | 0 lbs | Total (165.875%):   825 g | 29.1 oz | 1.82 lbs | TF = N/A
Single Ball:   275 g | 9.7 oz | 0.61 lbs

Preferment:
Flour:    248.68 g | 8.77 oz | 0.55 lbs
Water:    248.68 g | 8.77 oz | 0.55 lbs
Total:    497.36 g | 17.54 oz | 1.1 lbs

Final Dough:
Flour:    248.68 g | 8.77 oz | 0.55 lbs
Water:    64.66 g | 2.28 oz | 0.14 lbs
Salt:    13.93 g | 0.49 oz | 0.03 lbs | 2.5 tsp | 0.83 tbsp
CY:    0.37 g | 0.01 oz | 0 lbs | Preferment:    497.36 g | 17.54 oz | 1.1 lbs
Total:    825 g | 29.1 oz | 1.82 lbs  | TF = N/A

Offline jvp123

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Re: Poolish %
« Reply #4 on: May 21, 2019, 01:19:40 PM »
OMG! Where to begin....
The poolish provides flavor and sets the stage for potential crispiness and to some degree tenderness. Depending upon the amount of fermentation and temperature it can also impact crust color too.
The % of poolish and its impact upon the dough are dependent upon such things as the strength of the flour, the fermentation tolerance of the flour, the amount of yeast used in the poolish, the temperature of the poolish and the fermentation time.
All I can say is that when I use a poolish with a 12.8% protein content strong bread flour I use 100% absorption, 1/2 of my yeast and 85F water. I will typically allow the poolish to ferment for about 90-minutes. I'm sure others have their own favorite ways to use a poolish.
Tom Lehmann/The Dough Doctor

Tom, would you please expand on "potential crispiness and to some degree tenderness." 
Jeff

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Offline pizzainthe6ix

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Re: Poolish %
« Reply #5 on: May 25, 2019, 11:51:52 AM »
I would really like to learn more about this as well.  It seems a lot of the naples style recipes are using  poolish in the range of 15-20% of total flour and more crispier, ny style pizzas are using 50%-100% of total flour weight....both with 12-18hr fermentation times.  The differences in the recipes I have found put all the yeast in the poolish .vs. a small amount in the poolish.  I did confirm this with one of my latest doughs - the higher % of poolish the crispier the crust.

I have always read that it might make the most sense to use the same flour in poolish as in the final dough, but learning more on the forums changing the flour could introduce a nice flavour profile changing the flour in the poolish.

Offline pizzainthe6ix

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Re: Poolish %
« Reply #6 on: June 04, 2019, 01:36:13 PM »
Hi Tom,
how come you are only using 50% of the yeast in the poolish and not all of it?

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Poolish %
« Reply #7 on: June 04, 2019, 01:40:25 PM »
It seems a lot of the naples style recipes are using  poolish in the range of 15-20% of total flour

Which recipes are you referring to? I can't remember anyone here using poolish for Neapolitan? I'm sure it's been done, but my impression is that it's not very common.
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Offline pizzainthe6ix

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Re: Poolish %
« Reply #8 on: June 04, 2019, 02:46:00 PM »
Which recipes are you referring to? I can't remember anyone here using poolish for Neapolitan? I'm sure it's been done, but my impression is that it's not very common.
I should rephrase and say the Napoletana and Margherita recipes in Tony G's Pizza Bible use a poolish @ 20% with only 5% of the total yeast in the poolish

Offline Georgev

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Re: Poolish %
« Reply #9 on: June 04, 2019, 03:07:47 PM »
OMG! Where to begin....
The poolish provides flavor and sets the stage for potential crispiness and to some degree tenderness. Depending upon the amount of fermentation and temperature it can also impact crust color too.
The % of poolish and its impact upon the dough are dependent upon such things as the strength of the flour, the fermentation tolerance of the flour, the amount of yeast used in the poolish, the temperature of the poolish and the fermentation time.
All I can say is that when I use a poolish with a 12.8% protein content strong bread flour I use 100% absorption, 1/2 of my yeast and 85F water. I will typically allow the poolish to ferment for about 90-minutes. I'm sure others have their own favorite ways to use a poolish.
Tom Lehmann/The Dough Doctor

So you allow the poolish to ferment for 90 mins at room temp and then mix the poolish with the rest of the Ingredients to create the final dough? Then cut, ball and refrigerate?

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Offline pizzainthe6ix

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Re: Poolish %
« Reply #10 on: June 04, 2019, 03:49:11 PM »
So you allow the poolish to ferment for 90 mins at room temp and then mix the poolish with the rest of the Ingredients to create the final dough? Then cut, ball and refrigerate?
This is also a great point. I have always read 8-16hrs (depending on time and quantity of yeast).

Offline amolapizza

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Re: Poolish %
« Reply #11 on: June 06, 2019, 06:08:48 AM »
The Italian brotherhood of pizza seem to be heavily into either pasta di riporto (old dough) or biga, with a small addition of CY when I met them at the convention.  This both for Neapolitan as well as for pizza in teglia.
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