A D V E R T I S E M E N T


Author Topic: Tinkering with poolish  (Read 1744 times)

0 Members and 1 Guest are viewing this topic.

Offline fazzari

  • Lifetime Member
  • *
  • Posts: 1176
Tinkering with poolish
« on: June 01, 2019, 01:06:44 AM »
Most of the time, when I make pizza, I love to use the poolish method because it adds instant flavor if I might want a pizza a day after the final dough is mixed.  I also love the cold fermentation method the best because I usually make enough dough to have a pizza a day for 5 or 6 days.  Having said that I recently read some commentary on the poolish method by Tom (Dough Doctor) and TXCraig1, which got me to thinking about my methods.

Up until now, I have split my yeast between the poolish and the final dough having good results.  But I was wondering what would happen if I used 100% of the yeast in the poolish, and then again, made that amount incredibly small.

The recipe:
flour   606 grams
water    394 grams
salt       15 grams
oil       15 grams
yeast    .25grams

Made poolish:  285 grams flour, 285 grams water, .25 grams yeast.  Mix and let set at room temperature for 18 hours.  Add the rest of the ingredients, mix about 5 minutes until dough pulls away from bowl.  Do stretch and folds every 30 minutes for 2 hours.  Place in a bowl, cover with plastic and refrigerate.

First dough ball was scaled and balled about 30 hours after first refrigerated.  Was baked about 18 hours after it was balled.

Excellent pizza!!

John


Online foreplease

  • Lifetime Member
  • *
  • Posts: 6227
  • Age: 60
  • Location: St. Joseph, MI
Re: Tinkering with poolish
« Reply #1 on: June 02, 2019, 10:27:07 AM »
John, that is very close to the popular Apizza Scholls workflow and formula. Generally, I split the yeast evenly between poolish and final dough because I am still learning about the effect of adding the second half of the yeast after an autolyse period. I’m not surprised you found it to be excellent. Mine get darker than the one you show, which is just personal preference. How long and how warm was your bake?
-Tony

Offline fazzari

  • Lifetime Member
  • *
  • Posts: 1176
Re: Tinkering with poolish
« Reply #2 on: June 02, 2019, 10:36:34 PM »
John, that is very close to the popular Apizza Scholls workflow and formula. Generally, I split the yeast evenly between poolish and final dough because I am still learning about the effect of adding the second half of the yeast after an autolyse period. I’m not surprised you found it to be excellent. Mine get darker than the one you show, which is just personal preference. How long and how warm was your bake?
Tony, its also a workflow similar to Reinhardt.  But, it's cold fermented and that's where the similarities end...that and the tiny bit of yeast I used went only into the poolish.  This pizza was baked in a deck oven (550 degrees), maybe 6 minutes or so.

Baked another dough from the batch today.  This one is about 4 days old.  Another excellent pizza
John

Online foreplease

  • Lifetime Member
  • *
  • Posts: 6227
  • Age: 60
  • Location: St. Joseph, MI
Re: Tinkering with poolish
« Reply #3 on: June 02, 2019, 11:15:54 PM »
Tony, its also a workflow similar to Reinhardt.  But, it's cold fermented and that's where the similarities end...that and the tiny bit of yeast I used went only into the poolish.  This pizza was baked in a deck oven (550 degrees), maybe 6 minutes or so.

Baked another dough from the batch today.  This one is about 4 days old.  Another excellent pizza
John
That is definitely a great looking pizza. I’ve read things here on the forum supporting both ways of introducing the yeast. I think I prefer and will most often use ‘all the yeast goes into the poolish’ but have stuck with splitting it just because I want several reps under my belt with the Apizza Scholls dough.


My next direction will probably be: using a couple other formulas I like but backing out 20-25% of the flour, an equal amount of water (by weight) and all the yeast to make a poolish. Completing the dough 12-24 hrs later such that the total formula amounts for every ingredient is the same as how I had previously made it. That is going to give me the easiest to understand example of what using a poolish does. I expect one of the things I will find is that less IDY (in my case) should be used because of the additional time at RT the poolish is working.


In re-reading your first post, it seems we are interested in the same thing, or similar.
-Tony

Offline pizzainthe6ix

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 254
  • Location: Toronto (a.k.a. The6ix)
  • I Love Pizza!
Re: Tinkering with poolish
« Reply #4 on: June 04, 2019, 01:34:56 PM »
Thanks for this. It saves me a new post as I am in this exact stage.

So what are the actual differences between 50/50 and 100% of the yeast in the poolish?  Do you know what impact this has on the total amount of yeast being used/proof times (maybe if using Craig's chart)


A D V E R T I S E M E N T


Online Pete-zza

  • Lifetime Member
  • Global Moderator
  • *
  • Posts: 29312
  • Location: Texas
  • Always learning
Re: Tinkering with poolish
« Reply #5 on: June 04, 2019, 05:55:34 PM »
So what are the actual differences between 50/50 and 100% of the yeast in the poolish?  Do you know what impact this has on the total amount of yeast being used/proof times (maybe if using Craig's chart)
pizzainthe6ix,

Over the years, our members have done just about everything that you might do in terms of how to use the yeast. In the bread world, when a preferment is used, it is all put into the preferment. And I would say that the most favored form of the preferment is the poolish. You can read what Didier Rosada recommends in terms of the amounts and prefermentation times for a poolish preferment in his article at:

https://web.archive.org/web/20040814193817/cafemeetingplace.com/archives/food3_apr2004.htm

For an example of the use of yeast in both the preferment and final dough but in the context of a pizza dough, see the thread at:

https://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=5851.msg49940#msg49940

The risk of using too little yeast or too long a prefermentation time at room temperature or having a high preferment temperature is that there may not be enough active yeast left at the time of making the final dough to sustain fermentation over the desired time period. Or maybe some form of bacterial fermentation kicks in.

We have had members cold ferment preferments but the success of that approach will depend on the amount of yeast in the preferment and the duration of the cold fermentation of the preferment. Everything has to be in good order. You can't just guess and expect to have success. That is why the rules in a commercial setting, such as contemplated by Rosada, are so rigid, and failure is not an option. In a home setting, failure is just an invitation to try something new. And it is not easy to diagnose problems and come up with easy solutions.

In my own experience with preferments, and I have tried them all, including those with natural starters, I found that for commercial yeast applications I usually tried to abide by the instructions given by Didier Rosada as set forth in the article I cited, including using the chart he sets forth under the Poolish section of the article.

It was because of the endless forms of and treatments of preferments that one might invent that Mike and I were unable to come up with a dough calculating tool that could be used with all of the many variations of preferments. So we limited the preferment dough calculating tool to preferments based on natural starters with the additional option of adding commercial yeast to the final dough. I know how to manipulate the numbers for pretty much any type of preferment but it took me a long time to learn how to do that. It can take a lot of time and effort. The better approach is to find successful dough recipes using preferments and follow those recipes. Even then, there may be scaling issues but that is to be expected.

Peter

Offline HansB

  • Lifetime Member
  • *
  • Posts: 4648
  • Location: Detroit, MI
    • 500px
Re: Tinkering with poolish
« Reply #6 on: June 04, 2019, 06:49:32 PM »
Peter, in the Rosada article I did not see where she recommends using all of the yeast in the poolish e.g. only .1% yeast for a 12-15 hour poolish.

Every formula in BBA calls for less yeast in the poolish than in the the final formula.

Hamelman recommends .3 to .6% for up to 12 hours. Most of his formulas us .2% yeast in the poolish and over 1% yeast in the overall formula. He writes that if you cannot measure small amounts to use a "speck" of yeast in the poolish.

In Bread Science Emily Buehler suggests using a "pinch" of yeast in the poolish then ~.7% in the formula.

DiMuzio writes to use a "small" amount of yeast in the poolish.

When using poolish I have only used a tiny amount of yeast, I don't even take it into consideration in the final formula.

Likely I am missing a point here re yeast use in this discussion?
« Last Edit: June 04, 2019, 07:05:01 PM by HansB »
Hans

Offline TXCraig1

  • Supporting Member
  • *
  • Posts: 27009
  • Location: Houston, TX
  • Pizza is not bread.
    • Craig's Neapolitan Garage
Re: Tinkering with poolish
« Reply #7 on: June 04, 2019, 07:35:06 PM »
"We make great pizza, with sourdough when we can, baker's yeast when we must, but always great pizza."  
Craig's Neapolitan Garage

Offline fazzari

  • Lifetime Member
  • *
  • Posts: 1176
Re: Tinkering with poolish
« Reply #8 on: June 04, 2019, 07:45:03 PM »
I've read everything I can put my hands on in regards to poolish...and I've had success with almost all the different theories and recipes.  For some reason, after making poolish after poolish, letting them sit from 8 to 20 hours at room temperature....and then smelling the sweet aroma, with all of the tiny pinholes..I got to wondering, just how little yeast I could use and still get a decent pizza.  And that's what got me to try this experiment.  Because I cold ferment the whole dough, and scale and ball as needed.. I have found that after cutting a piece of dough out of the bulk, the dough doesn't grow at all as it sits in the fridge waiting to be baked another day. ( When I used yeast in the poolish "and" the finished dough, the dough seems to grow as it sits in the fridge.)  In fact the remaining dough almost looks like a plastic, or something similar to that.  Having said all that, all that really matters is the quality of the baked pizza...and that has been excellent!
This last pizza was made from dough that was final mixed 6 days ago.  It is delicious, has an egg shell bottom crust (my favorite).  Oh, one more thing...this dough can be left out to warm up for 4 to 6 hours if you need to

John

Offline HansB

  • Lifetime Member
  • *
  • Posts: 4648
  • Location: Detroit, MI
    • 500px
Re: Tinkering with poolish
« Reply #9 on: June 04, 2019, 07:55:23 PM »
Part 2 of the Rosada article Peter posted above: https://web.archive.org/web/20050829015510/www.cafemeetingplace.com/archives/food4_dec2004.htm

Thanks, if it's in there I missed it. I only saw "To make an autolyse, the preferment should be added to the final dough along with yeast and salt only after the resting period of the autolyse.  This is done in order to avoid any incorporation of yeast in the autolyse".

As in anything baking there are many ways to do it. I have just not found in any of my books, and I have way too many, an example of more than a small amount of yeast added to a poolish. Sounds like something I may try given fazzari's results.
Hans

A D V E R T I S E M E N T


Offline pizzainthe6ix

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 254
  • Location: Toronto (a.k.a. The6ix)
  • I Love Pizza!
Re: Tinkering with poolish
« Reply #10 on: June 04, 2019, 09:24:06 PM »
pizzainthe6ix,

Over the years, our members have done just about everything that you might do in terms of how to use the yeast. In the bread world, when a preferment is used, it is all put into the preferment. And I would say that the most favored form of the preferment is the poolish. You can read what Didier Rosada recommends in terms of the amounts and prefermentation times for a poolish preferment in his article at:

https://web.archive.org/web/20040814193817/cafemeetingplace.com/archives/food3_apr2004.htm

For an example of the use of yeast in both the preferment and final dough but in the context of a pizza dough, see the thread at:

https://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=5851.msg49940#msg49940

The risk of using too little yeast or too long a prefermentation time at room temperature or having a high preferment temperature is that there may not be enough active yeast left at the time of making the final dough to sustain fermentation over the desired time period. Or maybe some form of bacterial fermentation kicks in.

We have had members cold ferment preferments but the success of that approach will depend on the amount of yeast in the preferment and the duration of the cold fermentation of the preferment. Everything has to be in good order. You can't just guess and expect to have success. That is why the rules in a commercial setting, such as contemplated by Rosada, are so rigid, and failure is not an option. In a home setting, failure is just an invitation to try something new. And it is not easy to diagnose problems and come up with easy solutions.

In my own experience with preferments, and I have tried them all, including those with natural starters, I found that for commercial yeast applications I preferred using a poolish in an amount of about 15-20% of the total formula flour, and I usually tried to abide by the instructions given by Didier Rosada as set forth in the article I cited, including using the chart he sets forth under the Poolish section of the article.

It was because of the endless forms of and treatments of preferments that one might invent that Mike and I were unable to come up with a dough calculating tool that could be used with all of the many variations of preferments. So we limited the preferment dough calculating tool to preferments based on natural starters with the additional option of adding commercial yeast to the final dough. I know how to manipulate the numbers for pretty much any type of preferment but it took me a long time to learn how to do that. It can take a lot of time and effort. The better approach is to find successful dough recipes using preferments and follow those recipes. Even then, there may be scaling issues but that is to be expected.

Peter
Hi Peter,
this is exactly what I was looking for.  Ken Forkish is a bread maker, which is most likely why he puts all of the yeast in the pre-ferment...and he only uses a very small amount (.08% ADY or .16% of CY of poolish flour). 

Using the chart in the article, it is more inline with what Tony G is using...a small amount of yeast in the Poolish and the rest in the final dough.  Also, looking at the 48hr chart from Craig, it seems my last batch had too much yeast overall but closed to .1% and ended up with a poolish that was 100% of total flour and it was delicious.

The chart said .1% CY based on 85F and roughly 12hrs.  I am going to try the following and use .16% of flour in the poolish (.13G) and the rest (.35G) in the final dough to compare.  I am proofing in bulk for 24hrs @ 20C and about 18hrs in balls at 20C.  I find I do get better results with the pizza using a larger amount of poolish but would end up with only .026% yeast as it relates to the flour in the Poolish.....and would have to crank up the heat/ferment longer and I do not want to change too many variables.

This is what I started today and will cook on Friday

Total Formula:
Flour (100%):
Water (63%):
Salt (2.8%):
CY (.050%):
Total (165.85%):
Single Ball:

Preferment:
Flour:
Water:
Total:

Final Dough:
Flour:
Water:
Salt:
CY:
Preferment:
Total:

955.08 g  |  33.69 oz | 2.11 lbs
601.7 g  |  21.22 oz | 1.33 lbs
26.74 g | 0.94 oz | 0.06 lbs | 4.79 tsp | 1.6 tbsp
0.48 g | 0.02 oz | 0 lbs |
1584 g | 55.87 oz | 3.49 lbs | TF = N/A
264 g | 9.31 oz | 0.58 lbs
 
 
85.96 g | 3.03 oz | 0.19 lbs
85.96 g | 3.03 oz | 0.19 lbs
171.91 g | 6.06 oz | 0.38 lbs

 
869.12 g | 30.66 oz | 1.92 lbs
515.74 g | 18.19 oz | 1.14 lbs
26.74 g | 0.94 oz | 0.06 lbs | 4.79 tsp | 1.6 tbsp
0.48 g | 0.02 oz | 0 lbs |
171.91 g | 6.06 oz | 0.38 lbs
1584 g | 55.87 oz | 3.49 lbs  | TF = N/A
« Last Edit: June 05, 2019, 09:05:28 AM by pizzainthe6ix »

Online foreplease

  • Lifetime Member
  • *
  • Posts: 6227
  • Age: 60
  • Location: St. Joseph, MI
Re: Tinkering with poolish
« Reply #11 on: June 04, 2019, 09:47:22 PM »
I’m at .12 g IDY for 158 g flour (and water), about 0.08%. Then add the same amout of .12 g IDY to the rest,of the formula flour, which is 472 g/630 total flour, which is about 0.04% total IDY to total flour. It behaves well in the fridge for as much as 3 days. I have not run this one any longer. It can get away from you on the counter, though, post-fridge pre-bake beyond about 4 hrs.


Something I have been thinking about is how 2 doughs with the same percent IDY perform - differently, I presume - with HR that are significantly apart, say 58% vs 75% water. It’s something I think I will experiment with. If we are figuring the yeast as a percent of flour, it seems that as flour becomes a smaller percent of the total by increasing water that yeast should have less of an effect.
« Last Edit: June 04, 2019, 10:09:49 PM by foreplease »
-Tony

Online Pete-zza

  • Lifetime Member
  • Global Moderator
  • *
  • Posts: 29312
  • Location: Texas
  • Always learning
Re: Tinkering with poolish
« Reply #12 on: June 04, 2019, 09:49:17 PM »
John,

As a point of clarification, does the recipe you used include the flour and water you used to make the poolish or are the flour and water used for the poolish separate? For example, you show a poolish that uses 570 grams of flour and water whereas in the “recipe” you show the flour and water as weighing a total of 1000 grams. That would mean that the poolish uses 57% of the total flour and water. Is that correct?

Also, what kind of yeast did you use?

Peter

Offline fazzari

  • Lifetime Member
  • *
  • Posts: 1176
Re: Tinkering with poolish
« Reply #13 on: June 04, 2019, 10:53:04 PM »
John,

As a point of clarification, does the recipe you used include the flour and water you used to make the poolish or are the flour and water used for the poolish separate? For example, you show a poolish that uses 570 grams of flour and water whereas in the “recipe” you show the flour and water as weighing a total of 1000 grams. That would mean that the poolish uses 57% of the total flour and water. Is that correct?

Also, what kind of yeast did you use?

Peter

Peter, you are correct and I used IDY
John

Offline CaptBob

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 2967
  • Location: Idaho Falls, Id
Re: Tinkering with poolish
« Reply #14 on: June 05, 2019, 01:57:42 AM »
Love this discussion.....I use both a poolish and autolyse.......and a low (usually .06%)... % of IDY.....
« Last Edit: June 05, 2019, 02:02:17 AM by CaptBob »
Bob

A D V E R T I S E M E N T


Offline PizzAmateur

  • Registered User
  • Posts: 471
  • Location: North Alabama
  • There is nothing wrong with pizza 3 times a day.
Re: Tinkering with poolish
« Reply #15 on: June 05, 2019, 05:55:21 AM »
Subscribed!

Online Pete-zza

  • Lifetime Member
  • Global Moderator
  • *
  • Posts: 29312
  • Location: Texas
  • Always learning
Re: Tinkering with poolish
« Reply #16 on: June 05, 2019, 08:29:11 AM »
Thanks, if it's in there I missed it. I only saw "To make an autolyse, the preferment should be added to the final dough along with yeast and salt only after the resting period of the autolyse.  This is done in order to avoid any incorporation of yeast in the autolyse".

As in anything baking there are many ways to do it. I have just not found in any of my books, and I have way too many, an example of more than a small amount of yeast added to a poolish. Sounds like something I may try given fazzari's results.
Hans,

Actually, I believe that you are correct. It's been a while since I last posted in depth on poolish and it slipped my mind that the yeast (fresh yeast) used in the chart in Rosada's first article that I cited is measured with respect to the flour used in the poolish, not the total formula flour. The second Rosada article that Craig cited and that I usually cite along with the first Rosada article (and also did recently for the benefit of pizzainthe6ix in another thread) contemplates the use of yeast in the final dough. I also noted a while back that some members put all of the yeast in the poolish but that other members tend to split the total yeast between the poolish and the final dough:

Reply 68 at https://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=42414.msg445482#msg445482

Now that I have John's numbers under my belt, I will have more to say on what he did when I reply to John's last post.

Peter

Offline HansB

  • Lifetime Member
  • *
  • Posts: 4648
  • Location: Detroit, MI
    • 500px
Re: Tinkering with poolish
« Reply #17 on: June 05, 2019, 08:33:34 AM »
Peter, thanks for the link. This is an interesting discussion.
Hans

Online Pete-zza

  • Lifetime Member
  • Global Moderator
  • *
  • Posts: 29312
  • Location: Texas
  • Always learning
Re: Tinkering with poolish
« Reply #18 on: June 05, 2019, 09:36:21 AM »
Peter, you are correct and I used IDY
John
John,

Thank you for clarifying matters for me.

As you may know, poolish has its origins in the bread world, but subsequently found its way into the pizza world. I learned most of what I know about commercially leavened preferments from the two Rosada articles that have been cited in this thread. And in the context of the bread world, Rosada indicated in the Poolish section of his first article that traditionally a poolish was sized by using from 20% to 80% of the formula water and then elaborating the poolish with an equal weight of flour. In your case, if my math is correct you used 570/394 = 144.7% of the total formula water. Looking at your numbers in a different way, the total poolish size you used comes to about 55.4% of the total dough weight (570.25/1030.25). So, in your case, you used more than 50% of the total weight of the dough for the poolish.

As for the amount of yeast (IDY) that you used in your poolish, it comes to 0.08771% (0.25/285). That is for a 20-hour poolish prefermentation period. However, if you look at the poolish chart given in the first Rosada article, you will see that for a 12-15 hour fermentation time the amount of yeast is 0.1%. That number would have to be adjusted by lowering the amount of yeast to get to 20 hours and also be tweaked, if required, based on your water temperature and the room temperature. But more importantly, it is important to note that the poolish yeast chart in the first Rosada article is fresh yeast, not dry yeast. So, for IDY, you would have to divide the 0.1% by about 3, to get 0.0333% IDY. The 0.0333% number would have to be lowered a bit to get the prefermentation period out to 20 hours. Even with other possible adjustments as noted above, you are using multiples of what the Rosada yeast chart would suggest. That tells me that you should not have had any problems with your poolish over the 20-hour period, and I would have expected that the poolish would have expanded by quite a bit by the time you incorporated it into the final dough. Was that actually the case? Or have I missed something? Also, I noticed that the finished pizzas in your photos do not have particularly dark crusts. Sometimes with long fermentations of the poolish and if there is a fair amount of yeast there can be a loss of sugars to contribute to crust coloration. These matters and how to correct for a low residual sugar problem are discussed by Rosada in his second article under the section "Secondary effects of the preferment".

Sticking with the bread world, one of the important questions when using poolish is the timing of the incorporation of the poolish into the final dough. Rosada basically says that the optimum time to use a poolish (and a sponge preferment as well) is when the poolish peaks and then recedes. That point in time is commonly called the "break" point. This is perhaps more critical in the bread world because of the need to produce consistent results. The break point is not often discussed on the forum but I have written about it, as well as other related matters, on several occasions. See, for example, these posts:

Reply 1 at https://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=8910.msg77240;topicseen#msg77240,

Reply 7 at https://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=12261.msg116243;topicseen#msg116243,

Reply 6 at https://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=53935.msg541723#msg541723,

Reply 5 at https://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=43783.msg438352;topicseen#msg438352, and

Reply 19 at https://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=9512.msg82441#msg82441

As noted in the above posts, the Rosada articles do not have any photos. That is because the original articles became unavailable to the public. That prompted me to see if the articles were in the archives of the Wayback Machine. They were, but with no photos. In one of the posts cited above, I showed the break point for a sponge preferment is anyone would like to see what a break point actually looks like.

I want to make it clear that there was nothing that you did that was improper. In fact, your "tinkering" with the poolish produced some very nice end results. Also, I have come to better understand that making and using a poolish in a home setting for pizza dough is less demanding of the rules and procedures that are used and required by professional bread makers. They have to make breads day after day and cannot tolerate anything that prevents them from doing so. Also, most bread bakers rely on poolish and like preferments to cut down total production time, which pretty much rules out cold fermentation of the final dough. For example, in his book, The Taste of Bread, Professor Raymond Calvel gives a poolish-based bread dough example where a 4-hour prefermented poolish is followed by the steps of mixing, fermentation (first fermentation), dividing, weighing and forming, and, finally, proofing. The total of the steps after incorporating the poolish take 45 minutes, with the grand total being 4 hours and 45 minutes. So, speed is often of the essence.

Peter

Offline Jersey Pie Boy

  • Lifetime Member
  • *
  • Posts: 5506
  • Location: Portland, Oregon
Re: Tinkering with poolish
« Reply #19 on: June 05, 2019, 10:10:28 AM »
Peter, I'll pop in here and note that there was a piece of information....maybe from Evelyn or Rosada..that noted the poolish can be successfully used in the dough up to three days after peaking if held in cold fridge.


You know me to be nothing if not scientifically inert, but this worked fine for me. I'm not sure if I've done 3 days, but certainly 2, and often with the poolish IDY being the total formula IDY..none added  to final mix. Not only are the poolish and yeast still plenty active, if I have an issue, it's usually over-fermentation. 


I haven't been able to make a clear connection with how to utilize Craig's terrific chart when using a poolish.I wondered at one point if the poolish acted as its own entity regarding fermentation times...as   SD levain fermentation timing is based more on the levain total amount than the inoculation. It doesn't seem to be the case, I believe the amount of IDY is still the main factor in length of fermentation , but I find that following the chart when using a poolish...and mine is 43% of total flour..ie 150 poolish (flour and water) to 350 total formula flour,,,will result in a dough that's moving too fast for my desired multi-day timing. RT fermenrtation in the process has been a tricky issue and a wine cooler in on my future wish list.


Thanks

A D V E R T I S E M E N T


 

wordpress