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Offline Kermit

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Need a new oven
« on: June 10, 2019, 06:37:55 AM »
Hi guys

Been a while since I've been here. I've had a Pizza Party oven for the last 6-7 years, and have been really happy with it. However, I've now moved to a house and have more space, and would love to get a new oven that may hold 2-3 pizzas, and also get better heat from the top. I only do neapolitan pizza, and although I would love a SF oven, they're just too expensive and overkill for my needs.

My initial thought was to build my own oven, but after a bit of soul searching and putting everything into a realistic perspective I know I won't have the time nor the skills to actually make one. Another option is to buy a kit and have a local masoner make it for me - but might be a bit too expensive in the end.

Then I looked at the classic portugueese ovens such as this - https://www.my-barbecue.co.uk/wood-burrning-fired-brick-pizza-oven-pizzaioli-120cm Anybody have any experience with those? They seem pretty cool, are fairly "cheap", but my concern is whether or not they will be ideal for my type of pizza.

Any other manufacturers I've overlooked and should take a look at? I'm in Europe which should be great, considering Italy is not all that far away  ;D

Offline Kermit

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Re: Need a new oven
« Reply #1 on: June 12, 2019, 07:21:47 AM »
Not that many replies yet, but I've continued my search for an oven, and boy have I been all over the place.

At first I looked at the kits that were available for purchase, that would eliminate the need to actually build the dome myself, but only do the isolation and stuff like that. I looked a lot at the Valoriani FVR ovens that seems fairly well priced. I also looked at the Sunday Grill Volta ovens that generally have a good reputation, as well as Vitcas. All modular oven kits where you assemble and build.

I also got a quote from Zio Ciro that makes a smaller oven called Subito Cotto 95 - https://www.zio-ciro.com/en/prodotti/portable-ovens/subito-cotto-95-small-dimension-wood-fired-oven/
Price was around 2000 euros incl. shipping and everything.

Another company I contacted was MP Forni that got me quotes for their artisan ovens. A 80 cm oven was 2900-3200 euros, and a 100 cm oven was 3300-3600 euros depending on the design. https://www.mpforni.it/forno-classico/

Yesterday I read the thread in here about a swedish guy that built his own neapolitan oven in the same style as an Acunto. That really caught my attention as it was a beautiful oven, and I started thinking that I would be able to pull that off myself. It would take a lot of time, but the limitation to building the oven myself had always been the fact that I had to cut the bricks myself, not really knowing what I needed to do so. But after a bit of reading, it seems that this process is actually doable even with limited handyman skills.

Then I started searching for used ovens in Italy and came across their version of eBay and Craigslist. Besides buying used stuff - there's actually a used Acunto oven(not sure if it's a G or Mario) for 2900 euros  :angel: But I came across two oven makers:
Artistica Salertiana - http://artisticasalernitana.com/
Forni Reppucia - http://www.noleggioforni.it/index.php

I've been able to find some stuff about AS, that actually seem pretty promising. Their FB page has a lot of pictures of the ovens being used in various situations and seem to produce decent pizzas. I haven't heard back from the, but they have two ovens on sale on eBay for about 1500 euros for a 100 cm oven.

Forni Reppucia was fast to reply to my question, and for their Volcanino oven, which is 100 cm, they are asking 1800 euros incl. a metal stand. I haven't been able to find that much information about this company, but they have some great pictures on their Facebook page as well, and the ovens are really beautiful!

Any comments on the ovens?

I guess my concerns with both of these ovens can be divided into two subjects:
- Price vs. quality
- My own need

Price vs. quality
5 years ago I asked SF to get me a quote for a 90 cm oven from them. I think the quote was around 5000 euros. These ovens are more than half and close to a third of the price. Now I know you probably pay for the brand of SF, but still. I could be concerned that the quality of the oven won't be on par with a SF or Acunto oven, but will it be on par with a Valoriani oven kit? Maybe. I think my conclusion is that it would probably be better than if I tried building my own oven from scratch.

My own need
Although I'd love to have a pizza oven that had room for 4-5 pizzas at a time, so I really could feel like a pizzaiolo, chances are that I will be making pizzas maybe 15-20 times a year. For that reason it would make sense to use one of the kits that should heat up faster and still retain heat pretty good. With a true mass oven, even in a smaller size such as 100 cm, I guess I would have a lot longer heat up time?

Guys, let me know your thoughts, your ideas, your comments. Right now I'm in that phase where everything is up for grabs  ;D

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Need a new oven
« Reply #2 on: June 12, 2019, 07:28:17 AM »
I'd call Antoine at Bread Stone Ovens and talk to him about what exactly you're looking for and get his thoughts.  https://www.breadstoneovens.com/ I'd trust his advice completely.

He's a great guy who has helped a lot of members here. I know you're not in the US, but his ovens are made in France.
"We make great pizza, with sourdough when we can, baker's yeast when we must, but always great pizza."  
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Offline Kermit

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Re: Need a new oven
« Reply #3 on: June 12, 2019, 08:19:49 AM »
Cool. I can see that he uses Four Grand-Mere which are ovens I haven't really looked into, but definately will. And will also probably give him a shout. Thanks  :)

Offline Kermit

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Re: Need a new oven
« Reply #4 on: June 17, 2019, 05:25:34 AM »
Gave Antoine a shout and the FGM 800b or 950b could definately be great options. However, shipping and VAT kinda kills the idea of getting anything from the US. I have looked for more local distributors of FGM ovens, but they're hard to find. I've found a danish dealer, but he's still to let me know of any prices.

Actually I've gotten pretty good response from a couple of oven makers in Italy. Here's the list so far:
Artistica Salernitana has the cheapest oven of around 1400 euros for a 100 cm. They get pretty good reviews from what I've been able to find.
La Reggia Forni/Fornace Comune - 2500 euros for a 100 cm oven. Nice pictures on their FB site, but can't find any reviews.
Saputo - haven't heard back from them yet, but apparently they make ovens as well as biscotto. Hope that they return the email, as it looks like they're hard to communicate with.
Aversi Forni - Prices that start from 2800 euros for a 100 cm oven, but true artisan and biscotto in both dome and cooking surface.
Forni Reppuccia - they have an oven called Volcanino, that is 100 cm. Looks really good, but can't find that much information about them. Oven is around 1800 euros, and they communicate really well and fast.
Zio Ciro - their Subito Cotto is still in the running, and at around 2000 euros including shipping, it's probably the cheapest overall buy, but also the smallest.

I've also received quite a few other quotes from other manufacturers, but they have been too expensive for my budget. One of the biggest challenges is actually the shipping, as shipping an oven that weighs quite a bit is expensive. Most of the quotes I've got has been around 1000 euros. So right now I'm looking into alternatives.

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Offline Kermit

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Re: Need a new oven
« Reply #5 on: June 21, 2019, 02:40:48 AM »
Still no answer from Saputo, even after 3 reminders. Guess my next mail to them will be in google translate italian  ;D

Had a good chat with La Reggia Forni yesterday evening on Facebook. They're actually neighbours to Saputo, and make their own bricks as well. Dome height is 40 cm, so pretty good. Still haven't decided on whether or not it makes sense to pay extra in terms of the Artistica Salernitana oven. I've narrowed the choices down to:
Artistica Salernitana
La Reggia Forni
Aversi Forni

With the outsiders being:
Zio Ciro
Saputo
« Last Edit: June 21, 2019, 02:51:41 AM by Kermit »

Offline Kermit

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Re: Need a new oven
« Reply #6 on: June 25, 2019, 04:46:08 AM »
The way things are going right now, it won't be long until I'll be able to pull the trigger on an oven. Although all options still are open, I'm leaning heavily towards La Reggia Foni, as he's been very good at responding to my messages, and generally been very helpful. Right now talks are about the look of the oven, as I've always been fascinated by the small mosaics of SF and similar ovens, but he's more into the larger mosaics. It's not really a dealbreaker.

Still haven't heard from Saputo, but saw an instagram post with somebody that waited for 9 months before just getting their biscotto.


Offline HansB

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Re: Need a new oven
« Reply #7 on: June 25, 2019, 07:10:48 AM »
Hans

Offline Kermit

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Re: Need a new oven
« Reply #8 on: June 25, 2019, 08:46:11 AM »
Have you seen these: https://www.gozney.com/uk/products/commercial-ovens/
Yes I have been looking a bit at those before, but they are ridicolously priced. 7150 gbp for a 100x100 oven is more than af Stefano Ferrara oven! That's just too much, especially since it's not even a true brick oven.

Offline Kermit

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Re: Need a new oven
« Reply #9 on: June 27, 2019, 03:29:26 AM »
Moving into the design phase of things. La Reggia Forni are the ones I've had most contact with lately, and are most likely to end up with my order. For that reason I've made designs out of their ovens. I still can't really make up my mind about which direction to go, as there are so many versions that look awesome. The original idea was to make an oven with dark navy mosaic and then in pink/rose mosaic make stripes and write "Rosalita" on the oven.

A lot of the designs from La Reggia Forni they use a larger stone on the exterior that also looks great. Especially if they're in a matte color. So I've done some different designs, but have still to make up my mind.

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Offline Kermit

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Re: Need a new oven
« Reply #10 on: June 30, 2019, 01:47:03 AM »
About 3-4 hours after making my last post, everything shifted once again. I've actually ended up with putting down an order on an Artistica Salernitana oven, and for a couple of different reasons.

First and foremost, they're 1100 euros cheaper than La Reggia Forni. Now, the latter makes beautiful ovens and have a nicer design than AS, BUT 1100 is a lot of money for design. If I can't live with the design of the AS, I can see if I can add some mass and make it the shape I want.

Communication is a lot easier with AS. They write in English, and are pretty quick to reply.

It kinda just went out of hand, with me wanting something bitter and more true than my trusted pizza party oven, and before I knew it I was looking at ovens that were around 3000 euros and thinking that I wanted one.

So, right now we have an agreement of them supplying me with a 100 cm oven. Standard price was 1400 euros, and then I wanted to have writing in the iron opening, which was 50 euros extra. I'm still a bit uncertain if they have completely changed to a new design, which I love, or it's a step up pricing wise, but I've sent them this mockup.

Offline Simone

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Re: Need a new oven
« Reply #11 on: June 30, 2019, 07:58:00 AM »
Hi Kermit
Medium number of pizzas a the same time?
Max budget?

Offline Kermit

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Re: Need a new oven
« Reply #12 on: July 02, 2019, 05:01:31 AM »
Hi Kermit
Medium number of pizzas a the same time?
Max budget?

2-3, but have already found what I was looking for  :D

Offline Kermit

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Re: Need a new oven
« Reply #13 on: July 02, 2019, 05:16:56 AM »
Thought it would be fun to share what ovens actually cost. The ovens are anywhere from 80 to 105 cm in internal diameter. All of them on a metal stand.

Artistica Salernitana - 1400 euros (100 cm)
Reppuccia Forni - 1800 euros (100 cm)
Zio Ciro Subito Cotto - 1900 euros (95 cm)
Forni Pavesi mod. Casetta - 2900 euros (115x95 cm)
Stefano Ferrara - 5500 euros (90 cm)
MP Forni - 3300 - 3600 euros (100 cm) depending on oven design
Manna Forni - 4500 euros (100 cm)
Forni Aversa - 2800 euros (100 cm)
Di Costanzo - 4500 euros (100 cm)
Forno Napoletano - 7750 euros (100 cm)
Strazzullo - 4000 euros (100 cm)
Zazzaro forni - 6000 euros (100 cm)
Forni Medaglia - 5500 euros (100 cm)
La Reggia Forni - 2500 euros (105 cm)
Forni Grimaldi - 6000 euros (100 cm)
Forni Altobelli - 3700 euros (105 cm)

So quite a price range.

Offline Tscarborough

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Re: Need a new oven
« Reply #14 on: July 05, 2019, 02:33:11 PM »
And to build one yourself? Less than a thousand Euros.

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Offline Kermit

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Re: Need a new oven
« Reply #15 on: July 11, 2019, 03:05:55 AM »
And to build one yourself? Less than a thousand Euros.
Well, that was an option as well. But just buying the bricks from Naples would probably run close to a thousand euros, plus my patience would be challenged constantly  :-D
« Last Edit: July 11, 2019, 03:07:58 AM by Kermit »

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