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Offline exchicagogal

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Supreme Pizza Proportions
« on: July 18, 2019, 08:36:12 PM »
Hi Friend,

I'm making up a supreme pizza using the Pete's PJ clone (a great great formulation) and I was curious if any one had any idea/advice about topping proportions. Obviously, some of this is personal preference but I made one up last week and while it was tasty, I felt like I over shot the amount of toppings needed( it actually reminded my partner and I a lot of Costco's supreme :) ). I made a 12 inch pizza on my 14 inch DoughJoe Steel. I used green peppers, pepperoni, homemade pork sausage balls. I ended up putting my veggies under and over my cheese.

Any advice on how to prep this (under cheese versus over cheese toppings) and a rough guideline of how much the chains use for a pizza like this? Also, any advice on sauce portioning is appreciated as well.

Thanks!

Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Supreme Pizza Proportions
« Reply #1 on: July 20, 2019, 01:44:29 PM »
exchicagogal,

I believe that at one time Papa John's may have used the word "Supreme" in reference to an "everything" pizza but today it uses the expression The Works for such a pizza. And if you go to the PJ website at https://www.papajohns.com/company/nutritional-details/index.html you will see that that pizza has the following toppings: A heaping helping of premium pepperoni, julienne-cut Canadian bacon, spicy Italian sausage, fresh-sliced onions, crisp green peppers, Crimini mushrooms and ripe black olives.

Out of curiosity, I wondered how much a PJ 12" (medium) The Works pizza weighs, on the assumption that you have such a pizza size in mind. I suspected that if I looked at the PJ nutrition information as given at the above PJ website for a medium The Works pizza, I would not find any information from which I would be able to calculate the weight of the pizza. That turns out to be the case. Some time ago, PJ stopped putting weight information for slices at its website. This is something that I previously discussed in detail at Reply 1435 at:

https://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=6758.msg551058#msg551058

Not to be denied, I decided to go to the Nutritionix website to see if I could find information to be able to calculate the weight of a 12" The Works pizza. I had to search the Nutritionix database but I came up with the answer at:

https://www.nutritionix.com/i/papa-johns/the-works-pizza-original-crust-medium/513fc998927da704080047e3

So, a single slice weighs 110 grams. With eight slices for a 12" pizza, the total weight comes to 880 grams, or about 31 ounces. That is for a baked pizza so one would have to increase that number by some percent to get to the weight of the pizza as unbaked. I would guess about a 10-12% increase. Importantly, you will also note that the nutrition information given at the Nutritionix website is the same as given at the PJ website referenced above. That is good news.

I went through the above exercise because trying to bake a PJ clone pizza--and especially one with a lot of toppings and also wet toppings like vegetables--in a standard home oven is not the same as baking in an air impingement oven, which is the type of oven used by PJ in its stores. Air impingement ovens move a lot of air across the tops of pizzas and controls the moisture characteristics of the pizzas so as not to end up with what Tom Lehmann often calls a "swamp pizza". You can see his comments on this distinction as well as some of Tom's advice when using a home oven at Reply 1 at:

https://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=19652.msg192391#msg192391

In my own case, when I made PJ clone pizzas with a lot of toppings I weighed the cheeses, sauces and toppings and I experimented with how to incorporate these items on the pizzas. I also sometimes sautéed items like sliced mushrooms, and I sometimes partially pre-cooked veggies in my microwave oven to release some of the moisture content. I also moved my pizzas around the oven and sometimes used the broiler if necessary to get all of the items cooked and a crust that was not gummy because of all the moisture. You can see examples of some of the methods I used to build pizzas with a fair amount of toppings at these posts:

Reply 24 at https://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=6758.msg59357#msg59357,

Reply 30 at https://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=6758.msg59762#msg59762, and

Reply 31 at https://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=6758.msg60076#msg60076

In your case, you may fare better making a 12" "supreme" pizza than the 14" size pizzas that I made, simply because the 12" pizza will weigh less than a 14" pizza. For example, a 14" PJ The Works pizza weighs around 44 ounces, baked, and more once that number is increased to get to the unbaked pizza weight. Remember, also, that I used pizza screens, just as PJ does in its stores. If you plan to use your 14" steel, you may have to take into account the different bake characteristics of the steel as opposed to using a screen.

Good luck and let us know if you proceed and the results you achieve. And if you weigh the unbaked and baked pizza, it would be nice to see the numbers for future reference.

Peter


Offline Chicago Bob

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Re: Supreme Pizza Proportions
« Reply #2 on: July 20, 2019, 07:05:32 PM »
I often hold back my sliced onion and green pepper and apply them to top of the pizza for the final 4 or 5 minutes of the bake. I really like the fresher appearance and texture/taste. Bonus, the water is in them and not drowning the rest of your pie.  :chef:
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Offline elgary

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Re: Supreme Pizza Proportions
« Reply #3 on: July 27, 2019, 03:35:33 PM »
When I make my version of a supreme pizza, using Pete's PJ clone formulation, for a 14 inch pizza, (which I call American Artisanal style,  ;D), with a TF of .13, I use, 4 oz. of sauce, 250 grams of cheese, 12 pepperoni slices, 3 regular size ham slices cut in quarters, 1 turkey frankfurter, bacon, cut in small slices, the amount is not exact, I just put whatever I can grab with five fingers, same as I do with the Mexican chorizo crumbles, then the mushrooms, same amount, five fingers, not a fistfull, as well as the chopped green peppers, and finally the onions, speaking of which, now that I look at the photo, I should had chopped the onion, it would had looked better.

I have never thought about finding out the final weight of the cooked pizza, so I guess next time I make one, I will weight it.

I am copying Pete-zza's way of showing the pizza, with an "In the box" picture, hope that helps.

Gary.





Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Supreme Pizza Proportions
« Reply #4 on: July 27, 2019, 04:52:04 PM »
Gary,

Your "supreme" pizza looks good to me. Does that style go over well with pizza eaters where you are in Mexico?

I hope you do weigh your next "supreme" pizza just to see how the weight stacks up against the The Works pizza from Papa John's.

Peter

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Offline elgary

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Re: Supreme Pizza Proportions
« Reply #5 on: July 27, 2019, 11:09:53 PM »
Gary,

Your "supreme" pizza looks good to me. Does that style go over well with pizza eaters where you are in Mexico?

I hope you do weigh your next "supreme" pizza just to see how the weight stacks up against the The Works pizza from Papa John's.

Peter

Peter

Yes, I was actually a little surprised that they liked the style, I mean, I knew that people here liked American style pizza, loaded with toppings and a thick crust, and call me crazy but I love that style too!

What I didn't know, was if they would like the American Artisanal style of pizza, and they sure did! At least the about a hundred people that have tried it, loved it! And it is all thanks to you Peter!

Most people here, (at least the people I know here and close to my neighborhood) are used to pale, colorless pizza, baked in not so hot, Mexican deck ovens, so they did like the change of looks and flavors on their pizza baked for ~4 minutes, in a 680-700 degrees brick oven. And so did I  ;D.

Next time I have a pizza party, I will weight the "supreme" Peter.

And again, I will never get tired of thanking you for all your help, you are the man Peter.

Have a nice one.

Gary.

Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Supreme Pizza Proportions
« Reply #6 on: July 28, 2019, 11:04:00 AM »
Gary,

Thank you for the overly kind remarks. However, you should take credit and pride in what you have done in taking dough formulations intended for the US market and adapting them to use in the Acapulco market where you live, and where the ingredients available to you are not as good as those available in the US. Also, your use of your oven that is not a home oven is commendable in creating an artisanal version of the PJ pizza.

I appreciate that you will weigh your next "supreme" pizza. If possible, it would also be nice to know the weight of the pizza unbaked. In my PJ clone experiments, I used a screen and I would weigh the unbaked pizzas on the screen and subtract the weight of the screen to get to the actual unbaked weights. If your approach does not lend itself to weighing an unbaked pizza, that's OK. I will take the baked weight.

Peter

Offline elgary

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Re: Supreme Pizza Proportions
« Reply #7 on: July 28, 2019, 12:00:30 PM »
Gary,


I appreciate that you will weigh your next "supreme" pizza. If possible, it would also be nice to know the weight of the pizza unbaked. In my PJ clone experiments, I used a screen and I would weigh the unbaked pizzas on the screen and subtract the weight of the screen to get to the actual unbaked weights. If your approach does not lend itself to weighing an unbaked pizza, that I OK. I will take the baked weight.

Peter

I've got you Peter, I will do that for you next time I make one, which should be pretty soon, since I am really trying to master the artisanal version of the PJ pizza!

Have a nice one!

Gary

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