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Author Topic: Dave from Barstool Sports threatens employees who try to unionize  (Read 837 times)

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Offline nick57

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 I enjoy watching this guy do slice reviews. Sometimes he seems a little overbearing. After reading this not sure what to think about him. I am not a big fan of unions but I think Dave went a little too far. Will probably watch his reviews but with a jaded eye from now on.
https://variety.com/2019/digital/news/barstool-sports-threatens-to-fire-employees-union-organization-1203300790/#article-comments

Offline pizzaboyfan

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Re: Dave from Barstool Sports threatens employees who try to unionize
« Reply #1 on: August 13, 2019, 06:05:44 PM »
One toot Dave couldnít find Italy on a map.
If you want some fun, google Dave Portnoy and Super Bowl.
Not sure what you have to do to be banned by the NFL, but he managed.

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Dave from Barstool Sports threatens employees who try to unionize
« Reply #2 on: August 13, 2019, 08:04:21 PM »
Not sure what you have to do to be banned by the NFL,

Ask Papa John   :-D
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Offline pizzaboyfan

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Re: Dave from Barstool Sports threatens employees who try to unionize
« Reply #3 on: August 13, 2019, 10:39:13 PM »
Both of these guys are a danger to themselves.

Offline jkb

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Re: Dave from Barstool Sports threatens employees who try to unionize
« Reply #4 on: August 14, 2019, 07:05:25 AM »
Management and labor need to be pragmatic and meet halfway.  It's a win/win.
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Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Dave from Barstool Sports threatens employees who try to unionize
« Reply #5 on: August 14, 2019, 07:15:13 AM »
Management and labor need to be pragmatic and meet halfway.  It's a win/win.

More times than not, that actually results in lose/lose.
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Offline jkb

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Re: Dave from Barstool Sports threatens employees who try to unionize
« Reply #6 on: August 14, 2019, 07:43:35 AM »
More times than not, that actually results in lose/lose.

'Splain me.  I'm talking about good pay and benefits and the flexibility for employees to adapt their jobs to changing market demands.
« Last Edit: August 14, 2019, 07:46:46 AM by jkb »
John

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Dave from Barstool Sports threatens employees who try to unionize
« Reply #7 on: August 14, 2019, 09:21:50 AM »
'Splain me.  I'm talking about good pay and benefits and the flexibility for employees to adapt their jobs to changing market demands.

Me too. However, "meeting halfway" is almost always a balance of profit and politics and almost never a balance of what's best for anyone (except the company/union leaders as individuals). The company's side of the balance is almost always profit, and the union's side is almost always  internal politics (I'm not referring to party politics). There is no balance between the two that is win/win. A key problem is that the huge labor inefficiencies (work rules, RIF rules, misaligned union/employee incentives, etc.) driven by internal union politics is not compatible with higher pay in the profit side of the balance. At the end of the day, union employees often end up getting paid less to do less which is a lose/lose. There are no shortage of examples of employees of non-union shops making more than their unionized counterparts while the unionized shop runs higher labor cost despite union employees getting paid less.
« Last Edit: August 14, 2019, 09:23:27 AM by TXCraig1 »
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Offline Stichus III

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Re: Dave from Barstool Sports threatens employees who try to unionize
« Reply #8 on: August 14, 2019, 09:29:38 AM »
It's usually neither win/win nor lose/lose. It is usually a zero-sum game.

But back to Dave Portnoy's pizza reviews: I am skeptical of his reviews. He gave John's of Bleecker one of his very top scores (a 9.3), while for example giving Motorino, Paulie Gee's and Juliana's, relatively low scores. That can't be right. 

Offline HansB

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Re: Dave from Barstool Sports threatens employees who try to unionize
« Reply #9 on: August 14, 2019, 10:30:41 AM »
It's usually neither win/win nor lose/lose. It is usually a zero-sum game.

But back to Dave Portnoy's pizza reviews: I am skeptical of his reviews. He gave John's of Bleecker one of his very top scores (a 9.3), while for example giving Motorino, Paulie Gee's and Juliana's, relatively low scores. That can't be right.

Any given day...

At Paulie Gee's I think he caught them on a bad day. Paulie Gee's is as good as any slice in NYC.
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Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Dave from Barstool Sports threatens employees who try to unionize
« Reply #10 on: August 14, 2019, 10:58:17 AM »
It's usually neither win/win nor lose/lose. It is usually a zero-sum game.

Both win/win and lose/lose can be zero-sum. Value can be and is often destroyed with deals that are bad for everyone, which is common when going into negotiations with a split-the-baby mindset.
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Offline Stichus III

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Re: Dave from Barstool Sports threatens employees who try to unionize
« Reply #11 on: August 14, 2019, 11:44:54 AM »
Both win/win and lose/lose can be zero-sum. Value can be and is often destroyed with deals that are bad for everyone, which is common when going into negotiations with a split-the-baby mindset.

This is a very interesting discussion.

It's zero-sum when the gains or losses of one party is balanced by the losses or gains of the opposing party. That basically rules out a win/win or lose/lose in a zero-sum situation.

A deal that is excellent for unionized employees, is indeed bad for the employer, possibly bad for the customers of this company and possibly even bad for a lot of other people, but such a deal is still good for the unionized employees. As such I don't agree that such a situation is necessarily bad for "everybody".

I do agree that unions can cause a lot of harm. This when they demand too much from employers, especially when the employer is a small and/or fledgling business. But unions can also do a lot of good. Employees are really only in a position to truly negotiate with medium to large companies, when they unionize.

Like anything else, unions can be a good thing or they can be a bad thing. Before condemning unions, we should first ask what they are fighting for.   
« Last Edit: August 14, 2019, 11:52:42 AM by Stichus III »

Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Dave from Barstool Sports threatens employees who try to unionize
« Reply #12 on: August 14, 2019, 12:00:15 PM »
This is a very interesting discussion.

It's zero-sum when the gains or losses of one party is balanced by the losses or gains of the opposing party. That basically rules out a win/win or lose/lose in a zero-sum situation.

A deal that is excellent for unionized employees, is indeed bad for the employer, bad for the customers of this company and possibly even bad for a lot of other people, but such a deal is still good for the unionized employees. As such I don't agree that such a situation is necessarily bad for "everybody".   

I have two otherwise identical factories, one is union, one isn't.

My company policy is to pay non-union employees 10% more than their union counterparts. If the union negotiates a new CBA with higher pay, the non-union employees automatically get  the same raise + 10%. Notwithstanding the higher pay, my non-union factory runs a lower labor cost because of the work rules in the union plant.

The impact of the CBA is zero-sum, but it's also lose/lose.  Both the company and the employees make less money at the union plant vis-a-vis the non-union plant.
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Offline ira

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Re: Dave from Barstool Sports threatens employees who try to unionize
« Reply #13 on: August 14, 2019, 01:40:36 PM »
Years ago I spent 2 weeks in the Detroit Diesel Allison Parts Distribution Warehouse helping finish the install of their first computerized robotic parts retrieval system.  I was their because our terminals kept dying, turns out because coffee and soda kept getting spilled on the keyboards. Weirdly, because of the union rules when that happened the employees working that section swept the floor and then read or played cards till the end of their shift, just like they did when there were only 4 hours of orders to pull. When I asked why the didn't do something else, I was told the Union rules said they could only do their job. I redesigned the keyboard so when they intentionally poured coffee on the keyboard, it didn't break. But I'm sure in the end my company lost money on that project due to the behavior of those very senior union employees. That convinced me that unions are bad, and even if they aren't at the moment, they are much to likely to end up all about power and money for the leaders.


Ira

Offline Stichus III

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Re: Dave from Barstool Sports threatens employees who try to unionize
« Reply #14 on: August 14, 2019, 03:36:42 PM »
I have two otherwise identical factories, one is union, one isn't.

My company policy is to pay non-union employees 10% more than their union counterparts. If the union negotiates a new CBA with higher pay, the non-union employees automatically get  the same raise + 10%. Notwithstanding the higher pay, my non-union factory runs a lower labor cost because of the work rules in the union plant.

The impact of the CBA is zero-sum, but it's also lose/lose.  Both the company and the employees make less money at the union plant vis-a-vis the non-union plant.

A person who joins a union must suffer no discrimination in any term or condition of employment to discourage membership in any labor organization. That is the law in most if not all developed countries, including the USA (see 29 USC ß158). The above company policy appears to be an unfair labor practice (and I don't pretend to be a lawyer or a union member). As such the example does not work.

I stand by my earlier post.

My apologies for going so off topic.

 


 

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Offline TXCraig1

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Re: Dave from Barstool Sports threatens employees who try to unionize
« Reply #15 on: August 14, 2019, 04:32:33 PM »
A person who joins a union must suffer no discrimination in any term or condition of employment to discourage membership in any labor organization. That is the law in most if not all developed countries, including the USA (see 29 USC ß158). The above company policy appears to be an unfair labor practice (and I don't pretend to be a lawyer or a union member). As such the example does not work.

I stand by my earlier post.

My apologies for going so off topic.

Different facilities, no discrimination, but if you disagree, make them two separate and entirely unrelated businesses. As such the example does work: both are zero sum, but the sum is lower where the union work rules create inefficiencies that destroy value = loss/loss. Q.E.D.

I stand by my earlier post.

"We make great pizza, with sourdough when we can, baker's yeast when we must, but always great pizza."  
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Offline nick57

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Re: Dave from Barstool Sports threatens employees who try to unionize
« Reply #16 on: August 14, 2019, 05:32:50 PM »
Me too. However, "meeting halfway" is almost always a balance of profit and politics and almost never a balance of what's best for anyone (except the company/union leaders as individuals). The company's side of the balance is almost always profit, and the union's side is almost always  internal politics (I'm not referring to party politics). There is no balance between the two that is win/win. A key problem is that the huge labor inefficiencies (work rules, RIF rules, misaligned union/employee incentives, etc.) driven by internal union politics is not compatible with higher pay in the profit side of the balance. At the end of the day, union employees often end up getting paid less to do less which is a lose/lose. There are no shortage of examples of employees of non-union shops making more than their unionized counterparts while the unionized shop runs higher labor cost despite union employees getting paid less.

 I worked in a union plant, though I was in management.  There were a couple of strikes over the years. What I found strange is management always offered better deals than what the union offered their employees. The higher ups in the union forced the employees to take their package. I worked with the union employees and was good friends with quite a few of them. They knew they had got screwed by the union, but the higher up's ruled with an iron fist.  The union was the American Transport Workers. Funny thing...the members worked on assembly lines and the product had nothing to do with transport.

Offline jeff v

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Re: Dave from Barstool Sports threatens employees who try to unionize
« Reply #17 on: August 14, 2019, 07:40:20 PM »
I donít know if itís the case here or not but Iíve heard the Barstool guys troll people and each other with stuff like this.

Offline Andrew Bellucci

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Re: Dave from Barstool Sports threatens employees who try to unionize
« Reply #18 on: August 14, 2019, 10:32:27 PM »
I donít know if itís the case here or not but Iíve heard the Barstool guys troll people and each other with stuff like this.

And we have a winner!!!

Professional troller and people took the bait - hook, line & sinker.
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You bet on how the horse finishes.

Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Dave from Barstool Sports threatens employees who try to unionize
« Reply #19 on: August 15, 2019, 08:40:02 AM »
Dave Portnoy appeared last night on the Tucker Carlson segment on Fox:



Peter

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