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Author Topic: Ooni koda 16 first bakes  (Read 25472 times)

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Offline Caaleb

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Re: Ooni koda 16 first bakes
« Reply #320 on: January 21, 2021, 03:45:50 AM »
Hey guys. Iím trying to make a perfect 16in NY style in my K16 and itís driving me nuts. Yes I know this oven is not meant for that. I mostly need help with my dough formula.

Iím having issues with the back left corner running WAY hotter than anywhere else. And just the entire stone heat being so uneven. When I launch a larger pie, it would be nice to turn it fairly quickly, so the back left bottom doesnít burn, but the entire front, especially front right is totally raw. Iíve ripped so many pizzas trying to turn raw dough. Also itís so cramped trying to launch bigger pizzas.

I turned to a 16in pizza screen. I dress and than just slid the pizza screen into the oven. I can easily just pull the screen out and quarter turn as soon as Iíd like. Than after maybe a min or two once the dough is set up I can pop the pizza off the screen and into the stone. Iíve also found that preheating with a baking sheet in front of the oven helps.

This works decently well. The screen helps me get perfectly round 16in pizzas, as well as not having to use bench flour, which burned easily in my experience.  Iím just having issues with formulating a dough recipe to fit my somewhat unique cooking method. I think my oven spring is suffering. Iím dealing with dryer and tougher crusts than Iíd like. Iím definitely struggle with over baking.

Iím going for crispy on bottom, light airy crust. If those are all possible together.

Right now Iím using txcraig 48 RT np formula with some tweaks. Mostly just using malted flour, sometimes oil and higher hydration. I like the natural fermentation method. Playing with hydrationís from 62-66%

I have all types of flour, KA AP, KABF, unmalted high gluten flour, 00 unmalted, rye, ww. I was trying combos but Iím using just KA AP right now to simplify and not work with too many variables.

Iíve been launching with the center around 750-800ish. Iíve recently been having more success with bottom crispyness, but at the expense of seemly dry and tough crusts. I not an expert in dough formulas.

Iím thinking to get better oven spring I need to use a higher flame than I am. Iím using a fairly low flame, where you turn past the off button. I have no idea really if malted or unmalted would be better. Iím really thinking higher hydration must be better for not drying out your crust with extended baked. But it doesnít seem to be that simple. I do have the advantage of not having to launch, making high hydration easier. Sugar + unmalted vs malted flour?

Maybe if I used HH unmalted + no browning agents I could get the flame really high and get nice oven spring without burning on the screen.

This was my last attempt.
62 h
3 salt
2 culture

I think Iíll go back to oil 2% and try 63% h Last pic is under belly of dough ball right before stretched.

Iím only a year into pizza making. Yes I wish I had just gotten a nice big steel lol.









« Last Edit: January 21, 2021, 04:01:15 AM by Caaleb »

Offline barryvabeach

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Re: Ooni koda 16 first bakes
« Reply #321 on: January 21, 2021, 07:04:03 AM »
Caaleb,  I can't help with the dough formula,  while I am for a NY ish style,  I am using 100% home milled whole wheat, so it is a different animal.  On the rear corner being too hot,  Don has come up with a fantastic hack -  extremely inexpensive and completely reversible,  https://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=61419.msg644233#msg644233      I had the same issues you did with having the rear corner get too hot, and the front not hot enough.  Many have made smaller pizzas - say around 12 inch diameter, and don't have that problem, but IME, are you get closer to 14 or 15,  it gets really tough to spin it enough to keep the rear from burning, and not tearing the pizza.   I have a small turning peel, and have not had that much success with that,  and usually have done better with using a metal peel and lifting the entire pie, and rotating it.   Though Don and I have both gone to rotating stones so I don't manually turn the pie anymore.

Offline morrissey

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Re: Ooni koda 16 first bakes
« Reply #322 on: January 21, 2021, 10:57:59 PM »
Some pizza's from last weekend. 16" pies at 70% hydration with sourdough starter. Slightly out of focus photo. Trying to make a mix between NY bottom with Neapolitan crust.  Visually the pizza at https://www.instagram.com/makerpizza/ is what inspires me.

Offline Caaleb

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Re: Ooni koda 16 first bakes
« Reply #323 on: January 22, 2021, 03:07:18 AM »
Caaleb,  I can't help with the dough formula,  while I am for a NY ish style,  I am using 100% home milled whole wheat, so it is a different animal.  On the rear corner being too hot,  Don has come up with a fantastic hack -  extremely inexpensive and completely reversible,  https://www.pizzamaking.com/forum/index.php?topic=61419.msg644233#msg644233      I had the same issues you did with having the rear corner get too hot, and the front not hot enough.  Many have made smaller pizzas - say around 12 inch diameter, and don't have that problem, but IME, are you get closer to 14 or 15,  it gets really tough to spin it enough to keep the rear from burning, and not tearing the pizza.   I have a small turning peel, and have not had that much success with that,  and usually have done better with using a metal peel and lifting the entire pie, and rotating it.   Though Don and I have both gone to rotating stones so I don't manually turn the pie anymore.

Thanks! Iím gonna do this

Offline vincentoc13

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Re: Ooni koda 16 first bakes
« Reply #324 on: January 23, 2021, 10:06:57 PM »
6min 14 inch on Koda 16 - Pepperoni, spicy sausage  and hot Calabrese Salami I

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Offline barryvabeach

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Re: Ooni koda 16 first bakes
« Reply #325 on: January 24, 2021, 07:33:09 AM »
Very nice pie.   Tell us how you did it -  how long you preheated, how high , what flame height while the pizza was cooking, and how often you turned. 

Offline vincentoc13

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Re: Ooni koda 16 first bakes
« Reply #326 on: January 24, 2021, 11:32:19 PM »
Very nice pie.   Tell us how you did it -  how long you preheated, how high , what flame height while the pizza was cooking, and how often you turned.
Thank you.  I usually place a piece of tin foil that spans across the opening of the oven about half the height of the opening and let it pre heat on low for about 15min.  It gets well into the high 800's, then I remove the foil and lower the heat to the ultra low setting, maybe 1 inch high flame and then start making a pizza.  By the time I launch its in the low 700's at its hottest spot on the deck.  Once the pizza's on the deck I turn off the flame for 1 1/2 min, after that I rotate it 180į then turn the flame to 1/2 to 1 inch high flame for the rest of the cook (6-7mins), I turn it every 20 sec, if I see it needs more browning I turn up the flame to standard low setting for a few seconds.
« Last Edit: January 25, 2021, 12:14:37 AM by vincentoc13 »

Offline barryvabeach

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Re: Ooni koda 16 first bakes
« Reply #327 on: January 25, 2021, 06:57:59 AM »
Thanks for the detailed response.

Offline Minolta Rokkor

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Re: Ooni koda 16 first bakes
« Reply #328 on: January 28, 2021, 11:31:48 AM »
The Ooni Pro works great for NY style. I keep the burner going pretty much full blast, then right when I launch the pie drop it down to almost as low as it will go. Works great, gets a good rise and a nice crisp crust. (Couple of pics attached for reference. I don't have any underside pics, but the bottom gets nice and brown).
and you just sold me this oven!
Pizza is about balance, nothing more nothing less

Offline Troy3950

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Re: Ooni koda 16 first bakes
« Reply #329 on: January 31, 2021, 07:33:31 AM »
My Koda 16 is getting ready to ship but really thinking about canceling before they ship it out after reading all this. I ordered it in November with the $100 off special they had. Might just end up going with the Pro or just sticking with my Bakerstone grill box.

Would you all say this is a great oven for Neapolitan style but not so great for NY style?

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Offline barryvabeach

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Re: Ooni koda 16 first bakes
« Reply #330 on: January 31, 2021, 02:15:25 PM »
Actually,  I think it will do a nice job for NY style.  If you go for very high temps, and a full size 15 inch to 16 inch pie, the temp difference between the front and back is pretty large, so you have to be pretty good at turning (which I am not ). 

Offline theorangeman

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Re: Ooni koda 16 first bakes
« Reply #331 on: February 05, 2021, 11:49:40 AM »
I've read every post in this thread because I was thinking that I would purchase the Koda 16.  However the uneven heating is concerning, even though it seems like there are some ways to combat this.  That said, I just saw a thread about the new Carbon Pizza oven.  You can check it out at https://cookwithcarbon.com

It's essentially the same price but seems like they got the heating right with the addition of a heating source below.  I don't mean to hyjack this thread, but my question for you Koda 16 owners, now that you've owned your oven for a little while, would you purchase this again now or consider something else, like the Carbon Pizza oven?  I'm very curious as to why, either way.

Offline Peter B

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Re: Ooni koda 16 first bakes
« Reply #332 on: February 05, 2021, 12:00:04 PM »
Interesting oven.  I am not an early adopter, soI would be curious to see what others think after using it.  My main issue with this though (and likely a deal breaker) is the size of the cooking surface.  I want to do 16" pies or bigger if I could.
I said to my little one, "come here so I can change you".
He said "change only comes from within".  :-/

Offline barryvabeach

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Re: Ooni koda 16 first bakes
« Reply #333 on: February 05, 2021, 08:17:03 PM »
Peter,  if you wanted to go with a full 16 inch pie, it would fit in the oven, but I think Neapolitan would be difficult if not impossible.  If you can live with a lower temp - say 700,  and did Don's hack with nails in a few of the holes in the left rear corner,  or put in a rotating stone and got your launching skills to the point that you could get a 16 inch pie right onto a 16 inch stone,  that would work.  BTW,  I previously owned an Ardore, which used a totally different burner system, but you still had the same issues is that as the pie gets bigger, it gets closer to the outer walls of the oven, which increases the temp differential, which makes it harder to get an evenly cooked pie.   Ideally, you would find an 18 inch oven, but I don't know of any gas ones that are reasonably priced.

Offline Peter B

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Re: Ooni koda 16 first bakes
« Reply #334 on: February 05, 2021, 08:23:57 PM »
Sorry Barry - I was referring to the Carbon oven mentioned above.

I waffle between the Koda 16 and just going for the Pro.  I really do not have much interest in using anything besides gas, but the Pro is obviously more user friendly to a NY style.  The Koda 16 is more attractive, but needs some hacks.  Good thing I don't need to make a decision for a while yet.  Maybe a year from now there will be something that hits a sweet spot.
I said to my little one, "come here so I can change you".
He said "change only comes from within".  :-/

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Offline theorangeman

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Re: Ooni koda 16 first bakes
« Reply #335 on: February 05, 2021, 09:15:01 PM »
Wonderful, I finally decide this evening to bite the bullet and purchase the carbon pizza oven.  I go to their site, and now, they're out of stock.   >:(

Offline Jackie Tran

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Re: Ooni koda 16 first bakes
« Reply #336 on: February 09, 2021, 09:17:06 PM »
Here are my first bakes in the K16 and my 2 cents worth. 
My first bake was NY style.  On a 2nd stone on top of a lazy susan on top of the original stone.   I didn't have the stone thoroughly heat soaked and the bottom had barely any color on it.  For the 2nd pie, I removed the lazy susan and baked on a different 2nd stone and  again light bottom.   On the 3rd pie I placed a steel in there over the original stone and loaded at a higher floor tenp and got a better result.  Going forward, for  NY bakes I don't think any mods are necessary at all at this point.   I plan on redoing this NY bake just on the originally stone and turning the flame down.  I'll post the results when I get there. 
« Last Edit: February 09, 2021, 09:35:08 PM by Jackie Tran »

Offline Jackie Tran

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Re: Ooni koda 16 first bakes
« Reply #337 on: February 09, 2021, 09:28:38 PM »
Here's my first NP bake.  I made a make shift door to shorten the heat up time and baked directly on the original floor.   I also baked with the make shift door on for the first 1/2-3/4 of the bake.

1st pie.  Floor temp 850f? 90secs.  Was ok.
2nd pie.  Floor temp 900f? High flame.  50s bake.  Nice.
3rd pie.  Floor temp 1000f. High flame. 50-60s bake.  Good but #2 was better.

No mods other than the make shift door needed.  Used a small turning peel to turn the pies.  This oven is capable of making sub 60s NPs all the way to a 6min NY pie.  It's just a matter of loading at a specific floor temp, dialing in the upper flame, and turning the pie.  The make shift door will help even out the floor temps. 

Chau

« Last Edit: February 10, 2021, 08:12:18 AM by Jackie Tran »

Offline barryvabeach

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Re: Ooni koda 16 first bakes
« Reply #338 on: February 10, 2021, 07:07:11 AM »
Nice work.  Don and I both found that when working with a larger pie, a lot of turning is needed to avoid burning the section closest to the left corner, especially at normal flame heights, so we both pursued turntables.  Don also experimented with blocking a few of the holes in that corner.  Glad to see you got good results with the stock floor.  I agree that it also makes a good NY style.

Offline Jackie Tran

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Re: Ooni koda 16 first bakes
« Reply #339 on: February 10, 2021, 08:10:40 AM »
You are right.   For a 16" pie I would absolutely use the lazy susan or install a turn table and bake with a door on. 

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