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Author Topic: Simple Dough Rising Measurement Trick  (Read 19798 times)

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Offline Essen1

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Re: Simple Dough Rising Measurement Trick
« Reply #20 on: June 11, 2009, 12:57:34 PM »
'I'm sorry you're too dim to imagine'

Continental drift? The Earth is moving?

And I thought the Earth was flat! What the...??  ???
Mike

“All styles of pizza are valid. I make the best I’m capable of; you should make the best you’re capable of. I don’t want to make somebody else’s pizza.” ~ Chris Bianco

Offline NY pizzastriver

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Re: Simple Dough Rising Measurement Trick
« Reply #21 on: June 11, 2009, 01:26:59 PM »
Continental drift? The Earth is moving?

And I thought the Earth was flat! What the...??  ???

Lol Mike, nope, and I am disappointed you didn't know that.

Ok all accusations and nastiness aside, I decided to try this method in a new revised manner taking all the updated elements into play.

First I had to make a US shaped dough ball, just whipped it up between posts. I know it's not the whole continent, but I am limited in my pizza stone size. Then, to ensure I was covering more than one surface area I applied 3 rows of plastic people standing on the dough surface held together by a rope in ''tug of war'' formation. My conclusions will be made from either a broken rope, or 1/2 the people fallen on their faces. If the second occurs I will then measure the drag marks the bodies made through the dough over time. This should prove to be fascinating and educational. Here's the dough so far...
« Last Edit: June 11, 2009, 01:28:51 PM by NY pizzastriver »
"If God said you can come to heaven now, but you have to stop eating my pizza, you'd stay and finish instead, right?" - Essen1

Offline November

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Re: Simple Dough Rising Measurement Trick
« Reply #22 on: June 11, 2009, 01:38:16 PM »
And I thought the Earth was flat! What the...??  ???

It is, Mike.  In fact, it's 51799081561521 inches in diameter with a thickness factor of 0.10; and there's no escaping the anchovies in the sauce.

Offline Essen1

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Re: Simple Dough Rising Measurement Trick
« Reply #23 on: June 11, 2009, 02:59:52 PM »
Quote
It is, Mike.

I knew it!!

So we all going to fall off the face of the Earth if the continents keep drifting apart. That's the end of the world! I gotta go and make more dough before everything ends and panic sets in!!  :'(

Be back later...
Mike

“All styles of pizza are valid. I make the best I’m capable of; you should make the best you’re capable of. I don’t want to make somebody else’s pizza.” ~ Chris Bianco

Offline holly821

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Re: Simple Dough Rising Measurement Trick
« Reply #24 on: September 27, 2017, 03:43:07 PM »
A while back, member November showed me a neat little trick to be able to tell how much a dough ball has risen. It is an extremely simple trick but it does require a calculator or access to a cube and cube root calculator such as the one at http://www.csgnetwork.com/cuberootcubecalc.html. Having used the trick several times recently, I thought that others might like to try it also.

The trick entails putting two small seeds 1" inch apart on the dough ball after the dough ball has been placed in the container in which it is to rise. In my case, I use two poppy seeds. They are small, black (for contrast), uniform in size, and will stick to the dough. Larger seeds can be used, or something similar, but the seeds should be measured on centers. The photo below shows two poppy seeds that I placed on a recent dough ball I made.

The technical part of the trick is that as the dough rises, the spacing between the two seeds will increase. When the spacing increases to a bit more than 1 1/4" (it's actually 1.2599"), the dough should have doubled in volume. To get the actual volume expansion, the number 1.2599 is cubed. So, 1.2599 x 1.2599 x 1.2599 = 2, or double. For most people, just using the 1 1/4" measure should be close enough for a doubling. That is what I did with the dough shown in the photo below. I placed the two poppy seeds as close to the middle of the dough ball as possible.

The math also works for other volume expansions. For example, when the spacing between the seeds increases to almost 1 1/2" (the actual number is the cube root of 3, or 1.44225), the volume of the dough should have just about tripled. At 1 1/8", the dough expansion is 1.125 x 1.125 x 1.125 = 1.42. In some recent dough balls I made, I tracked the volume expansion of the dough balls over time by watching the increase in spacing of the two poppy seeds and cubing the spacing to get the volume expansion numbers.

I understand that there are some limitations to using the trick described above. For example, it perhaps won't work properly if the dough expands and then recedes or collapses because of overfermentation or some other problem. It may also not work if the gluten network is compromised in some way (e.g., the gluten is attacked by enzymes over a long period of fermentation), or if the dough is overly restricted by its storage container. The trick will work for both room-temperature fermented doughs and cold fermented doughs so long as the dough balls are not overfermented or have compromised gluten structures or other biochemical problems. I can't say that the trick is 100% accurate, but it will produce results that are good approximations for our purposes. I used the method for same-day doughs and for a two-day dough with very good results. I haven't gone beyond two days so I can't say how well the method works over longer periods of time.

I might add that there is no particular magic to using 1" for spacing purposes. One can use 1 cm. just as well and the math still works. 

Peter

Hi, I have a few follow up questions.   I should put the seeds 1" apart, and I will know it doubles when they are 1 1/4 inch apart - so essentially 1/4 inch further apart since they start at 1" apart?   

Once the dough doubles, what would my next step be?   To make it?   To put it in the fridge?

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Offline Pete-zza

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Re: Simple Dough Rising Measurement Trick
« Reply #25 on: September 28, 2017, 11:34:06 AM »
Holly,

Usually the dough is ready to use when it doubles so long as it is warm enough to easily open up to form the skin to make the pizza. But there may be times when the dough can be placed in the refrigerator for holding purposes.

If Norma sees this post, she might be able to better answer your questions since she is the member who appears to be using the poppy seed method more than any other member. She may have more than one way of using the poppy seeds.

Since you sent me a PM on this matter, I have responded to the questions you raised in the PM in greater detail.

Peter

Offline norma427

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Re: Simple Dough Rising Measurement Trick
« Reply #26 on: September 28, 2017, 06:07:28 PM »
Hi, I have a few follow up questions.   I should put the seeds 1" apart, and I will know it doubles when they are 1 1/4 inch apart - so essentially 1/4 inch further apart since they start at 1" apart?   

Once the dough doubles, what would my next step be?   To make it?   To put it in the fridge?

Holly,

I have used the “poppy seed trick” on a lot of dough balls and find it works good.  Yes, the poppy seeds should be 1” apart and you will then know that it doubles when they are 1 ¼” part. 

If you want to use the dough balls when the poppy seeds are 1¼” apart it should be fermented enough.  You need a warm-up time then for the dough balls, if it was stored and fermenting in your fridge.

The poppy seeds spacings when they are more than 1¼” apart still can make a good pizza. 

Peter is right that there may be times that the dough can be held in the fridge for longer. 

Norma

Offline holly821

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Re: Simple Dough Rising Measurement Trick
« Reply #27 on: September 28, 2017, 09:49:32 PM »
Thank you!!  I'm going to go get some poppy seeds.  I am fermenting in my fridge ... Between reading here and PMQ  youtube video's, I am picking up a lot of tips!   I'm just trying to make good pizza at home ... I've had a lot of trial and error.

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