Author Topic: why my pie looks more a bread than a pizza?  (Read 1125 times)

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Offline minn

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Re: why my pie looks more a bread than a pizza?
« Reply #25 on: August 05, 2016, 09:37:42 PM »
Dear Tom
Initially I thought convection oven is similar to air impingement oven. after cross checking the two techniques, I agree with you it's different.

I was considering brush syrup on the cornicione for the purpose, what do you think?

I will try steel plate too, and transferring from screen to the plate for imparting additional crispness I believe could improve the pizza quality significantly. it's great suggestion, thank you so much

Kindest Regards
Minn

Min;
I totally agree with all of the above. You have to realize that Domino's uses an air impingement oven to bake their pizzas in and those ovens are specially profiled to provide the best and fastest bake to THEIR pizzas, so it's not even a close call to baking in a home type oven of any kind so we find that some formula modifications as well as baking modifications are necessary to produce the same type of pizza in a home oven.
In addition to the recommendations already made you might want to experiment with baking your pizzas on a stone or steel in a higher rack position to achieve more top heat for more top crust color. Another thing you might try is to brush the edge of the crust with olive oil just before you place the pizza in the oven, the oil on the crust will help to intensify the crust color to some extent. If you find that you are getting too much bottom bake on a stone but getting the top bake you desire you can experiment with placing the pizza on a screen to create an air gap between the dough and the hot stone, this will reduce the bottom crust color/bake. A common "trick" is to then remove the pizza from the screen and place it directly on the stone for about a minute (sometimes less) to impart additional crispness into the bottom crust.
Tom Lehmann/The Dough Doctor

Offline minn

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Re: why my pie looks more a bread than a pizza?
« Reply #26 on: August 05, 2016, 09:41:14 PM »
That hasn't been my experience with sugar. I think it's worth testing.

Dear Craig, you are right, and your point is taken, simply let me do it in a different way, I will brush the sugar syrup on the cornicione to see if it improves a bit.

Kindest Regards
Minn

Offline minn

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Re: why my pie looks more a bread than a pizza?
« Reply #27 on: August 05, 2016, 10:08:18 PM »
The amount of bake-out that the crust receives during baking also has a great influence on toughness, a crust that is dense (small holes in the crumb structure) will not bake out as well as a crust with large holes (open porous crumb structure) so all things being equal it might be said that the more open and porous the crumb structure the better the bake out, the less chewy the finished crust will be and the more crispy it will be too.

This is very insightful, Dear  Tom, I registered a note of this statement.

once a while back, I baked a pizza with 70% hydration, and surprisingly I lost all the chewiness and no crispiness was noted. so, it is due to the large bubbles in the dough being responsible for this;  probably I baked not long enough, and the high level of moisture prevent the development of crispiness.

a new direction to pursue now

Kindest Regards
Minn

Offline The Dough Doctor

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Re: why my pie looks more a bread than a pizza?
« Reply #28 on: August 06, 2016, 12:18:03 AM »
Minn;
I would be reluctant to recommend brushing syrup on the rim of the pizza as it will most likely induce burning/charring. The pizza that you made with 70% absorption had the open crumb structure due to the ease at which the dough expended during the oven spring phase of baking but it was not crispy only because you did not bake it long enough. This may be hard to believe, but you will get a crispier crust by ADDING more water to the dough (just don't add so much so as to result in the dough collapsing) and you will get a tougher, more chewy crust by adding less water. The exception to this is when the dough absorption is reduced to something in the 40's to make a cracker type crust but in this case the dough must be sheeted/rolled very thin and the internal crumb structure is best described as looking something like the cross section of a saltine cracker.
Tom Lehmann/The Dough Doctor

Offline minn

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Re: why my pie looks more a bread than a pizza?
« Reply #29 on: August 06, 2016, 12:20:22 PM »
Dear Tom
well received your suggestion now by brushing olive oil, any other vegetable oil does the same thing as olive oil by the way? olive oil isn't a common oil in China, I can easily get canola oil, sunflower oil, soybean oil, peanut oil, etc

the earlier dough was 64% vs the latest one with 57%。 If I understand correct, the earlier one didn't present the crispiness is due to lack of baking time; while the latest one of 57% hydration should have shown better chewiness, but it is not sufficient, and this is due to the oil I added into the dough. this is how I interpret my pizza performance upon understanding your theory, correct me if anything in-accurate ^^^

Kindest Regards
Minn

Offline Minolta Rokkor

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Re: why my pie looks more a bread than a pizza?
« Reply #30 on: August 08, 2016, 08:51:28 PM »
It's so kind of you, Dear Minolta. my oven is convection oven, maximum temperature could reach 300 C ( 575F ), and using a thick steel is definitely a smart way of improving thermo efficiency, currently I use a stone. how thick is the steel plate are you using?


Kindest Regards
Minn

My steel plate is a half inch/ 1/2" thick
It's 16"x16"x1/2" in size.

as a  matter of fact I just set a personal record of 3:05 secs on steel.

Here is my formula

Flour:100
Water:62%
Honey:6%
Butter:6%
IDY:.04%

Let me tell you, the crust was very soft and very moist, trust me on this.

I'll give you some photos of the pizza

I use A36 mild steel.


Offline minn

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Re: why my pie looks more a bread than a pizza?
« Reply #31 on: August 09, 2016, 03:20:54 AM »
I am very jealous  :P  is it chewy? can we do it reducing half of the honey and butter to see if more chewy? Tom Lehmann suggested me to transfer the pie to the steel bake directly to improve crispiness. I haven't tried yet. however, the most exciting thing is to see the out skin of your pie is so perfect as pizza, and the bottom are perfect as well, I really wish could show the similar to my friends here in China.


I'll give you some photos of the pizza

I use A36 mild steel.

Offline Minolta Rokkor

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Re: why my pie looks more a bread than a pizza?
« Reply #32 on: August 09, 2016, 05:38:26 PM »
I am very jealous  :P  is it chewy? can we do it reducing half of the honey and butter to see if more chewy? Tom Lehmann suggested me to transfer the pie to the steel bake directly to improve crispiness. I haven't tried yet. however, the most exciting thing is to see the out skin of your pie is so perfect as pizza, and the bottom are perfect as well, I really wish could show the similar to my friends here in China.

It's not chewy, it's very soft and pillow like.
Reducing the honey and butter will give it more chew. The honey and butter softens things up a lot.